depression and drinking

[annabanana]

I'm so worried about my husband. He quit drinking (beer) last year because of HepC and CKD. He is an alcoholic...for 30 years. He's now in stage 4 CKD and has become very depressed about the way he feels, what he can't do anymore, etc. So last Saturday he talked to me about wanting to start drinking again. He will not see a counselor or go to AA, etc. I told him he would not be able to get on the liver transplant list if he continues to drink. He started back drinking anyway. He says life is not worth living if he can't feel good...OK...but is drinking the answer? It is for him. He's one of those "productive alcoholics." He's never abusive or even unkind. But it will kill him. I guess I have 2 questions. How will this affect his kidney? and how can I help him through this horrible depression? I've told him about a lot of you here, waitiing for a kidney, being on dialysis for years, doing everything to stop decline in health. But he won't come here to read your stories, which I think would give him hope. He won't take anti-depressants, either. Made him mad when I suggested it. I feel like there's nothing I can do.

[Sluff]

You should be able to copy and paste the stories into word or print the page you want him to read. That's a start. There isn't much you can do once someone makes their mind up, except explain to him how his decision effects you and your life. I understand depression and it's a tough one. Hang in there, thanks for being there for him.   

[annabanana]

Thanks, Sluff. I will copy some of the stories and read them to him. It does sound like a start. It's very difficult to see him give up...makes me want to give up, too, but I can't. I want to respect his wishes but I also want to give him hope. My whole world has changed.  I have a hard time now figuring out what is right.

[monrein]

Dear Annabanana
It's really tough what you're going through since it is not something that is in your control.  It's hard to see someone you care about hurting themselves and your husband, by drinking the way he does, is probably trying to medicate the depression himself with the alcohol.  Problem is that alcohol often leaves people more depressed so it's a wicked cycle.  Your support, like Sluff said, is a great gift to your husband but please take care of yourself too.  I don't know if it would be helpful to you but Al-Anon offers support to people living with alcoholics.  My Dad was depressed and alcoholic his whole life except the last 8 years and I wish that as a kid I had had a place to talk about how it was affecting me.  My Dad also was never abusive or unkind but his drinking took a toll on all of us.
I think the most important thing to remember is that no matter what you do it is he who must decide to give up drinking or not (well you already know that duh) and that it's not a reflection on YOU, your efforts or your love for him.
Take good care of you as well.

[okarol]

I come from a family of alcoholics and I have been going to Alanon for over 20 years (it's a support group for anyone affected by someones drug or alcohol abuse.)
You cannot change someones behavior but you can change how you respond to it. If an alcoholic will not get help or support, it's the same as someone who will not take chemo for cancer or insulin for diabetes. If they refuse to get treatment for their disease you cannot cure them. But Alanon helps those around them learn to cope and get tools to help themselves. You can find meetings in your area, or get more info online at http://www.al-anon.alateen.org/. Alanon is free, it's a self help group. I would encourage you to go to a meeting annabanana - you'd be surprised how your change will ultimately improve your situation. Lots of HUGS for you!
 

[annabanana]

Thank you, monrein. I have often thought about going to al-anon. Interesting that you mentioned that it's not a reflection on me, as that is how I've been feeling...like I am not enough. I fight this feeling because I know the addiction for Randy is overwhelming....but I just wish with all my heart that things were different.

okarol, I guess al-anon is the place for me. I do need tools. And hugs! Thank you!

[monrein]

 

[Psim]

I'm so sorry your husband (and you) are going through this. Depression is a wicked difficult thing to get ahold of, and addictions on top of it are just hell. I hope that Al Anon can give you some good support and tools and your husband eventually turns things around for himself. Meanwhile, keep talking about it here all you want -- there are a thousand ears open for your words and a thousand hands reaching out.

[annabanana]

Thank you so very much, Psim. When this first came up, last Saturday, I wanted to immediately post on IHD then I just went under, and stopped pretty much everything. It took me a week to come here with this problem. There are so many emotions involved that I can't get a grip on what's right and wrong. The other day I saw Randy with a beer and I told him I didn't care. Then later I told him that I cared very much, but didn't want to care. Then, even later, I told him that I will never stop my caregiver role with him but that it was very difficult to hold it together for both of us. I feel as if I've already lost him. I just tell him I love him all the time now and maybe that will help him.

[rose1999]

annabanana - When they have done something I don't like I've sometimes told my boys that "I don't like you just now but I will ALWAYS love you"  I think that is how you feel about Randy.  You can't stop caring but boy wouldn't it be easier if you could.  I feel for both of you, I'm sure he doesn't want to put you through this but depression is dreadful and to add addiction to it is almost too much.  Al-anon sounds a good place to start but please post here whenever and whatever you need to get out of your system, ultimately we can't solve things but we can try to help by 'listening'. We love you  I'm sending you a special Sluffbunny to keep your spirits up 

[paris]

Dear Annabanana,  you touched my heart.   My father was the sweetest, most gentle man I have ever known, but he was an alcoholic and the drink was more important than anything else.  He, also, was never mean or hurtful. Just quietly drank his life away.   I realize now, that he had many emotional problems and never seeked help.    You are doing the right thing by finding places for you to go for help.  You can't make him stop or even change his mind about his life right now.  I do like Sluff's idea about printing out some of the inspirational posts here.  I am not sure why men are hesitant to take medication for depression. My sister's husband has liver disease and will eventually need a transplant. He is depressed and in a bad mood all the time.  He won't tell the doctor.  He would rather be miserable.    I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers.  This is rough time for both of you.  I am so sorry

[thegrammalady]

i can't say any more than what has already been said. know we love you and are here for you anytime you have anything that needs saying. the best way you can care for your husband is to be sure you care for yourself. and to know that his problems aren't because of you. he has to make the choices you can't do it for him. you'll be in our prayers. 

[annabanana]

Rose, it's so true: "I don't like you just now but I will ALWAYS love you." That's exactly how I feel. And true that he does not want to put me through this, so he hides his feelings a lot. He cried when he told me he wanted to start drinking again. He knows how dangerous it is. He knows how it hurts me, too, that he's not happy and I can't make it okay. I try so hard to respect him, though. Thank you for listening and thanks for the Sluffbunny!  

Paris, I think Randy is like your father...he, too, has many emotional problems that he won't seek ANY help for, not even from me. There have been a few times when he almost started sharing with me but he shuts down. It's too hard for him so he drinks and buries his problems. He's such a beautiful human being, so gentle and kind. We used to laugh and have fun so much and now that's pretty much all gone. He tries and he thinks about it, but it never gets that far anymore. I'm going to an Al-Anon meeting on Monday. I think it will help me and maybe it will help him, too. Thank you for your thoughts and prayers.  

thegrammalady, I think that's the hardest part, giving up trying to talk him out of drinking. I know I can't make that choice for him. I tell him how I feel about it and then I feel bad because he feels bad, etc etc, so I make the decision to respect his wishes and that feels bad, too. But as long as there's a chance he'll change his mind I will let him know how I feel and hope that's the right thing to do.

[flip]

Other than fluid restrictions, drinking probably wouldn't hurt as long as he doesn't overdo it. I still enjoy a drink or two in the evenings and my doctor hasn't voiced any disapproval. I don't have any other medical issues and I don't have any depression. You probably need to discuss his situation with his doctor.

[Ohio Buckeye]

 

[annabanana]

flip, he's got Hepatitis C. They all say no to drinking with this disease. I told him we'd have to tell the drs. but he said no to that. But I want to thank you for telling me about your evening drinks and that it hasn't done you harm. This is one thing I'm really worried about...the effect it would have on his remaining kidney.

Thanks for the hugs, OB!

[paris]

Anna, my BIL can't drink at all with liver disease. The doctor will need to know.   

Also, flip, if you are an alcoholic, a drink or two in the evening isn't the problem.  One leads to bottomless bottles, closing yourself off from family and friends and wasting away.  It is a sad disease to watch a love one live with.

Anna, I have been thinking of you all day.  You have taken a good first step for yourself by opening up to us.  Glad you found a meeting to go to on Monday. I know you are very worried about Randy

[okarol]

I tried about 4 different meetings before I found one that I liked. The women who have been my support all these years have become like family I rely on when things get tough. I hope you find the same kind of support!

[flip]

Sorry, Anna, I overlooked the Hep-C thing. Here in the Bible Belt many people believe that anyone who has a drink on a regular basis is an alcoholic so I wasn't sure where your husband fits in. People with liver problems and/or diabetes should not drink but, for many of us, a couple of glasses of wine a day is good for the health.

Being retired from law enforcement, I have seen the damage that excessive alcohol consumption can do and I hope and pray that yours in not one of these situations.

[Sunny]

Anna,
I think you need to intervene. It is not enough for you to go to Alanon or to tell him you are willing to be a caregiver anyway.
He needs help! His life does not have to be this way. He is reaching out to you the best way he knows how and you need to throw him
a life line. Call his doctor and tell the doctor what you have told us. Then tell him that he needs to see the doctor about this and maybe
even take anti-depressants for a while along with go to a therapist till he gets through this. It is hard for me to admit to this, but this is what happened to
me after I was diagnosed with ESRD. I told my husband I wanted to die and didn't care what happened to me. And I truly didn't. He called my general
practitioner and they threatened to have me committed unless I agreed to try anti-depressants and see a therapist. It was the best thing I ever did and
it saved my life. Please don't let this slip through the cracks. Ask the doctor for help. Most importantly, DO NOT ACCEPT THIS because things do not have to be this way.
I am rooting for you both.

[Sluff]

I don't drink alcohol because i lived that life my entire childhood and didn't want my children to grow up the way I did. I loved my Father dearly but he was violently abusive and drank everyday in excess. I know the damaging effects on the rest of the family. I hope you get some help as needed and realize what the others are saying out of love. 

[annabanana]

I was gone for the weekend and came back to find all of this loving support. Thank you all very much! I have thought of intervening. It's difficult to do that. I had to do it with my sister once and 3 days later she was out of rehab because she didn't choose it herself. 3 doctors even signed off on commiting her. That's the law here in TN. unless you are considered a danger to yourself or others. I know he is endangering his life...but they will not see it that way. They will say he has a choice and I know if I intervene he will get out in 3 days. But I will ask his doctors anyway, just in case the laws have changed. I've offered him every option and he refuses. He's been in rehab before and he thinks it will not help him. Then maybe they can convince him. But he's full-force drinking now, as I knew he would be after he took that first drink. He was clean for 8 months. And he says he was miserable the whole time. I don't believe that...and it's impossible for me to understand how anyone with a liver disease and ckd could pick up drinking after 8 months of being sober.

Before he started drinking again I gave him so much hope, I thought. Now I talk to him honestly, even brutally sometimes, about his life. He said he will live for 10 to 15 more years and I told him I didn't even give him 5 years. We have been planning to build a house in the country for a while and I told him we needed to start now. Get our finances in order, etc. It's horrible talking to him this way but it's honest. It's so very very difficult to care when he doesn't care at all.

We live in the Bible Belt, too. Unfortunately Randy drinks way more than a few drinks. When I first met him 10 years ago he would secretly drink a 6-pack BEFORE going to work. I was so naive! I've never been around drinking like this so I didn't know. He never acted drunk or abusive. I've left him twice in our marriage. He always would quit for a while. It's been rough. But I really thought he would change after being diagnosed with HepC.

Thanks for letting me go on and on. As you can probably tell, my brain is going in a million different directions. Worried about everything. Trying to find good solutions. I can't tell you all how much I appreciate the support I find here. Much love to all of you.

[Sunny]

Anna,
This is so hard for you. I think you are on the right track ,though, in talking to his doctors.
All of these illnesses he has to deal with are soooooo hard and I understand his point of view.I know how hard ESRD has been for me.
I wouldn't wish it on anybody. I am very concerned for your well being, though, because he doesn't live in a bubble. Everything he does
also effects you. If he does live for 10 more years as he thinks he might, this means 10 more years of anguish for you too. A very difficult
situation for a loving person like you to be in. I hope things can turn around for the better for him soon. I'm wishing you both the best.

[annabanana]

Thank you, Sunny. There is a good thing in my life: my kids. 2 grown daughters, a grown son, and a wonderful 12 yr. old son who is such a joy. I hold it together FOR them AND with their help. It's amazing when I'm so far down and lost, they get me going again.  I refuse to get so depressed that I stop seeing how beautiful life is. I have to fight it, though. I just wish with all my heart that I could show Randy these feelings. I try, but it does no good. I know it must be unbearable for him to be so sick. I know I cannot understand at all. But I see all of you here fighting so hard for a good life and I wish Randy felt the same.   

[monrein]

Anna, from what you say Randy may have been depressed for a very long time and his CKD may have just been too too much on top of it all.  Depression is so debilitating and people suffering from it really see everything "through a glass darkly".  We all react so differently to stresses and some depression is a response to a situation and some seems to be more hard-wired in some people.  Put the two together and that's a really tough combo.  No easy answers here for sure especially when it's not you posting about you but hopefully you gain some support for yourself knowing that we care about both of you.  I'm glad your kids are supportive of you too.