I Hate Dialysis Message Board
Off-Topic => Off-Topic: Talk about anything you want. => Topic started by: Desert Dancer on May 02, 2013, 09:53:52 AM
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He tried to kill himself yesterday. Using my dialysis needles to try to make himself bleed out. Luckily they kept clotting up and he didn't think of the heparin. When he lost enough blood to feel the effects he got scared and called me. It was the longest three miles I've ever driven, not knowing what he had done to himself except for "I've lost some blood", talking with a 911 dispatcher the whole time and begging them to break down the door if they had to.
He also quit his job on Saturday. It was his job - in very large part - that drove him to this.
He's now settled into a behavioral health ward of the hospital and has voluntarily agreed to stay inpatient for a week, though he's already trying to back off from it. I'm not taking him any clothes for that reason. I hope it doesn't come down to me having to commit him involuntarily but I will if I think I have to, though he may not forgive me for it for a good long while.
I have to go clean the bathroom now. It looks like someone was murdered in there and I just wasn't up to doing it at 2:00 AM when I got home.
I am not in a good place right now. The multiple repercussions from this are just too much for me to bear right now and I'm so tired of being strong.
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Oh, Christ! Sweetheart, what a shock, what a nightmare.
I wish I were still in LA, I'd be back there in a nanosecond to hold your hand through this. I wish there were something I could do. You have phenomenal survival instincts my friend, do whatever you have to do to keep Andy where he is and keep yourself as calm as possible.
Do you need someone to talk to? I have a landline and a great rate but I don't know if you'd be charged for me to call you. I could Skype with you, just let me know if that would be of any use. I want to help.
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Oh DD, please give Andy our regards. I so hope that his hospital stay will be helpful.
Do take cariad up on her offer; I'm sure she can be of great assistance!
We are praying for you and Andy.
Please let us know if there is anything we can do at all to help. :grouphug;
I'm so terribly, terribly sorry.
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Desert Dancer, I really feel for both of you. Andy must have been desperate to do this to him self and to you. To-morrow is another day. Sernding my prayers to you.
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Oh, noooooooo! How dreadful. :cuddle;
Dear sweet DD, my heart is aching for you. I wish there were something I could do to ease your pain (and Andy's). He must also be in a very dark place. Please just take one step at a time. and breathe.
Aleta
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Oh no!... Poor Andy's mind must have been in a very dark place... I think you're right... The very best place for him right now is exactly where he is...
Thinking of you... Terrible fright for you....
Love to you both....
Darth...
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Awful! I feel for you both.
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Oh, DD. I'm so sorry. My *huggles* may be ineffectual but right now they're all I can offer you, and I'm sending you (both) oodles of them.
Thinking of you both. Much love.
♥
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:grouphug; :grouphug; :grouphug;
To both you and Andy.
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DD it broke my heart when I read this about Andy. I'm so sorry you have to go through this. Hopefully he will get the help he needs and things will get easier. I will keep you and him first and foremost in my prayers. Take care of yourself and don't let your needs fall to the wayside. I can only imagine how difficult this must be but I am very concerned for your well being right now. Please keep up with your dialysis. Love and hugs, Bill and Patty
P.S. You have my number call if you want to talk. :cuddle; :grouphug;
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I am so sorry to hear. You are both in my thoughts.
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Offering prayers and :cuddle; Im so sorry, how terribly awful for you to go through.. Im so sorry for you both and hope tomorrow brings some light to the situation.. :grouphug;
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What a horrible thing to have to go thru. I feel very badly for both of you and pray that things will get better for both of you soon.
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DD I am so saddened to read this. I'm thinking of you both. I feel quite numb and can only try to imagine what you must be feeling. :grouphug;
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Thank you so much for your replies and support; I can't tell you how much this virtual support network has borne me up.
Andy is a lot calmer now. He has been very angry and agitated since getting to the hospital and has spent the last two days threatening to both leave and do this again. He had agreed to voluntary treatment but then changed his mind. Luckily, he doesn't really have a choice in the matter and I've never been so happy to fall back on the word 'policy' (and you know how much I hate that word). They explained to him that if he doesn't co-operate they will get a court order and do it involuntarily. There is someone in his room with him at all times (which also agitates him, and would me, too) and assured me if he tried to leave they would call security to keep him there. So he's back to doing it voluntarily and they're trying to get him into a smoking facility. I think he'd change his mind again if they stuck him in a non-smoking facility so I'm going to call the social worker to make sure they can secure him a bed. The nicotine patches and gum calmed him considerably, too.
I think he's gotten just enough space now for his head to clear a bit and he was so much better last night than he was yesterday morning. I don't think he really comprehended what he'd done or what kind of state he's in until last night/this morning.
I've let him know you're all thinking of/praying for/pulling for him and he really does appreciate it, as do I. I think I'm rambling now so I'm going to stop here and head over to the hospital. I will try to update as I can.
On another note, I've discovered I can go five days without dialysis though I certainly don't recommend it. Got in a good, long 10-hour treatment last night and some food so I'm feeling much better, too.
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Thank you very much for the update, and I hope you will have the time to issue another at your earliest convenience.
I'm very glad that things are looking up a bit for you both. :cuddle;
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I'm so very glad that you were able to do something to help yourself! I'm sure you feel better after a treatment and some food. Please don't do that again! :cuddle;
You and Andy have been on my mind these past days. I hope that with this help and intervention he (and you) will be able to fully recover from this dreadful episode.
:grouphug; Hugs all around.
Aleta
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Thank God for a bit of good news!....
Long may it continue... As a former smoker, I understand the addiction....
Love to you both....
Darth...
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:grouphug; :grouphug; I don't know how to handle this, I just feel that you already have such a fight to stay healthy, and this has got to be so much on top of that. I wish you both all the best.
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Sorry to hear this DD. Very concerning, and although he is a bit better, he still has a way to go. I pray that you keep healthy while he gets the help he needs. Again, Im so sorry, but hopefully, things will get better. We all love you DD. Know that we are always here for you!
Please keep us updated.
God Bless,
lmunchkin :kickstart;
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:grouphug; all strength , and love to the both of you, and lots of love Cas
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:cuddle;
im sorry to hear this. those places can be a nerve racking experience on either side of it...
thinking of you both
:cuddle;
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DD - How's things? Thinking of you both. :grouphug;
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I'm sending you long arms of supportive embrace.
I hope you are keeping your head above water and will let us know if you need anything.
:cuddle;
I wish there were a big heart emoticon that I could send you. Many hugs. Much concern.
Aleta
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Hi DD...
I was wondering if there's any news... Not just of Andy, but also of yourself... You must be going through the mill right now....
Thinking of, and praying for you...
Love....
Darth...
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DD how are things going? How is Andy doing. These things come to try us at times and frigging try us they do. You will both come through this DD, it may not seem so at the time but we are all thinking and praying for you. You have both got to be strong and positive. I hope you are looking after your self, how is the eating, if you are the same as me when I am stressed I find it hard, but you should try.Please let us know how you both are. Sending you lots of hugs. :flower;
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Yes, DD, while I don't want to intrude, I am also concerned. Please take care of yourself, I'm sure 5 days without dialysis was not one of your better ideas! You and Andy have been much on my mind. I hope his treatment is going well, and that you have beenable to get more rest.
:cuddle; to both you and Andy.
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I haven't forgotten you my friend. Still praying for you and Andy. Call if you want to talk. I tried to call the other day but the number wasn't working. I'm hoping that Andy will get well soon. :cuddle;
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More hugs, more strength, more love for the both of you
Remember to take care of yourself,
love, Cas
:grouphug;
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DD, sending this post to let you know that I am thinking of you both. Hoping and praying for you and Andy. :grouphug;
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He lied "seven ways from Sunday" to get out of the last facility and they discharged him last Tuesday after only 72 hours. His experience there and the medication they put him on have worsened the situation and he has been steadily deteriorating since then. As long as he is conscious it is a steady stream of "doing it right the next time" and specificity as to method (he'll "remember the heparin next time"). He spent some time trying to convince me to kill myself along with him "because you promised you would" and became very upset when I told him I will NOT follow him because I am not ready to die. He is simultaneously catatonic and agitated. My mother left on Saturday and I am terrified to leave the house. Unfortunately I don't have a choice - I have to be gone for at least three hours on Tuesday for back-to-back appointments and that's just about how long I was gone on the 1st when this all happened. He refuses to make eye contact. He's refusing to eat. He won't leave the house. He broke down and sobbed to my mother because nothing could convince him she hadn't come swooping in to take me away, even though we made the decision together for her to come so he wouldn't have to worry about me dialyzing alone. He thinks this is forever and can't be convinced his depression is lying to him.
I just got back from filing a petition for involuntary commitment. If it is accepted the police will be here in a few hours to pick him up. He is still sleeping as of now. He's generally at his best in the mornings and I'm afraid - no, I KNOW - he's going to lie to them like he lied to the last place. If they only hold him for 72 hours this will all be for nothing and he's not going to forgive me in any case. I'd rather have him angry than dead, even if he leaves me over this. I don't know if I should wake him up or not. I'd like him to be awake when they arrive but I've got no legit excuse to wake him and quite frankly don't want to anyway.
Did I mention our wedding anniversary is tomorrow?
I think this is the hardest thing I've ever done. Even deciding to pull Sofia's ventilator was easier than this.
I am sorry I don't have anything better to report.
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Oh DD, I can't imagine the heartbreak.
I hate to ask such an impersonal, ignorant question, but has he received a specific diagnosis? When you talk about how he is depressed, do you mean this in a clinical, diagnostic way or just by way of a lack of any other term?
I hope all goes well today. I know it will be hard, and I know he will will be angry. I suspect he may say all sorts of hateful things, and if he does, be strong in the knowledge that your actions are fuelled by love.
I am so sorry this is happening to you. I am thankful that you have told us what is happening. I reckon that is not always easy for you, being the private person that you are. We want to be supportive while at the same time avoid being intrusive. Forgive us if we come off as the latter. We just love you and want to help.
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I hate to ask such an impersonal, ignorant question, but has he received a specific diagnosis? When you talk about how he is depressed, do you mean this in a clinical, diagnostic way or just by way of a lack of any other term?
I hope all goes well today. I know it will be hard, and I know he will will be angry. I suspect he may say all sorts of hateful things, and if he does, be strong in the knowledge that your actions are fuelled by love.
I am so sorry this is happening to you. I am thankful that you have told us what is happening. I reckon that is not always easy for you, being the private person that you are. We want to be supportive while at the same time avoid being intrusive. Forgive us if we come off as the latter. We just love you and want to help.
The doc who discharged him from the last place diagnosed him with major depressive disorder and chronic anxiety. He prescribed Effexor, which is an anti-depressant (whose main side effect is suicidal thoughts and it makes things much worse before it makes them better); Seroquel (an anti-psychotic used primarily for schizophrenia and bipolar) for sleep, though he stopped taking that on Wednesday because it didn't help him sleep; and Vistiril, an anti-anxiety drug that only seems to make him worse.
This is going to be very, very bad. He's still asleep and I can't get through to the facility where I filed the petition (they told me to call in an hour but they're not answering the phone) and there's just this pit of dread in the center of my stomach waiting for the cops to show up.
I know you care and I don't consider your love, support and questions intrusive at all. Believe me, I have reached out in ways I never thought possible for me, to damn near everyone I've ever known. This is the first time in my life I've ever needed to do that and it is hard. But I need all the brainpower I can draw on to try and help Andy and there's just no way in hell I can manage this on my own. Hard to admit. But I would crawl naked over ground glass to make him well again and protect him and involuntary commitment was the only option I had left. I need a network in place just in case I break, though I'm honestly not sure I'm even able to do that.
Update: he's now awake.
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Yes, I have heard of those drugs making things worse before they make things better.
We will all be thinking of you and Andy on this very, very difficult day. Just know that we are all in your corner, and if it is possible for keystrokes on a computer to send you support, then you'll have plenty! If there is anything at all we can do to help in a more practical way than by just banging away on a laptop, name it.
Good luck today. :grouphug;
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I am channeling all of my positive energy toward you during this scary episode, dear friend.
For whatever it's worth, that's what I'm doing. :grouphug;
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The police showed up and took him away 15 minutes ago. Andy was too shocked, I think, to be angry and the police let him smoke a cigarette and brush his teeth before they took him. He went quietly and without anger - when he opened the door and saw me talking to the police I told him what I did - but he told me not to pack anything because he's not staying.
As the petitioner I will get to have my say in front of the judge who will decide to order inpatient treatment (hopefully). I can only hope they realize that patients lie in this situation and I indicated as much on the petition because he did lie at the last place. I also hope they will realize that a spouse of 16 years is a resource they need to use to get to the truth. The doc and social worker at the last place never called me or returned my calls, and Andy had already signed a release of information to me so it wasn't that.
He has no memory of asking me to kill myself. I asked him if he didn't think the memory loss was a symptom that something is very, very wrong. Of course he's not rational enough to answer that question.
Please keep all your fingers and toes crossed. I did everything in my power to get him admitted to a different facility this time; I pray it is better and the docs are a little swifter on the uptake and not taken in by manipulation. They've told me to call back in two hours to speak to his counselor about him signing a release so they can talk to me; I guess that means I should start calling now because it took me two hours of calling this morning before anyone picked up the phone. They're insanely busy over there (absolutely no pun intended).
I am so scared I can't even tell you. I did everything I could. I can't protect him here.
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Im really sorry all of this is happening.
some medications not only take a while to work, but some may not be right for him at all. i know a few that actually made me much worse and it was like i was in a trance. i was there, doing things, not remembering doing them, or having a dream like memory of it.
I do have a question, im not assuming anything, but this is reminding me of a situation ive seen, so im sorry if its offensive... but someone i know smoked that legal herb stuff, it goes by many different names, but can be found in a smoke shop, and he completely lost it. I know of another person who also lost his mind when smoking that crap, so if thats a possibility, you might look into it.
:cuddle;
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Thank you for letting us know. I have no doubt that when you need to speak to that judge, the right words will come. Let me know if you want help organizing your argument, or if you're comfortable, post it here for feedback. For now, he's not your responsibility, so it's time to attend to yourself, especially the basics: food, dialysis, sleep.
Oh, by the way.... well done, missus.
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Bravo to you DD. I'm sure when Andy is thinking clearly again he will see the love it took for you to do what you've had to do. Sometimes it's so hard to understand why life puts such hurdles in front of us.
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I just called and spoke to Andy's former boss (he quit his job 4 days before he attempted suicide). The company is refusing to pay out his 80 hours of vacation time because he didn't give 2 weeks' notice and we needed that money to pay for COBRA coverage. Thankfully he agreed to sit and talk with me privately without even asking the reason.
So I'm going to go over there tomorrow at 10:00 AM to attach my lips to his buttocks and beg him to get those hours paid out. Though I won't say this to him, it IS the very least they can do for Andy.
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Since you are going there, you might ask his boss if he's noticed anything, gathering as much info for the judge you can. When my brother (the guy who smoked that crap) lost it, his boss actually is the one that got him into treatment! He was the first to notice a problem, so his boss may also have some insight for you. And possibly, maybe even help your case to help Andy.
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Sending you strength and hope and all my best thoughts. I really think you're doing the only thing that you can DD and as difficult as it is you must protect both of you. :grouphug;
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Since you are going there, you might ask his boss if he's noticed anything, gathering as much info for the judge you can. When my brother (the guy who smoked that crap) lost it, his boss actually is the one that got him into treatment! He was the first to notice a problem, so his boss may also have some insight for you. And possibly, maybe even help your case to help Andy.
That is a fantastic idea, GLM, and one that hadn't occurred to me. D'oh! You'd think if they'd noticed something that they'd have stopped putting so much pressure on him, but you just don't know. I will make sure I ask him if HE noticed anything and if he's willing to be a witness for me. I mean, Andy did beg his boss to let him step down from his position a couple-three months ago and his boss talked him into staying in it. That right there shows how desperate he was to get out of that situation. I wish I'd gone to talk to his boss at that time but you know... Mommy going behind his back to fight his battles for him at work, not cool.
He doesn't smoke that 'legal weed' crap; good lord, who the hell knows what's in that stuff? But he does have his Medical Marijuana card (for chronic pain) so he does smoke the real thing, just in the evenings like someone else would have a glass of wine to unwind. I don't think it's working the way it used to because of the new medications he's on and does, in fact, seem to make him worse if he has more than one hit. It might be something else to mention to the facility; I did mention it at the hospital last time but I don't think the info got relayed.
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Wow! More hopeful news and more fearlessness from the one and only Desert Dancer. If he could have given 2 weeks notice, he would have, but that was *not* Andy they were seeing at the end, as you know better than anyone. Say whatever you need to, promise whatever you need to, break those promises if that is what must be done in the end.
The boss may have a heart after all. I do give him credit for agreeing to this meeting so easily. Many would be monsters about it just to prove that they could. If he needs to see you grovel, give him his show, then come here so we can tell you what a spectacularly brave individual you are.
Get your game face on, girl. I know you can do this. :boxing;
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Oh, yes, great thinking, glm! :2thumbsup;
Here is a bit of psychology that has stuck with me since my classes at uni: there are two techniques for asking for favors that are based in psychological theory, (and they have great titles).
1. "Foot in door" technique. This is when you ask a small favor of someone, and weirdly when we start agreeing to favors, we feel obligated to keep agreeing to more and more, and before you know it, you've promised to put an extension on someone's house or something. I think this is where you are going with the boss, you've asked him to meet, now draw a bit more and a bit more out of him.
2. "Door in face" technique. This is when you ask a huge favor of someone - could you direct my kid's school play? for example. Then when the person says no, you ask a smaller favor. OK, I understand. Could I at least ask you to sell refreshments at the performances? People are so relieved that they can appease their own guilt by at least doing *something* for you that they agree to things that they may have said no to initially.
Sorry, this just sparked that memory and I thought it might be a wee bit helpful to consider how most people's minds work.
Good luck! Let us know how the conversation goes!
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I'm so glad Andy went peacefully. Oh, dear, dear DD, I know you have your work cut out for you, but I am very, very relieved that you have at least a bit of breathing space. I agree with talking with his boss about any signs of stress that Andy was showing at work. I might even bring up the date...like "since he requested to step down from the last project," or something like that.
I'm sending scads of strength to you. :cuddle; :cuddle; :cuddle;
Aleta
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I just spoke to Andy's counselor and relayed every last bit of observation I could think of. He was so incredibly receptive and interested in what I had to say! He said he would relay all the information to the doctor and that both he and the doctor would be speaking with Andy very shortly.
I also asked him about Andy signing a release so they can give me information and mentioned Andy might be too angry at me to sign one. Luckily, he told me that since I am the petitioner I pretty much automatically have the right to information about what is going on with him and can call anytime. The counselor said he would call me back later after they had both talked to Andy since it's so incredibly difficult to get through to that facility on the phone.
I flat out told him Andy *IS* going to lie to them and begged them to keep him. We'll see what happens; already it's an improvement over the last place.
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OK, good. These are steps in the right direction!
I'm very relieved to hear that you are in line to have access to all pertinent information. You don't want to have THAT kind of fight on your hands.
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Fingers crossed, DD....
Hope it goes better for you... You could (and probably should) write a book about your experiences...
Thinking of, and praying for you....
Darth...
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I feel some of the relief that you must be feeling at the thought that real help might be at hand. Please know how many of us are thinking of you and standing with you as you negotiate this nightmarish time. :cuddle;
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oh lord have mercy on you !!!!!!!! This is unbearable and your having to bear it.. :grouphug; I hope all our arms wrapped around you is helping. Bless your poor broken heart!! ANd please dont ignore your own D now too. That could put you even more of a struggle... sending love dear lady... and strength... heavens above!!
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As predicted, expected and dreaded, I just received a phone call from Andy. He's absolutely furious at me and told me I might as well just pack up his shit in his van right now because he's not ever coming back to me again. He says it looks like they might not even let him out and this is all my fault for putting him in a "f'ing psycho ward" and he doesn't ever want to see my face again.
I knew with certainty this would happen. It's very likely he'll follow through because that's what he does: when something or someone wounds him he turns his back and never, ever speaks of them again. He was never given any tools growing up to set emotional boundaries for himself but he was taught very well how to hold a grudge. His father and his uncle (who both lived in the same town) did not speak to one another for FORTY YEARS. The reason? Some offhand comment his uncle's wife made at someone's funeral. Forty years.
I just told him I would rather have him angry at me than dead. He said, "Well, you've got it" and hung up on me. So now my assumption has to be that I've lost him no matter what and plan accordingly, though I won't actually execute it until I know for certain he won't come back to me.
My plans involve getting my ass to Seattle somehow so I can hook up with Northwest Kidney Center and dialyze alone. So if any of you Seattle/Tacoma area IHDers have any suggestions on how - or even whether - someone who gets disability and nothing else can make it in Seattle and which are the parts of town to avoid when looking at apartments, please feel free to chime in.
I hope it doesn't actually come down to that but that's the chance I took. I haven't given up hope yet but I have to be ready. I've also already applied online for every single type of assistance I think I'm even remotely eligible for in this state.
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You are quite wise to make plans for a life without Andy. I really hope it does not come to that, but it's still a smart move.
We all know that illness can and does affect behaviour, so I am hoping that once Andy is better, his outlook will change.
This is just a horrifying story, DD. I know nothing about the Seattle area, but other IHDers do, and I'm hoping they can offer some suggestions.
Does anyone have any idea for how long Andy will need treatment? I know that's an impossible question to answer; I'm just wondering what kind of timeline you are looking at, especially since you are having to think about relocating.
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Everything in me sends you support!! And just some thoughts........ This IS an illness hes going through. Words he speaks 'may' be different from those he speaks in his 'right' mind... Hes in a different 'place' and may not even remember things he's said (as you have already seen). I went through some things with my hubby long ago that were thought to 'be the real thing' only to finally understand it was the drug talking. I wish you well in how it all comes to pass for you. God give you strength :grouphug;
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Darling, this isn't going to be a polite reply, but I cannot censor myself after following all you've been through.
I read this to Gwyn and then shouted "She saved your life, you f---ing a-hole!"
So sorry. :(
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You got that right Gwyn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Even though I knew this was coming it has just pushed me right up to the edge; I can't stop shaking. Really bizarre.
I talked to my oldest friend from NJ a little while ago and she mentioned an organization called NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness). It sounded familiar and sure enough, it's one of the resources listed on the back of the 'Involuntary Petitioning Process' brochure. Turns out they have meetings, meetings for family members. She also told me they are just chock full of resources. I'm going to call them shortly and see if they are having any meetings. If not, I may just get myself to an Al-Anon meeting instead.
Seems like every time I cast my net a little wider in search of support, I always get at least one tidbit like this that helps. Thank you all so much for your support. I don't think you'll ever have any idea of the profound impact you've all had on me, and how much your kind words bear me up and keep me going. It's something I can never repay, not even over several lifetimes.
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That's a really good idea, DD. As much as we here on IHD want to help, what you need now is more practical, immediate and personal help from others who have more experience with mental illness and what it does to families. I wish you all the luck in the world, and if you could continue to give us updates, that would be much appreciated. We are all eager to hear how you and Andy are doing.
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Just got a call back from Andy's counselor with an update.
After evaluating Andy they have decided he needs to be transferred to longer-term care for further stabilization. How long they will keep him at the new facility I can't say; could be a few days or a few weeks.
I asked the counselor what his impressions were when he spoke to Andy. He said he was not the one to actually talk to him today, but that the social worker who did talk to him found my statements to be accurate, to wit: they picked up on his manipulations and "putting on a show" (the counselor quoting my own words back at me). I shouted to everyone who would listen and wrote in the petition itself that he had lied, he would lie, he would put on a show and say whatever they wanted to hear in order to get out and that he is incredibly intelligent.
They listened to me. And they picked up on it. :bow;
Now I simply need to hope the new facility is as swift on the uptake and as willing to listen to me. Reviews don't look hopeful. I am going to a NAMI (National Alliance of Mental Illness) peer group tomorrow so hopefully there will be others there who can guide me in the specifics of this terrible disease and the appalling system I'm trying to work within.
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It sounds like you have him in the right facility now. Praying for you and Andy incessantly.
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I am so sorry for the oh-so-incessant updates but I'm right on the edge myself now and I just don't know what else to do.
I got another call from Andy. I called him 'Sweetie' and he said "No more of that sweetie bullshit, that's done. You have destroyed everything we had" and hung up on me. He was angry because I told them he promised to remember the heparin 'next time'. He has no memory of that conversation. He has no memory of most or all of the things I wrote on the petition. I guess he thinks I just up and decided to put him away on a whim.
The uncontrollable whole-body shaking started again after that conversation. I took it as a cue that I am very, very close to breaking. The fleeting thought of, "oh, hell, just bleed out yourself and be done with the whole thing" pretty well confirmed that. No worries, please, I did not invite the thought, dwell on it or otherwise allow it to take hold in any way. But there it was.
So I just spent an hour on the crisis/prevention hotline sobbing my heart out to one of their wonderful counselors, but I don't know what I'm going to do tonight except focus on trying to get on that f*cking machine. As if I don't have enough going on already. That f&cking machine.
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DD, I cannot even fathom what you are going through, the strength you have summoned form within and the stress it is having on you.
But I do have to urge you to hang on, keep using all those resources, keeping holding yourself together, keep putting that foot in front of the other....
And one important thing that I want you to think about. Those phone calls from Andy? You have said how manipulative he can be.... please consider that he is deliberately manipulating YOU!
You are visibly shaken after each one. That is natural considering what you are going through, but think about that extra level.... I just want you to have some extra fortitude to help you deal with this.
:cuddle; :cuddle;
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I am so sorry for the oh-so-incessant updates but I'm right on the edge myself now and I just don't know what else to do.
Please, oh please do not EVER apologize for the updates. We have specifically asked you to update us.
So I just spent an hour on the crisis/prevention hotline sobbing my heart out to one of their wonderful counselors, but I don't know what I'm going to do tonight except focus on trying to get on that f*cking machine. As if I don't have enough going on already. That f&cking machine.
Did you feel better after talking to the counselor?
Honestly, I don't think that now is the time to be thinking much past tomorrow. I know it is a cliche, but perhaps it really applies to your current situation...one step at a time, one day at a time.
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Hey DD - I live in the Seattle area. I believe they also allow home alone HHD at the center I went to, Puget Sound Kidney Centers. Seattle is expensive to live in. However, NWKC is throughout King County, which is the county Seattle is in. PSKC is in the county north of King county. I hope it doesn't have to come to this, but if it does, I think moving here is the smart thing to do.
Another good resource is our very own Bill Peckham, of course.
I am thinking of you as you go through this terrible time. I honestly don't know what I would do if I were in that situation. We are already dealt enough with our failed kidneys, so to have to go through more then that just isn't fair.
:grouphug;
KarenInWA
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I just had a thought - both NWKC and PSKC have foundations to help out their patients when in time of need. They may be able to help put down a rental deposit, for example. Help you get situated in a new home. I can check on that for you tomorrow if you'd like.
KarenInWA
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That's really kind of you, Karen. :thumbup;
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And one important thing that I want you to think about. Those phone calls from Andy? You have said how manipulative he can be.... please consider that he is deliberately manipulating YOU!
You are visibly shaken after each one. That is natural considering what you are going through, but think about that extra level.... I just want you to have some extra fortitude to help you deal with this.
You are absolutely right, of course, and it is yet another thought which had not occurred to me. I'm really off my game. It still doesn't make them any less hurtful, but I know you know that already. I didn't take that for your meaning.
I have been where Andy is now, - an involuntary patient under psychiatric care after an attempt to end my life, which was only circumvented by pure chance. I had been suffering severe depression.
That was a long time ago and ultimately I came out of the experience with the tools to not only deal with my depression, but to actively guard against ever going back to that dark place. Years of working at that have given me the ability to maintain a very positive outlook on life.
Henry, there is another member here who can corroborate these next statements if she chooses because she's gotten a good overview of the horror that was my life till I met Andy (and there's been a sprinkling since, as you can see). Here is the Cliff Notes version:
Involuntary psychiatric institutionalization from ages 10 to 18 (continuous)
Five suicide attempts before the age of 19
Anorexia. Molestation. Child Protective Services, called by the neighbor.
An 11-year marriage to an alcoholic, drug-addicted, physically and mentally abusive Opus Dei Catholic who was 22 years my senior. Married him for spite and escape.
Alcoholism. Unspeakable things. Rehab. Recovery.
I have lived in the place Andy is living in now for the better part of 29 years. Where do you think the strength comes from? You know.
And though I know it is not the image I project here, I am probably one of the most sickeningly optimistic people I know. I see hope everywhere. I had to work for that attitude. I won't give it up.
I just had a thought - both NWKC and PSKC have foundations to help out their patients when in time of need. They may be able to help put down a rental deposit, for example. Help you get situated in a new home. I can check on that for you tomorrow if you'd like.
Oh my god, Karen, are you serious? (I know you are.) :bow; I am just speechless (for a change). How wonderful they have such programs. Thank you so, so much for this; it really gives me hope.
MooseMom, I really did feel better - or at least calmer - after talking to the counselor; he was very empathetic and compassionate. I'm surprised he was able to understand a word I said with all the blubbering I was doing in his ear. Unfortunately I won't say I sobbed it out. I think it was just the first of many tears to come.
Now, the little bit of update I can give. First, I have to say that place is impossible to reach via phone. It is a phone tree loop from hell and not one button you press makes a damned bit of difference either way. So when you get someone on the line, you don't let go. Also, you must start calling 2 hours ahead of time if you have to call at a certain time.
So I got his counselor on the line with a list of questions I'd kept through the day (and still managed to think of 2 more immediately upon hanging up).
1) NICOTINE!!! Holy Mother of God, I COMPLETELY forgot to make sure that nicotine replacement was broadcast to everyone within earshot and arranged before he arrived. Major fail. It was the first thing I asked and it was the last thing I said before he got off the phone, "Please make sure it is offered to him!" He assured me he would go ask Andy immediately if he'd been offered the patch. It explains at least a fraction of the hostility.
2) I asked if they could transfer him to another facility other than the one they're transferring him into. The answer is yes... but only if he's voluntary. The facility where they are placing him specializes in involuntary commitments, which most certainly means the worst of the worst and I shudder to think what might await him. These are assumptions, of course, based merely on the particular niche they fill. The reason I asked in the first place is because I'd already thoroughly researched a different facility, and the phone journey that led him to where he is actually began with that facility.
3) I made him aware that Andy doesn't have any memories of ANY of the events I described in the petition. None. Now, this could be manipulation on his part but there's one reason I think it isn't: when he was in the medical hospital - the first two days after his attempt - he was in a much better and clearer space than he is now. At that time he broke down and cried and told me he had no memory of the attempt but one. Doesn't remember getting out the needles. Doesn't remember how he got into the bathroom. He only remembers that he watched the sharps as he drove them in - a dozen sites - and didn't feel any pain. He remembers thinking how strange that was.
4) I've already gotten the number of the new facility and will try to call ahead and introduce myself, ask some general questions. I need to be certain that his direct care providers hear directly from me; when the first transfer (on the 3rd) took place, not everything got transferred to the new facility and things were missed. Don't ask me what things just now, I only have a vague memory of "that didn't come over from Banner" in response to some question I asked.
5) I have found a peer group meeting of NAMI (National Alliance for Mental Illness) tomorrow from 2:00 to 3:30, so I'm going to make sure that meeting's still running and head over there where I belong. Hopefully I'll luck into a good meeting like I did with my first Al-Anon and AA meetings.
6) After going to his job tomorrow at 10:00 AM to kiss his boss's fanny, I intend to head over to the bank and withdraw as much as I can, leaving enough to cover the bills that are still outstanding. I'm going to open an account in my name only at the same branch. I'm certain if he tries anything of that nature he'll think I took it to some other institution so he'd be sure not to find it, so it makes sense to me to just leave it where it is, but in an account he can't access. 'We' need our finances protected and 'I' need the finances protected no matter which way this goes, so it seems to me like a necessary step. My ex cleared out our account when I left him, and I have a longtime friend who is extremely bipolar (read: you can't bullsh!t a bullsh!tter) giving me some excellent advice. His opinion seems to be that Andy IS deliberately trying to drive me away so he can point to everything he's "lost" and justify his next attempt. I'd felt as much and he confirmed it. He suggested that Andy's next step could very well be to clear out the account and use it to self-medicate (drinking again), gambling or anything else. That it is - at least in bipolar world - very common to deliberately burn all your bridges so you can claim abandonment and justification. Thus let it be written, thus let it be done. (I always hear that in Yul Brenner's voice.)
7) I am utterly and thoroughly exhausted and it just hit me like a brick wall. It can never have the decency to just sneak up on me once in a while. I have GOT to get on the machine tonight (fourth day and will NOT go to a fifth again) and I'm not even quite finished with set up yet. I've got to get in there and concentrate because I've already made idiotic, air-headed mistakes tonight. Don't worry... I know that emotional upset ALWAYS results in me making dumb beginner's mistakes and I hit on a method to eliminate that just this very evening (other than just double-checking everything 8,00030).
When my mom came out last week she got to see me set up, cannulate, the whole works. I jokingly said to her that she was going to be my dry run, the first person to get a preview of the educational videos I'd love to record some day and post on YouTube. And I did, in fact, end up doing a running educational monologue the entire time - explaining exactly what I was doing and why, just as I would to anyone else who had never seen a dialysis machine work in their whole lives.
So the strategy I hit upon? Do the running monologue with myself. Pretend I have a newbie audience looking on (I usually pretend I have a team of Swedish efficiency experts watching me). Teach while you do, and any mistakes will be revealed and avoided immediately. It worked. I only have to run a little bit of saline through the lines for the second prime and still need to do my water tests and draw up my syringes.
So I must go. I've been charging my laptop all evening so I can still reach friends if I can't sleep and need to talk. At some point I must remember to eat; my dry weight has dropped at least 4 kilos and I haven't actually gone low enough to find my dry weight yet. Who the hell can remember something like that at a time like this?
I leave you with words from Winston Churchill: "If you're going through hell, KEEP GOING."
I do hope I made at least a little bit of sense.
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DD, I'm thinking of and praying for you and Andy...
He's a really sick and delusional man right now....
Hope things go back on track soon...
And if by chance, this does signal the end of your relationship, I hope you can get back on an even keel very soon... Probably sounds heartless, but you were a strong, capable woman long before you met Andy, and you can certainly can be again... He is not the be all and end all, despite what he believes, and would like you to believe... And a life without, or even at a distance from Andy might be a good thing for you....
God bless...
Darth...
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:grouphug; :grouphug; :grouphug;
All I can say is that I admire your fortitude and focus. Please lean on us as much as you need to.
You are in my heart.
Aleta
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Henry P, please forgive my thoughtlessness in not expressing any gratitude to you in my last reply. I was lying here and it popped into my head that I had just recited personal history back at you (purely by way of showing understanding, not tit-for-tat) and had utterly forgotten to thank you for your words and the courage it took to share them. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Darth, I have to admit your words cut very, very close to the bone. I suppose they wouldn't do that if I didn't recognize some truth there. I have recognized the problem of my extreme emotional entanglement from time to time through the years. But my god, I was co-dependent on my ex -a man I hated even before I married him. I LOVE Andy.
Everyone who sees us together sees it. It comes across in pictures. Neither of us have to say one word about how we feel about one another. And we've had that 13 of the last 16 years we've been together. We can sit in a room together for hours in silence, each perfectly happy and comfortable in the other's presence. We can have entire conversations just using facial expressions and tilts of the head.Now he hasn't looked me in the face in weeks and the few times he has all I see there is agony.
This is a man who drove home on his half-hour lunch EVERY. SINGLE. DAY. when I was down with my back through nearly the entirety of 2011, feeding me by hand and making sure I was situated. He washed my hair in the kitchen sink every other day when I had my permacath in.
This is the man who holds half of my memories, and I half of his. If I lose him half of my life is going to be ripped away, because he remembers different events than I do and/or sees them from a different perspective. I was banking on those memories for our old age.
This is a man who I watched carry two tiny little coffins to two tiny little graves and set them gently down. Don't tell me he is not strong. Because HE got ME through the second one. And I him. But in those first days and months... this has taken me right back to those times in a rather PTSD-esque way. (Not that I know more than surface facts about PTSD and maybe a little more).
I will not give up on him. I know he is in there somewhere. If this does mean the end of my marriage - either way - he will have to leave me. Because I promised him we would grow old together and I would always have his back. I still intend to do that.
I should correct any misconception that Andy has ever thought or implied he is the be-all and end-all. That would have been (is) my ex.
I am so sorry this has turned into another long, rambling missive. But I'm having a really bad night. Today is our wedding anniversary.
I managed to get myself up and running on the machine with no problems. In on the first shot with both, go figure. But even though this is the third time I've done it alone this time is different. This is the first time I don't have anyone to call when I get on the machine. When I come off the machine in the morning, there won't be anyone to call. It really slaps me in the face every time it occurs to me.
I said to my mom last week I was born with the personality I'd need in life. Lying here just now I thought if she were here I'd say, "Mom, I don't want to get dragged back into the mental health system." Then the two thoughts merged and I had a - well, revelation might be a strong word - realization? Every experience I had as a child trapped in that system... those are things you don't ever forget. Do you have any idea how I felt signing that petition knowing? Knowing? Combined with my personality it makes me tailor-made for the situation I find myself in here in middle age.
Or maybe I'm just talking out my :sir ken; Who can say?
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You are a strong woman. Stay strong. And keep posting. I couldn't sleep last night till I got up and checked how things were going with you. :grouphug;
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Your love for Andy is evident in all your posts. Your determination to fight through this situation for and with him comes through loud and clear. You are wise to have a "plan B" in place to care for yourself should the worst come to pass and Andy truly leave you, but I hope that you will not have to implement that plan. Your description of the love and life you and Andy share brought me to tears. My husband and I have had a similar relationship for 37 years, to lose that closeness would be devastating. I hope with every fiber of my being that Andy will come back to you soon, healthy and strong.
I'm glad you were able to get on the machine with no problems. Now if you can just assure us that you are eating regularly as well...
I hope your meeting with Andy's boss goes well this morning.
My words seem weak and trivial, but I hope you can feel what my heart is saying. :cuddle;
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DD, I KNOW you love Andy... You would have just walked away by now if you didn't!... And his words and behavour wouldn't bother you if you didn't!... And I believe he loves you too... He's not in a frame of mind to show that he loves you at the moment... He's in a very dark place...
Trouble is, right now, he's FAR more than you can handle... You've got enough on your own plate trying to keep yourself alive... You love him, but unfortunately, you are not what he needs right now.. He needs professional care... And to keep your sanity, HE's not what YOU need right now...
I REALLY hope it all works out for you... And I hope it works out for Andy... However, YOU are my priority right now... He's in a place of safety, and is being well taken care of and supported, you however are not receiving that professional care and support, and have to take care of yourself....
Thinking of you, and praying for you both...
Love...
Darth...
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Thinking of you today and sending strength to bolster the incredible store that you already possess. :cuddle;
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dear dd, your increadable! and so loved by us and i know your husband too. I want to remind you of where he is right now in his head is not 'him'. You know that, and i truly believe that when hes straightened out, his heart will know better on how to behave and his mind will just need somemore work. Stress, and mi dont do well together... I must admit i have some of these issues myself and i have to be so carful as to how far i can go with stressors before i just have to put my hand up and say STOP.. He didnt stop soon enough and it's going to take more fixen to get him straight. I have found my stopping point, and i'd rather say stop to the world before i go 'over' than be horrified at my embarrassing self after. sending love and comfort to you ...
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Still sending as much strength as possible.
DD, I hope that the Andy you love and who loves you will emerge from this episode. Many hugs. Yes it is hell right now, and might be difficult for some time, but surely there are better times ahead.
Love,
Aleta
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I hope you've had a productive day and are feeling just a little bit more hopeful. :cuddle;
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Thinken about you lots today and hoping your feeling some settled in your heart... Sending love and prayers... jill
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DD, you are really going thru a bad time right now, and we all hope it gets better, one way or the other. When you said Andy had called you, I got the distinct feeling that he is well aware of everything going on now and wants to keep that contact with you. So, maybe this will work out enough to get your marriage back together. You love each other and that is the first giant step. I also just wanted to tell you, I think you did everything just as you should have, so when he starts screaming again, keep in mind how sick he must feel by now. You will be kept on my prayer list and I so hope your life makes a turn for the better soon.
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:cuddle; :cuddle; :cuddle; I hope things improve, so sorry for you both.
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Wondering how it went with the boss and NAMI. Please update when you get the opportunity if you don't mind.
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Just sending hugs.....
:cuddle;
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How have things been going today?
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Any news of Andy, DD???...
And how are YOU doing???...
Darth...
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Sorry to have taken so long with the update, I've just been too tired and hurting to sit at the computer.
Yesterday was a day of limbo. When I spoke to his counselor on Monday night they said he was going to be transferred to the new facility on Tuesday. Tuesday comes, no word from anyone. Every time I could get through I left messages for someone to call me and tell me what the hell was going on. Four messages, to be precise. On the last one I finally got snippy about the lack of communication and had a call within 20 minutes. That call resulted in the information that he was still there because there were no open beds at the other facility but he was next in line. She said when he was transferred someone would give me a call so I would know. Andy did not call all night Monday or all day Tuesday.
He finally called late on Tuesday, mostly to rant and rave about how he didn't belong there, was NOT going to the new facility and CAN'T SMOKE. (He keeps declining the patch even though he knows it works. That's just his pigheadedness working.) He kept vowing that he was walking out as soon as his 72-hour hold was up. I tried to explain it was a different process not involving the 72-hour hold and he didn't have a choice of facility unless he's voluntary, but he didn't want to hear it. I didn't argue the point because, well, if he tries that he's going to find out really quickly whether or not he can leave. Still very angry - especially when I told him I would still make the same decision - but did say "I love you" and "Happy Anniversary", albeit rather sarcastically.
Tuesday is also the day I went to talk to his boss. Well, I thought I was going to talk to his boss. When I got there his boss - instead of taking me into a conference room to talk privately - took me into the HR office. I nearly walked out rather than tell this story to her, because Andy can't stand this woman, has no respect for her - and she knows it. But I figured 'in for a penny, in for a pound' and presented my case anyway. Unfortunately I did need a lot of tissue to do this. They said they couldn't give me an answer on the spot as they needed to discuss it - fair enough - and would call me with an answer by the end of the business day.
Do you think I got a call? I'll give you three guesses and the first two don't count.
Tuesday was a bad day for me. At that point I hadn't slept in five days and hadn't eaten in four. And then I got a text from my friend Lisa: "How about I come over with food and kittens?" Food?! Kittens??!! Are you kidding? She came over with a metric shit-ton of Chinese food and I went into the kitchen to put everything onto plates. When I turned around to put the plates on the table, there stood Lisa with three teeny, tiny black fluffballs in her arms. AAAAHHHHH!!! Her son found them a month ago in an alley; they were so new their eyes weren't open yet and she's been bottle feeding them. So we ate and talked, she held me while I cried, we played with the kitties and watched them play and explore. How did she know those two things and her company were precisely what I needed? Kitten therapy got me through my anniversary.
I ended up not going to the NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness) meeting because it was not safe for me to drive; I was punchy from lack of sleep and looking through my eyes was like looking through dirty eyeglasses. It's probably a good thing, though, because I've since discovered they have meetings specifically for family members only. So I've printed out that list and will hit one of those meetings soon. Might not be a bad idea to hit a few Al-Anon meetings as well; I obviously need a refresher.
Andy called three or four times today. It's difficult to hear him on the phone there because of all the bedlam in the background. This is a very intense emergency lockdown; no semi-private rooms, just wards with 20-some beds in one room. The first call he was still angry and raving about the same things. By the second call the legal advocate had come around to talk to him and told him exactly what I did about the 72-hour hold and how, yes, it is a different process since it was ME who got the court order and not the facility. He will have to wait for the evaluation and hearing at the new facility to find out whether/how long he has to stay. He wasn't very happy about that but since someone other than myself made it clear to him he stopped ranting about it to me.
The third time he called he said it was just to hear my voice and to tell me he loved me. Thank goodness I declined the offer to restrict his phone privileges. He was much calmer and sounded like himself, just frustrated and resigned. He still isn't completely convinced I didn't just put him there for my own amusement, but I made it clear to him that I wasn't kicking back and having a blast here at home like it was some vacation for me. I asked him if he really thought - as much as he knows I love him - that I would put him away from myself for no good reason. As with the issue of how long they can keep him, I don't think he's really going to understand what it's been like for me until he hears it from someone else. When I talked to his mother earlier today, I asked her if she would communicate to him just how frantic and upset I've been. Maybe if he hears it from her he'll be able to put himself in my shoes. He can't seem to do that right now.
The last call came about 8:00 PM this evening (Wednesday). There was absolutely no noise in the background at all. He's in the new facility and OH!!! :bow; it is exactly the kind of facility I'd hoped it would be, exactly the kind of facility I'd thought he was going to the first time. He seemed so much calmer and very much himself. I was not allowed to visit him in the lockdown but I can see him from 2:00 PM to 7:00 PM every day in the new place, so I'll be heading over there tomorrow afternoon.
Oh, and do you think the old facility followed through and called me - the petitioner - to let me know his transfer status? I'll give you one guess this time.
So that's about where everything stands now. After Tuesday night's call and a good meal, I took some Xanax and went into a deep, coma-like sleep. Overslept, actually, and missed both my clinic visit and my PT appointment but I don't care, I needed the sleep. I dialyzed on Monday and I've got the machine ready and waiting for me right now. I'm really anxious to see him in person because although he sounds like himself again I won't be certain until I lay eyes on him. I think tomorrow is going to seem like a very long day till I can get over there.
I really, really think it was the drugs that did this to him last week. I think it was a very bad reaction to the anti-anxiety drug they gave him and a very rough adjustment to the anti-depressant on top of the underlying depression itself. He's still on the same anti-depressant and they changed his anti-anxiety drug to the one that worked for him before. I hope the new facility leaves well enough alone because it seems to me he's stable and maybe the last few days was just the time he needed to acclimate to the anti-depressant.
Now we're just waiting for the hearing. I guess my testimony at the hearing is going to depend on what I see and hear tomorrow when I visit him.
Thank you so much for all your love and concern. I don't know why it always surprises me to receive support when I ask for it. I guess I need to learn to do it more often.
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Good vibes and hugs coming your way. How's things? :grouphug;
Next time I'll check the 'someone has made a post while I was posting' message.
It's so good to hear things are settling down somewhat. More good vibes going your way
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This sounds extremely hopeful, DD. Now that he's in a facility that is not crazy-making itself, he can center himself better.
The only advice I have is that I think I would be very reluctant to cut his time there short even if he is lucid and calm when you see him. Given the come-and-go nature of mental illness, you need to be absolutely sure (to the extent possible) that he is not going to have another break - your health has been jeopardized along with his, and you cannot risk this situation again. If he is not able to fully agree that you did exactly what you had to do, then personally I would ask that they keep him longer on the grounds that any stable person would recognise this in themselves. (Sorta what we talked about with one sign of insanity being that a person believes oneself to be sane.)
Also, please keep in mind what you've told us about his ability to put on a show, yes, I know you know him better than he probably knows himself, but still. I just do not think either one of you can survive another round of this, and at the very least he should be able to directly state that he knows he's ill and needs help.
Oh, and I finally found the info I was looking for on CrazyMeds - it was in the top forum section where only mods can start topics. They seem to right this moment be considering how to open up the site to more people in an effort to keep with the times, and one question they are debating is whether to allow spouses and friends to ask med questions. You might want to head over there and see if you feel comfortable trying to ask them a few questions. Since Andy snapped the first time without being on any meds, I am not so sure that this can be entirely pinned on the drugs. But I don't know.
(Please understand when I use words like 'crazy' and 'snapped' I mean no disrespect. I am fully aware that this is a serious, biological disease, but I am also in a bit of a rush and cannot take the time to be extra-careful. I say this to anyone reading, not just DD.)
Good luck! I want to hear any and all updates that you care to relate to us!
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I am so glad that things are improving. And I want to second Cariad's suggestion to err on the side of having Andy stay longer rather than shorter. It is a matter of life and death. Truly.
A few years back I was going through a rough spot with my dad. He was engaged in some self-destructive behavior and declared to my brother and me (because of our intervention) that he never wanted to see either of us again. I remember the uncontrolled crying and sense of helplessness. But then a very wise, though much younger, colleague said to me, after my stating that it was the worst day of my life, "Really? Then it should be getting better after this."
I offer you the same hope. It will continue to get better. Many hugs.
And one more thing. We ALL seem to recognize that we truly appreciate the chance to help others. Why are we always surprised that others want to help us? I have finally learned after all these years, that our community of friends feel privileged to be able to help out. When we need things, the best thing to do is to simply admit it so our friends can feel loved by giving love back.
:cuddle; :cuddle; :cuddle;
Aleta
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I'm glad to hear that things seem to be looking up on some fronts, the new facility sounds like the answer to all of our prayers. I think Cariad hit the nail on the head with her advice. It will be very tempting to want the facility to let Andy come home if he sounds and acts lucid when you see him. You know him better than he knows himself and I know you want him well, really well, and not just calm and temporarily rational. He knows you love him and when he's better he will know you did this out of love to keep him safe. I'm also happy that you got to hear him say I love you, even if he said it reluctantly. Sometimes your heart just needs to hear the words. I hope your visit goes well.
Kitten therepy and Chinese food sounds pretty soul-soothing to me! It's wonderful to have a friend that knows exactly what will lift your spirit.
Please remember to take care of yourself. You relly must make time to eat and rest. How will you keep up your incredible strengh without nourishment for body and spirit?
:cuddle; :cuddle;
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Awwwwwww, some peace in the storm.. This was so good to read DD and though your not done yet, you sure seem to have gotton a 'pause' . We need those to gather up all the rest and strength for next round what ever it may be. I do so hope for a good 'meetup' and that both of you will rest a bit better. :grouphug; Love your kittens and food!!! what a blessing :)
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Thank God things appear to be on the up...
I'm delighted to hear it... Good that you got some sleep... You needed it....
Hope Andy recovers well, but meanwhile, take care of yourself.....
God bless...
Darth....
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This is the best news I've heard all day, and it's still relatively early so I'm hoping for even better news as the day goes on!
One day at a time...
:cuddle;
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That update was so good to read. it is good you can go and see him and that he sounds like his old self. These drugs have a lot to answer for. I hope that you are looking after your self, be kind to your self. have a good weekend, get some sleep and food down you.
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I just heard about Andy, and wanted to make sure you knew that I am going to be sending lots of healing thoughts in your direction. You are not going through this alone. :grouphug;
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So glad to hear some better news. Take care of yourself too DD
:grouphug; Lots of love and strength ,Cas
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He is BACK!!!! He is HIMSELF!!! He is MY ANDY!!! :yahoo; :cheer: :yahoo;
First off, the facility is 100% clean and 100% professional; it is not filthy and overcrowded. Quite the opposite. I even saw his room; three to a room but clean. All the staff are very friendly and accommodating and it is STRUCTURED. There is a giant weekly schedule on the wall with the times of day in the left column. There is someplace he either can be or must be every hour of the day.
I wanted to be there right at 2:00 PM when visitation started but I had a completely wrong address. One that doesn't even exist. Don't ask me where I got it; I might remember someday. I ended up getting there around 2:25 but by the time I went through security, locking my purse in a locker, taking out and showing security everything I had packed for him, et cetera it was a quarter to three. There were only a few things he couldn't have but I was expecting that. I must admit the earplugs surprised me, though. Apparently the concern is someone swallowing them.
Several long corridors and locked doors later, there he was. THERE HE WAS. For real. I think I squeezed all the breath out of him and just didn't let go, and neither did he. He stood back looking at me and said, "You look beautiful"; I scratched my fingers the wrong way through his 5 o' clock shadow (times five) and said, "Scrufty man". He smiled wide and said he wasn't allowed to shave yet. We went into the day room to sit and I don't think we ever broke eye contact the entire hour-and-a-half I was there (except for kissing and such).
He was only just admitted last night and already has spoken to no fewer than FOUR doctors. Truthfully. In depth. Every one of the doctors sat for nearly an hour apiece listening to Andy tell the whole story. He just discovered from one of the doctors that one of the complaints in the petition was him trying to convince me to follow him. They pointed out to him that I was right to do what I did on that count alone. He was horrified, I mean genuinely horrified when I went to visit and told him it was true. He still has absolutely no memory of anything in the petition. Things like, "feeling like a dwarf star whose light has completely gone out and will go supernova soon".
He apologized profusely and told me - without any kind of question or prompt - that if our positions had been reversed he would have done exactly the same thing, would have had to do the same thing. He understands now he really did have memory loss and - except for the time before he started any drugs - it was probably largely due to the drugs. I told him how waxy and jaundiced he had been, the stumbling gait, confusion and mood swings. All he could do was shake his head and say, "I'm so sorry". Of course, he has nothing to be sorry for because he was not himself and I told him so. He apologized for "ruining our anniversary" and told me to pick out a nice restaurant so we could celebrate when he gets out. He showed me the written out plans he is making for putting together his own welding rig. He's got a list of things he needs and the first thing is 1) Pickup truck (dually). Erm. He said he can start out by pulling his rig behind his work van, though it's not really very professional. So. If Andy wants a truck, by god I'll get him a truck. Somehow.
They have him on the same anti-depressant he was taking here at home (Effexor) but they do intend to double his dose. They are giving him Ativan for anxiety and - just like before, it works like a charm. However, they are not going to be discharging him with Ativan, but something that only needs to be taken twice a day, not four times. And NOT Vistiril. That stuff is poison for him. He always started to deteriorate shortly after taking it.
So tomorrow there will be a get together with Andy, his treatment team and me. We will be formulating a treatment plan and getting things solidified for outpatient follow up. I don't know when tomorrow it will happen but I am waiting on the phone call. My thoughts on the matter are that as much as I want him home, I think he needs to stay in if they are going to be tinkering with his medications. I don't want him discharged until he's completely stabilized on the drugs and dosages he will be taking at home. That will be my recommendation to his team. They seem like they are really on the ball there, though, and I don't think they want to risk a repeat by discharging him too early.
I also heard back from his company. The voice mail started out, "Unfortunately..." so I simply deleted it and hung up. I dug up Andy's employee handbook and there is NO WRITTEN POLICY about having to give 2 weeks' notice to receive your PTO pay (their excuse). There is no law in Arizona saying they have to pay it; it is a matter of company policy and practice. Policy? I've just established there is no such thing, not in the employee handbook he had to sign for. Practice? They paid him out his vacation on August 7th, 2009 the last time he quit. There's your policy and practice, so I will be filing a wage claim with the Department of Labor with supporting documents and statutes. And if he wins his wage claim, I just might send them the letter I started last week and tell them to shove it up the darkest parts of their pasty white as_es.
I do believe that's all I can think of right now. Isn't it enough?!!!!!!! I went on the machine last night, so I'm free to just knock myself the hell out and get a good, long sleep. I think I'll go have some leftover Chinese now.
:bandance; ;D ;D ;D ;D :bandance;
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That is wonderful news!
:yahoo;
And, I have to say that the description you said he said, about "feeling like a dwarf star whose light has completely gone out and will go supernova soon" is actually a great description of how that feels.
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:bandance; :bandance; :bandance;
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Oh DD, I have been following your posts and am so happy you have your Andy back! You deserve so much credit for having the strength to push until you got him the help he needed. Thank goodness he has you! Hang in there and keep pushing until you are satisfied he is healthy enough to come home. Sending you hugs, health and courage! Sleep well.
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Oh DD, I haven't read all of your post yet, but I've seen dancing bananas and "Andy is back", and I just wanted to say YAY!
Now I'll go read the whole post. :clap;
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OK, I'm back, and boy, am I smiling!
I am just speechless with joy!
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Full of thanksgiving :bandance; :bandance; :bandance; and a heart full of joy .... So happy, and your gonna have a wonderful sleep tonight :flower;
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That's the most wonderful news!
Definitely a good idea to stay where he is till his medications are settled in. I am so pleased to read your last posting. :2thumbsup; :2thumbsup; :2thumbsup;
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Oh DD - I admit, I had to grab a tissue while reading your last post - for happy tears. Your story about seeing Andy is so touching. The love you have for each other is HUGE, and I am so glad that Andy has been able to dig out of that horrible dark space and come back to you. May the rest of this time go easily. I know it won't be, but I have faith that he will do what he needs to do to get better and come back home.
:flower;
KarenInWA
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I love when things start to take a turn for the better. :grouphug;
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Absolutely started crying tears of joy! I can't describe how happy I am for you and for Andy. :yahoo;
Good things ahead for you, my dear.
:grouphug;
Aleta
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:cheer: :cheer: :cheer:
DD! I'm so glad to hear that your hubby is so much better. You've really had an awful couple of weeks. :grouphug;
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DD, I'm so happy that the Andy you know and love has come back to you. Your last post made me cry. You both have so much passion and love. Sending you both more *huggles*.
xx
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I needed some good news. This is wonderful.
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:2thumbsup; Very good news!!
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Just got back from seeing Andy again. He had to be talked down again but he is still himself.
Apparently they told him the petition had run out, which it had - MY petition. What they did not tell him is they filed a petition of their own when mine ran out. The legal person basically came by and just dropped the petition and accompanying affidavits into his lap with no warning, which made him feel as though he was being lied to. What he took from that conversation is that they are going to hold him for 180 to 365 days inpatient - NOT the case. He was also upset when he saw the court date because he thought they were going to make him stay until then (May 28th) - ALSO not the case.
Someone from an unaffiliated organization came by to talk to him about whether he qualifies for financial aid based on non-functionality. He isn't non-functional so they told him he would not be eligible for their program. What he took from THAT conversation is that they're all about money and will be kicking him out Monday. Untrue.
As of today they have doubled his dose of Effexor (anti-depressant) and switched him from Ativan to Klonopin, so at this moment he is starting a whole new adjustment phase.
When I got there he was very angry and basically threw the paperwork at me, let me read it, then snatched it back and told me I might as well leave now. What I did instead was go to the nurses' station and ask that they call his social worker to the floor so we could both speak to her; I had just finished having a half-hour conversation with her on the phone right before I arrived and we had discussed all of the above. Right now I think he still needs to hear these things from someone other than myself. So she came and sat down with us for about 40 minutes and explained to Andy that 1) Just because they CAN hold him till the court date doesn't mean they will (and likely won't) 2) They are not a private hospital and insurance is not even a consideration. They have people who have been there for months with no kind of insurance at all. Their only concern is getting him stabilized and well, and 3) He is seeing a different doctor Monday (old one on vacation) and there is absolutely no chance the doctor is going to discharge him the same day he meets him, particularly with the medication changes.
A large part of the problem could be that Andy is misunderstanding and/or jumping to the worst possible conclusions based on what he's being told. I made sure I told the social worker that if they expect him to be truthful to them, they must also be truthful with him and they can't just drop these things into his lap after having just told him something different. However, we both agreed that his reaction was an over-reaction and he is still demonstrating that he is not coping with even minor stressors like this. (Minor in a relative way.)
These are some of the reasons I know he still needs to be there. Thankfully it seems to be a very good quality facility with competent doctors and staff who actually give a damn. Andy had a very long and productive conversation with one of the male nurses last night. At least he is talking, which is probably the most important thing of all.
The conversation with the social worker calmed him considerably. After she left there were a lot of tears on his part and he clung to me very tightly; basically there was just a lot of love flying around.
That's the latest and greatest. I think I managed to get him into the right place. :bow;
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Things are still heading in the right direction. There's bound to be hiccups on the way. Thinking of you both often. :grouphug;
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You both must be exhausted. :cuddle;
Thanks so much for the update!
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It is still a rocky road, but at least it leads in the right direction. :cuddle;
Take care of yourself, too. :grouphug;
Aleta
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Soundin just right as far as going in the right direction. I wouldnt want it to 'seem' that all was well, and they send him home early either, and this will be good for you both. Well, that is if you are resting/sleeping well at night knowing he's carred for. Bo was in the hospital just the other night and it was the first whole night i got to sleep as I worry every time he gets up for ANYTHING, so i would hope that you too are taking this opportunity to get yourself well rested so when he comes home, you've got lots of good honest rest to take on what needs to be done for a while. Bless ya both,, sendin :pray;
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Andy is really doing well. (As of yesterday. Today's been a different story.) He's had a few emotional breakdowns in the last few days (a good thing), and every single thing I had hoped would come to pass, has. Or did.
His roommate is detoxing from meth and is just at the point where he's coming out of detox and all his emotions are beginning to flood back with nothing to stop them. Andy picked up his AA tools again in talking to this poor man and came to the realization he hasn't lost his tools; they've been there all along, he's just let them get rusty. In being of service (12th step) to his roommate he has reawakened himself and now knows he can do this since he's already done it once before. Best of all, he doesn't have to acquire his tools from scratch because he's already got them. Big advantage.
He also - as I had hoped he would - looked around him and realized what a stark choice lay before him. He sees all the poor souls around him who have it much, much worse than he does. No visitors, profoundly serious mental illness and nothing except the clothes on their backs. Perspective, regained.
He's also come to the conclusion things must change; it is time to put aside the introvert and the extreme need for privacy and to start reaching out to other people. If *I* can do it, I know he can, and he recognizes he has been practicing the definition of insanity (doing the same things over and over but expecting a different result).
All of these realizations came pouring out of him yesterday with absolutely no questioning or prompting by me. He's quite open to returning to AA meetings and getting himself a sponsor again, or a least a male friend he can talk to. We both recognize the feedback loop he and I are caught in is unhealthy and we both need some outside friends/perspective. It's just been he and I for the last 16 years.
After yesterday's visit I know he is going to be okay. I still want them to keep him for at least the better part of next week just to be safe; they only just tweaked his medication on Thursday or Friday and I don't want a repeat where they cut him loose before he's stabilized. They seem to be very observant and cautious there, though, and I think it's unlikely they'll discharge him too soon.
All the 'fight or flight' hormones just drained away from me yesterday after I left the hospital and I finally relaxed. Well, collapsed might be a better word. I don't recommend living on adrenalin and nothing else.
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All that was yesterday. Now to today (the 19th): he's back to being angry, agitated and threatening to kill himself again. Even called his mother to tell her his plans; obviously this upset her no end. Swears if things don't start to change he's going to "fake his way out like he did in the other place and then it's sayonara to everything. And this time I know exactly what I'm saying". Naturally I relayed this message directly to the nurse who let me out of the ward (Andy asked me to leave after only five minutes today), who promised me it would be documented immediately. He sees a new doctor tomorrow.
WTF is going on? What in the hell changed between yesterday and today? Nothing. Nothing at all. And WTF am I supposed to do? I can't despair because I need to think rationally and plan, but hope is starting to look a little stupid, too. Should I just plan on being lonely the rest of my life whether he lives or not? Where in the hell has my husband gone and why won't he come back?
A lot of this is adjustment to the drugs, but a lot of it isn't. I know there's a lot of sh*t he's never dealt with. And what happens when he gets out and decides he doesn't want/need the drugs any more? He's not a child, I can't force the meds down his throat or make him talk to someone.
I can't understand someone throwing away happiness with both hands. How can he have all these realizations one day and then go right back to square one the next? The only good thing I can think of is that, quite frankly, I don't think he has the wherewithal to 'fake' wellness as long as necessary to fool anyone there, particularly when they're watching out for him to 'put on a show'.
I miss my drama-free life. I miss my beloved, my partner. I'm so tired of doing everything right, only to lose in the end anyway. WTF is the point any more? Maybe I'm the one who's delusional. Maybe something really fundamental has changed in him and I'm in denial. But then there he was - himself - yesterday. Do I just live the rest of my life being strung along by the hope I'll catch a glimpse of My Andy from time to time?
I'm so freakin' tired. Sometimes I can still understand the attraction to Death.
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So sorry Andy has had a setback. Please remember it is still very early in his treatment. Give it a little time and realize that he is not himself right now. You have done the very best thing for him and they will figure out the meds, etc. A lot of medications take time to start working. Tomorrow may be a better day! Please take care of yourself, even if it means missing a visit or two. You are an important part of his recovery and he needs you as healthy as possible. Give yourself a break if you need it. You are very strong person! Sending you hugs and prayers that you get your Andy back for good!
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DD, try not to worry... It's just a little setback!... Until they get his meds right, he'll have the odd one!...
He's STILL going in the right direction.... Two steps forward, one step back.... He's getting there....
How are YOU doing????... Andy has huge support in the unit, but I'm seriously concerned about you... You must be exhausted....
Thinking of and praying for you and Andy....
Darth...
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Good lord its hard.. To keep your own sanity, you need to rest, eat, and D..... I have just been through (still goen but better) some very hard stuff myself, and i was to my breaking point when.... hubby went into the hospital, I went home for a change, and i slept the heaviest sleep in weeks!! The next day was once again doable... It is so hard to take care of ourselves i know, but to have strength of mind and body, you need to rejuvenate your own self. Sending love and i pray for strength and rest... :pray;
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DD, Bless you both, you sound like you are on a frigging roller coaster and it wont let you get off. You are a strong person to put up with all of this and you still have your own health to sort out. Please look after yourself. He needs you to be strong for him. Hope to-morrow is a better day.
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They're keeping him another week. Thankfully.
He just called to tell me, and to tell me not to visit anymore until he's discharged. It's just as well, my back could use the break from driving up there and sitting. On the other hand I worry he's just trying to prevent me from passing on to staff what is really going through his head. I've let his mom know - just in case he calls her again - to let me know what he says to her; if it's anything concerning I'll pass it on. She agrees wholeheartedly.
I guess I'll have to trust they know what they're doing there. I don't think there's anything else I can do from out here. Unless...
He's not getting any counseling in there at all. He has spoken to several doctors but just for evals; there aren't any one-on-one counseling sessions there so he feels as though he's at loose ends just waiting to acclimate to the meds. All well and good but he needs to talk, too, in some kind of formal setting.
I'm thinking about calling AA and seeing if someone would be willing to go visit him there. Doesn't have to be a formal 12th step and no, he's not drinking but it's the only thing I can think of to get him someone to talk to. Anybody have any other suggestions?
If I could just catch ONE break I'd be happy. I'd take being out of pain for a little while because that isn't helping AT ALL.
We've never been apart this long. It's very strange and lonely.
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He called and told me I better "make other arrangements" because he won't be home for a long time. Just what "arrangements" he's talking about could be anything. Housing? Dialysis? Money?
He's convinced all the doctors are lying to him. About what, I have no idea.
What if he gets vindictive and clues in my center to what's going on? I wouldn't put it past him in the state of mind he's in. I can't go in-center. There's no way in hell my back could stand it. I can't sit for five minutes on a Pilates ball, let alone 4-5 hours in a dialysis chair. All the progress I made in PT is wiped out because of this.
I know that's in the future, I know, I know. But you know what? I'm pretty freakin' desperate to get out of the space I'm being dragged into at the present. Things have started to take hold in my mind while my back was turned.
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Please take care of yourself, DD! He will get better. The meds will be adjusted until they work. He will lash out in the process, but will come around. From what you have said about your own past, you know where he is coming from. Try to take a step back and focus on you. He is being cared for by many trained professionals. You are the only person taking care of you. I can't even begin to put myself in your shoes, but I can say that I think i would have done exactly what you did for him. You fought until you protected him and got him help, knowing that he would be angry. That is what we do when we love someone unconditionally. Do not lose yourself or your health to his battle with illness. You are a good person and a strong person. He needs your strength right now, and you cannot be strong if you are physically drained and unwell. Be kind to yourself and try to take the time you need for your own health. Wishing you both the best! :grouphug;
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He called and told me I better "make other arrangements" because he won't be home for a long time. Just what "arrangements" he's talking about could be anything. Housing? Dialysis? Money?
He's convinced all the doctors are lying to him. About what, I have no idea.
What if he gets vindictive and clues in my center to what's going on? I wouldn't put it past him in the state of mind he's in. I can't go in-center. There's no way in hell my back could stand it. I can't sit for five minutes on a Pilates ball, let alone 4-5 hours in a dialysis chair. All the progress I made in PT is wiped out because of this.
I know that's in the future, I know, I know. But you know what? I'm pretty freakin' desperate to get out of the space I'm being dragged into at the present. Things have started to take hold in my mind while my back was turned.
Dear DD. Try not to cross those bridges until you get to them. Right now he hasn't told your center that you are dialyzing without a partner. And if he does, there are many kind souls who would be willing to come in with you during your treatment. Don't be afraid to ask for help. Remember, people really do love to help. :cuddle;
Andy's road to recovery may be long and it may be rocky, but it IS the road to recovery.
I'm keeping you in my thoughts.
:grouphug;
Aleta
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DD - Please take care of yourself!
Ask a neighbor to come sit with you. You will be doing all the work, they just need to be there "just in case".
You both are in my thoughts and prayers. :cuddle;
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DD, I've been reading your posts and following all of this and trying to find the words to show my support.
I have a few brief things that I want to be sure I say to you, wish I had more time and wasn't having issues thinking straight this past week. You know how I love my bullet points, so here we go...
1. Damn, girl, you know that man well. If ever the expression "can read him like a book" were appropriate, it's now. Seems to me the real Andy is still in there, but he's being battered by a chemical assault that can take quite a while to sort through. Reminds me of the struggle to get transplant meds straight, only amplified.
2. Please try to stop being the answer to every problem Andy has. You are putting so much pressure on yourself to address every possibility and come up with a contingency plan for every occasion. You are burning your energy every which way when I think it might be best to concentrate your energy on solving whatever problem happens to be right in front of you.
3. I have no idea how I would manage if this were Gwyn, so I say this knowing full well I might not be able to do it, but it would seem you need to stop taking everything (or anything) Andy says to heart. His pendulum is going to swing, your best bet is to be his anchor and refuse to take that ride with him. I would just love bomb him every time he called - "I'm here for you, I'll always be here for you, you need to get well so we can be together again" and ignore the hostility. (Let me reiterate how uncertain I am that I could actually *do* this with Gwyn.) Hope this isn't offensive, but when my 3-year-old was throwing monster tantrums on a daily or more frequent basis, I would just answer everything he said with "I love you, I love you so much." or, if he would say "Leave me alone!" I would say "I'll never leave you." I don't know, sometimes it worked to confuse him which would calm him down, but he was only a toddler. It also gave me a challenge to concentrate on - can I continue to say these things to this boy no matter how irritated I am with him right now? It helped me to tell myself that every time he did not succeed in getting me to answer his anger with my anger, I had won.
4. I hope that you and Andy can continue to reach out and expand your social circles, it seems to be the one positive to come out of this, and I'm all about finding the humor and upside to these circumstances and I think you are, too. Quality social interaction is the answer to so much of what drags us down in life.
I'm sure there was more I wanted to mention, but it's been too long since I told you that I've been thinking about you and am as impressed as ever with how you are carrying yourself.
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i hope everything is alright. :cuddle;
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How's things? I trust no news is good news. :grouphug;
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DD just ( just, hahaha) please stay calm. You can only live one day at a time, so do that. You will make it thru this.
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I'm doing all right. Managing to keep to my dialysis schedule and get food into my body at least once a day. Sleep is another matter. Have been going back to AA meetings simply for the support network; it's better than sitting in the house all night slowly losing my own mind and gives me a wider - and local - circle of people on whom I can depend for help if I need it.
Andy's hearing was yesterday morning. It was difficult to testify right to Andy's face the things I wrote in the petition, knowing he still doesn't remember any of it and they might use my testimony to keep him. While there was a (very) slim chance they could have released him the judge declined to do so and ordered him into further inpatient treatment. Could be just till the end of this week but who really knows? That'll depend on his attitude and cooperation, I suppose, and they can keep him up to six months though I really doubt it will go that far. He has indicated to me an openness and willingness to follow up outpatient with counseling, drugs and 12-step groups. I think they're operating under an abundance of caution and I'm glad of it; I believe in my heart he still needs to be there for a little while, even if it's contributing to his mood. They should be increasing his medication again today so they'll certainly want to observe him for at least a few days.
He's still very obviously depressed and anxious - which is understandable - but he IS himself. Unless he's snowing me too but I very much doubt that because I see him behind his eyes and they are not dull and downcast anymore. There's also been no more talk of 'the next time' or of divorce.
(Update: Andy called me last night and apparently they have added Lithium to the mix as of yesterday evening, after he blew up at the doctor yesterday afternoon. According to him it worked like a miracle and he feels like he's turned 180 degrees in thought and mood - just with the first dose!)
So that's where things stand at the moment. He's none too happy about having to stay and I really can't blame him. He's eager to get home and start counseling since he's receiving none there and Andy doesn't do limbo well at all. He's incredibly patient with people but not with time; I'm just the opposite.
God, do I miss him. I knew I'd be lonely without him but I think I underestimated the depth of the loneliness.
At least I know I CAN do dialysis alone if I have to... been doing it all month. I mean, I've always done it alone but at least Andy was physically in the house then. I didn't realize how different it would feel in practice; however, the more practice I'm getting the more comfortable I am doing it alone. I guess people can acclimate to just about anything.
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Thanks so much for the update. In limbo is a tough place to be. :cuddle;
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DD: There is really nothing that I can say. I just wanted to let you know you both are in my thoughts and prayers. :cuddle;
You are so strong, just take it minute by minute if day by day is too much right now. We're all pulling for you and Andy.
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So glad to hear the update. Yes, limbo is uncomfortable, but it is important to keep the goal in mind. And there will come a time, sooner than you may think, that the waiting is over and Andy is TRULY back to himself.
Many hugs to get you through those lonely times. :grouphug; :grouphug;
Aleta
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Thanks DD for taking the time and trouble to update us... Fingers crossed Andy will continue to make steady progress, and you'll soon have the real man back...
Well done on your physical, and emotional strength... Take care of yourself....
Love....
Darth....
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Thanks so much for updating us. We dont wanna bug, but we all are concerned for you both.. :grouphug; glad your taking care of yourself so when he's better, you'll be ready to carry on :)
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:grouphug; :flower;
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I hope that he continues to improve.
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DD - *hugs* thinking of you during this tough time.. and Andy too of course. None of this is his fault really and I remember you two in Vegas and I find it hard to think how things have changed... depression is so terrible.
:grouphug; :grouphug; :grouphug;
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One day at a time. :cuddle; :cuddle; :cuddle;
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He/I/we are not very well, really. I met with Andy and his entire treatment team yesterday (including his outpatient case manager). They have doubled his lithium and are keeping him another week.
He's still not himself. Now, a lot of that is the drugs and a LOT of it is being imprisoned there. That being said, he's under the impression that he can just let the drugs do all the work. He doesn't intend to change anything or work at anything. He'll have to go to outpatient once a month per the court order (not nearly enough) and has no intention of going to AA meetings or doing anything else to bridge the gap between discharge and the time his benefits kick in for the counseling (about two months). I think the only reason he'll follow up with outpatient at all is that if he doesn't they will drag him back into one of those places and make him inpatient again. Every suggestion I've tried to make has been met with vacant head nodding or - when no one's around - eye rolling.
They have concerns about his non-participation (he goes to some meetings/events but not nearly half the ones they have every day). I've tried to explain to THEM that he and I are far more private than the average person. When everyone was gone I asked him why he wasn't at least going to AA meetings in-house. "I don't want to". Really? "I don't want to"? Really??!! When I was in rehab I deliberately did the polar opposite of what I wanted to do; I figured my thinking and behavior got me into that mess, it wasn't going to get me back out.
Andy never, ever, EVER takes the hard road. When things get rough, he runs away. His sister Josie may have been a raging psychopath but she hit that one right on the head. Why can I never find someone with a strong mind and a strong will? He's just stubborn and that's not the same thing. I'm sick to death of him sabotaging us financially every couple of years because he can't just DO WHAT HAS TO BE DONE or control his need for instant gratification. Why is that so frickin' hard?
I can also tell from his attitude he's still blaming ME for him being there and not himself. He's also back to no eye contact. Oh, and for a little icing on the cake: the doctor told him today he's afraid Andy will abuse me if he goes off his meds. I've never, NEVER expressed that concern to anyone, because it's NOT a concern of mine. Andy thinks it's what I wrote in the petition for commitment but the only thing I put there was I felt a VERY REMOTE possibility of harm to myself simply due to him trying to convince me to go out with him. I DID NOT check the 'danger to others' box, only the 'danger to self' box. So now he's pissed at me for that, too.
I don't think I'm ever going to get him back again. We had this perfect little life together and now he's gone and deliberately blown it up. I don't know what more he thinks he wants. HE doesn't even know what he wants.
Dialysis is fine, except I can't sleep on dialysis nights. Well, I don't sleep at all, really, but on non-dialysis nights at least I can take stuff to knock me out. I can't chance sleeping that deeply while I'm alone; I'm too afraid I'll sleep through an alarm or something. (And it would be just my luck - having had no alarms for months? years? on end - to have just that scenario happen.) My back is in screaming agony because these last five weeks have wiped out all the progress I'd made in PT; I cancelled my remaining sessions because something had to give and I'm only breaking even, if that. If I could just get out of pain it would help me to deal so much better, I think, but nothing seems to work.
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:cuddle; Have no words of wisdom, just wishes and prayers that all this will make a turn around and miracles happen. I know your so tired, and drained and that puts so much more of a hardship on the whole situation, and makes it so much harder to see your way out. I do hope for rest, and sleep to help heal and give you the strength you need keep facing all this head on. Prayers dd, and puttin you in the center of :grouphug;
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So sorry things aren't going well. Please try to take care of yourself! Praying for you and Andy! I don't know what else to say to help. Sending you hugs and healing thoughts. Hope you get some sleep and relief from your pain. Thanks for posting an update. Hang in there! :cuddle;
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Dear DD I so wish I could give you wisdom and wise words. But I'm sending love, and strength vibes over for you and Andy.
Lots of love and strength , Cas
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I keep wanting to rewrite all updates to reflect the outcomes we all want for you and you need for yourself too. I send you my warmest hugs and best wishes . Wish there were more that would help.
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DD, sending you so many *huggles* right now, plus oodles of love. I wish I could offer you more.
:grouphug;
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DD, I so wish that there were something that we could do to actually HELP instead of sending our supportive thoughts. I have been out of internet contact except via cell phone and I was sooooo hoping to read a good update. I am sorry that it isn't so. :embarassed:
Please know that I think of you every day and wish that there were a "happily ever after" ending to this story.
Aleta
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:grouphug; and :pray; :pray; :pray;
lmunchkin :kickstart;
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Ah, DD, I was so hoping for some good news here. Your life has been shattered and you are probably depressed too. Would your Dr. give you some sort of anti-anxiety med so you could relax and maybe get some sleep too???
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Hi, everyone. Sorry I've been so scarce around here lately with the updates; there's been a whole lot going on, more than I can put into words.
Andy was released from the hospital last Friday. As expected and predicted, he has changed nothing. Still sleeping his days away and when he's not, sitting around on his ass looking like someone just ran over his puppy and living on Cocoa Crispies. He is taking his medication and he is going to his outpatient appointments. There's been a tiny bit of progress in the last day... at least he is making plans for the future, even if they're still foolish and unrealistic given our financial circumstances. He does want - and realizes - he needs to work or (as he said a few days ago) "SOMEbody in this house has to get a job".
Need I tell you I had the urge to clock him upside the head with my cast-iron pan when he said that?
More importantly, though, is that I've had another 'light bulb' moment of my own, another 'hitting bottom'. I made a phone call last Tuesday that resulted in a woman showing up at my door with the AA Big Book and a few others last Thursday. When I cracked open the Big Book I began to shake violently and didn't stop until Sunday. I was so close. So very, very close to either drinking or doing something else utterly self-destructive and I didn't even see it. Needless to say, I'm back to attending a minimum of one meeting every day and usually two. I have realized - again - I had my focus in entirely the wrong place.
I cannot believe I allowed myself to get to this point again. I'm gobsmacked that I couldn't see it. So easy to see in others, so hard to see in oneself if you're not doing the things you're supposed to be doing (meetings and 12 Steps with a sponsor). I'm back to Al-Anon as well as AA.
Andy is still refusing to go to meetings himself, though he's got all the signs of being a dry drunk just like me. I have stopped asking him to go, because not only can I not fix his life, it is not my job to do so. I cannot drag him kicking and screaming back into the light, but I can be a light myself who can guide him back out if and when he decides he's ready. I don't know whether or not he will be all right. But I do know now that I'm going to be all right now that I've stopped white-knuckling my way through life and gotten plugged back into a network of support.
I am right where I need to be. Thank you so much to all of you for helping me get through this. I can't even begin to impress upon you all that you've helped to save my life, to keep me going until I was able to have my self-revelation and get back to where I belong. I am still exhausted, angry and depressed but I know if I just keep doing the next right thing I will regain my sanity AND my serenity, no matter what happens. Andy may come back to himself or he may not, but I have begun to rebuild my life FOR MYSELF. If it provides an example to Andy it will just be icing on the cake.
Again, thank you from the bottom of my heart.
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Andy may come back to himself or he may not, but I have begun to rebuild my life FOR MYSELF. If it provides an example to Andy it will just be icing on the cake.
You know, this pretty much says it all. I don't know a better way by which you can help Andy than providing an example of how to take on such an enormous challenge. He is lucky to have you. If he is unable to hear you and to listen to you, maybe he'll be able to WATCH you and to SEE you.
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:thumbup; your so right on and so loved here :grouphug; YOur an amazing inspirational woman..
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Onya, girl! Proud of ya!
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To take care of someone else you must first take care of yourself. How easy it is for us to lose sight of that, and how often we make this mistake! Please continue to take care of yourself. :cuddle;
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:grouphug; :grouphug; :grouphug; :grouphug;
:flower;
So many people holding your hand DD. You are so very strong.
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So, so glad you are getting the support you need! What a strong person you are. Hopefully, Andy will see you doing the right things and decide to follow your example. If not, you must continue to do what you know is right for you. Keep up the good work. :grouphug;
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I've been scarce here myself with limited wifi access, but I am so glad to hear that you have had this personal breakthrough. You are so right, we cannot be responsible for others. It is a monumental job to just be responsible for ourselves.
Sending you support and :cuddle; :cuddle; :cuddle;
Aleta
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So sorry to hear that Andy doesn't seem to want to change at this time BUT
so glad to hear that you are getting help for yourself! Hang in there! Many good thoughts and prayers coming your way.
:2thumbsup; :pray; :grouphug;
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:boxing;
Good girl. Stay strong,and lots of love, Cas
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I hope there are better days ahead for you and soon :cuddle;
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Thinking of you DD and sending you *huggles* ...
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DD, how are things going since you last posted?
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DD, how are things going since you last posted?
Very poorly. He's basically being an utterly self-absorbed prick and blames me entirely for the situation we now find ourselves in. "If you hadn't committed me we wouldn't be broke now." Um, perhaps if you hadn't QUIT YOUR JOB and tried to kill yourself we wouldn't be broke now. Always everybody else's fault, never his own. I just want to tell him to come down off the f%cking cross, we need the wood.
He won't speak to me or make eye contact. What's worse, he got to the bank account before I did; I should have done it while he was still committed so that's my freakin' fault. No, he didn't yank the money out, he just spent it all. I guess he thinks you can pay the electric bill with a band saw and maybe we can eat levels and center finders. His grand plan, apparently, is to put all our living expenses on credit cards. Yeah, brilliant. We did have enough to get by but it's all gone now. He won't be happy until all his (unfounded) paranoid fears are realized and he has us out on the street. I will NEVER allow myself to be financially sabotaged like this again. Never. I will never again allow myself to be put in the position of being trapped because I don't have the means to bug out if necessary. It's apparent NO one can be trusted and I never should have gotten into any kind of relationship with anyone. I can assure you that will never happen again, either. If I'm always going to be left to fend for myself alone I might as well BE alone.
Still throwing temper tantrums when the world doesn't drop everything immediately and attend to his wishes. Acting as though his arms are broken and he's incapable of doing a dish or any other thing; easy if you've got a built-in maid, I guess. Doing everything he can to drive me away, generally just being hateful and nasty. I'm spending as much time as I can out of the house - sometimes going to four meetings a day - because I am filled to the brim with rage and resentment and one of these times I'm just not going to be able to bite my tongue. I really think he doesn't want sixteen years' worth of anger unleashed on him - he's never seen me that way - and I don't want to mis-step now just in case my Andy is still in there, though that hope is fading by the hour.
In addition to insisting I "should have married a man who could take care of me" (um, not your decision, bro) the latest sally lobbed my way is "You're too intellectual for me and should find someone your equal." Yep, 2013 and he's pulling out the old 'smart girls won't catch husbands' BS. I am trying very hard to remember these things are spoken from a place of low (well, NO) self-esteem and am doing my best to have compassion for him because it's quite obvious he's a sick, sick man. Easier to say than do.
I think what I find MOST distressing in this whole scenario is the anger, revulsion and contempt I feel for him right now. After sixteen years of honeymooning, suddenly I can't see anything but his faults. I never in my wildest imagination thought I could feel this way towards Andy. It has completely blindsided me and devastated me, maybe more so than his behavior toward me.
He seems to have obtained employment, though he was supposed to start last Thursday and it keeps getting pushed back while the company negotiates his rate. It'll be a relief to have him gone eight hours a day at least.
My resolve and willingness to commit to my own well-being waxes and wanes by the day. Funnily enough, it always seems to abandon me only on the days I miss meetings. I really resent having to do that, too. If my own damned husband can betray me and turn on me so viciously after sixteen years, why in the HELL should I trust you people? Unfortunately it's either AA or death, because if I drink again I'll end up in the morgue, no doubt about it. Right now the only thing keeping me going is the refusal to let him - or anyone - drag me back down to that place. It's not so much eagerness to live as it is determination not to be destroyed by anyone other than myself.
I am really sorry I don't have better things to report, but it's just the truth. That's all I've got.
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I, too, wish you had better things to report, but the truth is the only thing that will really help you see your way through this morass. I'm so sorry.
Take care of yourself and take whatever help and support you can from where ever you can. It isn't a sign of weakness, it is just one of those realities of life, that there are times we need some help!
Sending you thoughts of strength.
:grouphug; :grouphug;
Aleta
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Oh, hun, this is so very sad. :(
I guess he won't be happy until he destroys everything in his path.... and he won't be happy even then, and I reckon he knows it, too.
I can hear your grief and can only imagine how devastating it is to see your relationship pushed into a dark place that you'd never thought it would go. I don't feel I have any right to comment because I haven't lived through even a measurable fraction of the pain and betrayal you've endured, but I really want to plead with you to not let him change you. I want to tell you that no good can ever come from closing oneself off to love, and I want you to believe it. I want to drop everything and have a good long natter with you.
I do think that getting 8 hours away from him a day is an excellent start. Have you considered separating from him, assuming this is even possible financially?
I like the determination to get on with your life with him or without him, and it sounds to me like it's about time that he sees that he can indeed go too far and lose you forever.
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I think what I find MOST distressing in this whole scenario is the anger, revulsion and contempt I feel for him right now. After sixteen years of honeymooning, suddenly I can't see anything but his faults. I never in my wildest imagination thought I could feel this way towards Andy. It has completely blindsided me and devastated me, maybe more so than his behavior toward me.
This is probably one of the most tragic things I've ever read on IHD. Saying "I'm sorry" doesn't even approach inadequate, but I have no other words. I really am so very sorry, but I am still rooting for you both.
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DD, I just read everyone of your posts on this subject and I have to say I'm so sorry you have to go through this. Three years ago, I attempted suicide but obviously I didn't succeed. It took a lot of counseling and a month stay at a treatment facility 600 miles away from home to get my shit together. The reason I'm telling you this is that Andy is in extreme danger of attempting to harm himself again. If he is not willing to try to get help then you need to get away from him before he drags you down to his level. Yes, it is a mental disease, and can be treated, but one has to realize they need a lot of help to get through this disease. If he is refusing to help himself,he is going to just bring you down so far that you will feel less self esteem in yourself. You have to take care of yourself and remove yourself from the drain that he is pulling you down. I don't know you or Andy and I hope I haven't offended you in anyway! I just hate to see anyone being pulled down that "drain".
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:grouphug;
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Thinking of and praying for you both. So sorry you don't have better news to report. I was excited to see how things were going when I saw you had given an update, but am now feeling awful for you both. There are no words I can think of to help ease your pain or remedy your situation. Hoping things improve for you. Stay strong and keep going to those meetings if they help. Again, so very sorry! :cuddle;
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:cuddle; :cuddle; :cuddle; So very sorry DD.
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Oh, DD, I wish I had the ability to make everything better for you both!
All I can do is say I'm so sorry and send lots of hugs your way.
:grouphug; :cuddle; :grouphug; :cuddle;
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Oh, DD, I am so sorry things are not better now that Andy is home. Please do whatever is necessary to keep yourself safe - mentally, emotionally, physically. I can't imagine the anguish all this is causing you and I wish there was something I could do to lessen your burden. Hugs to you and Andy too for he must also be in intense emotional pain.
:cuddle; :cuddle;
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Im glad you still have a clear vision (of healthy mind) for your life. Partners can fog that and take away what we know to be right so keep fighting for yourself on this. Im so dang sorry this is happening to you and wish it to have a fix somehow. Love and prayers, jill
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I do hope the job is 'helping' the both of you.
Lots of love, an strength Cas
:grouphug;
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So sorry to read all this ontinuing struggle and his actions, like with buying stuff and the CC plan is scary and yeah I am sure rational him would know that.
Wish I could give you hugs or some sort of advice that could help!
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DD, I am so sorry that you are going through this. It really sounds that Andy, in his current state, is not only self-destructing, but also doing everything he can to destroy what the two of you have. Don't let him drag you down with him. What I'm picking up from reading through your updates is how much you still love him, and how much this whole situation is tearing you up inside. You may need to step back, just to protect yourself, even if only temporarily. Know how many people here love you and are rooting for you to make it through this on the other side. I will be praying for you and sending lots of positive energy your way, like everyone else on IHD. :grouphug;
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DD you know we all care about you and worry about you. Don't let the feeling of " I am responsible for him" hold you back. Get into a shelter if you have to. At least you will be safe there. Andy is now beyond YOU caring for him and he needs help. This is the worst mess ever and I hope that it will resolve soon, so that you can have some sort of a life. Good luck dear and God Bless.
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I've been thinking about you DD.. Hope things are better for the both of you. Would love to hear how your doing when you get the chance. Lots of love being sent to you ... :grouphug;
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God, do I miss him. I knew I'd be lonely without him but I think I underestimated the depth of the loneliness.
Ach: tears. I hear ya. Terrible.
At least I know I CAN do dialysis alone if I have to... been doing it all month. I mean, I've always done it alone but at least Andy was physically in the house then. I didn't realize how different it would feel in practice; however, the more practice I'm getting the more comfortable I am doing it alone. I guess people can acclimate to just about anything.
You can acclimatise and have and will again, but this aint over yet so don't give up. More love from me to you :grouphug;
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How have things been, DD? Is Andy working again?
I think about you often, G tells me you have not posted any personal updates on FB.
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I am sorry for being so stingy with the updates, but I know all of you can understand that sometimes Real Life pre-empts the online version and I've had to devote all my energy to it lately.
I find myself these days (cautiously) optimistic and I am (cautiously) happy to report that things seem to be turning around somewhat. Actually, they only just broke open in the last week to ten days. Andy is not completely himself again but he is starting to show through more and more; Sunday was the best day yet from start to finish. He has been working for several weeks now, regularly, and putting in 8-12 hour days depending on the job. Right now he's working through a temp agency but one of the companies they sent him to wants to hire him directly. He's still weighing that option - not crazy about the atmosphere or the hours - and did mention that he rather liked working for the temp agency. (I understand why, it's the reason I did so myself for over ten years.) At least he is getting out of the house and around people and has some structure and purpose to his days. It's a good thing, since he's still - for the most part - not leaving the house for any other reason. Except to shop. (To be fair, some of the money he's been spending - not all - are on tools he's required to have for the jobs he's been on. Things he used to own but gave away when we moved onto the boat. Sigh.)
He had been sleeping away all the hours he wasn't working but this weekend he finally stayed awake both days and took the initiative to get things accomplished. I woke up Sunday morning to an empty kitchen sink and he was outside fixing the front bumper of my car. When he was done with that he spent a few hours tearing apart his work van and getting it organized. I take that as a good sign, especially since he is making concrete plans for the future re: putting together his own welding rig. People who intend to check out don't generally make future plans, and certainly not with enthusiasm.
I've managed to persuade him to start eating real food for dinner again, mostly by just putting it in front of him and not giving him the cocoa krispies option in the first place. He's finally sleeping on his own, too, something he has not managed to do in well over seven months. He doesn't even need the melatonin anymore. I think that helps immensely.
There have been a few setbacks. The pharmacy shorted him on his pills last month and he ended up without them for four days. These are medications you absolutely CANNOT stop taking suddenly because there are very bad - even dangerous - effects to doing so. It showed. This month we counted the pills when he got them refilled to be sure that wouldn't happen again. There was another 'mood hiccup' when they switched him from one form of anti-depressant to the time-release version but that smoothed itself out. The lithium was giving him terrible hand tremors (not good for a weldor) so the doc lowered the dosage and has him taking them all at bedtime. That helped tremendously, too.
I got a lot of laughter out of him last week by showing him a steady stream of videos: Babies laughing, babies eating lemons for the first time, and Brazil's version of 'Candid Camera' (Camera Escondida). By this weekend there was even a little bit of the easy, teasing banter between us.
Perhaps I'm just being hopelessly hopeful but I find this all encouraging. The trick for me, then, is to not be lulled back into the old routines. It's too easy to say, "Oh, I finally have my life back" and slip back into not leaving the house myself but I am not allowing that to happen. Nothing changes if nothing changes. I am still trying to hit at least one AA meeting per day and have begun to make some friends just by virtue of showing up and becoming a familiar face. I'm actually the speaker at a women's meeting this Thursday. I was such a wreck when I began returning to meetings two months ago ("tore up from the floor up", as they say) but surprisingly it has been just like riding a bicycle. I really never forgot how to be sane and serene and have found that I've come up to speed rather quickly, though it's been surprisingly harder in some ways, too. Nothing that can't be overcome, though.
I've not opened my own account yet (I know!) not for lack of intent, just for lack of 'spare' funds to siphon off for that purpose. I have a lead on a part-time job that sounds like it might be a perfect fit (Peer Support Specialist for a recovery program) and so then I'd have a bit of income for myself that won't impact my disability.
Also (and this is HUGE): I finally managed to fix my own back. The physical therapist I went to was useless and completely disregarded any opinions I had as to what was wrong with my own body. SO... with just a few hours on Google and YouTube I put together my own physical therapy program and have been doing it faithfully every day. After only one week the pain - three years' worth of pain - was virtually gone. Within two weeks I found myself able to perform exercises and actions I haven't been able to do in years. Example? I can now put on my pants standing up, without having to lift up my right leg with my left hand and placing my leg in the pant leg. I can sit on the floor with my legs out in front of me, at a 90-degree angle, without propping myself up with my arms. I can do sit ups and leg lifts again. I can sit in chairs at meetings instead of on the floor on a pillow. Small things, but they are monumental to me. I worked so, so hard to accomplish this and I never, EVER gave up hope that if I just worked hard enough at it I could fix my back pain, and I always believed that tomorrow would be the day. And then suddenly, one day, it was.
What this means, of course, is I can move onto the next step: dancing again. That has been my goal all along. Now I think I'm finally ready, almost two years later than I'd hoped but I did it. It'll cost a little money for classes but it's important enough to me to be a priority - physically and mentally - so I'm going to do it.
In other news, our house was listed two weeks ago, which caused quite a bit of angst around here. We just found out on Thursday that it has been sold. How did we find out? The agent told me another inspector was coming to the house but instead it was actually the new owner who showed up. And... he and his wife want to keep tenants in the place and rent it out. It's likely they'll raise the rent since they'll have to do a little work to it, but as long as it's modest and reasonable there's absolutely no reason we have to go anywhere. He was really impressed with how nicely we keep the place and I can't imagine they'd want to risk renting it out to someone else who could very well trash it. I can't even BEGIN to tell you what a relief this is.
So... a lot of good, not much bad, and no more ugly. Just keeping the faith, taking it a day at a time and still marveling at the miracles that happen every time I allow people into my life. You'd think I'd've learned by now that reaching out is a good thing. Maybe this time the lesson will stick.
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What a great update! I'm so happy at the improvement.
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:2thumbsup; Really awesome about your back!
All good, and keeping up with your meetings keeps it real!
Thanks for catching up, hope things stay serene. :cuddle;
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Excellent news! :flower;
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Oh thank you, thank you! This was such a good read! I'm thrilled, dear DD. Onward and upward.
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Great News!!!! Very happy for you. Keep up the good work!!!!
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Oh DD that sounds much more positive..... fingers crossed this continues!!!
:clap;
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This news was a bloody good read. How impossibly stupendous that things have so turned around for you, DD. You've made your own luck, my dear, now enjoy it and long may it last.
:cheer: :yahoo; :cheer: :yahoo; :cheer:
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So, so happy to hear some positive news! Keep on doing what you're doing! Thanks for the update. Sending prayers and hugs to you both! :grouphug;
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:cheer:
Great news, keep up the good fight honey
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Oh, I'm so glad to hear some good news from you, DD. Some real steps forward! I'm particularly thrilled that your back problems have abated. You can get back to some joyful dancing and can think straight now that the pain is gone. Wonderful!
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:clap;