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Epoman
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« Reply #50 on: June 08, 2006, 09:50:01 PM »

Oh, O...... I posted something and it didn't show up here!  If anyone sees it elsewhere, let me know so I can move it!   ;D

Oh, but a Government that hates women?  I think it is already in Saudi Arabia.

 ??? Confused  ???
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« Reply #51 on: June 08, 2006, 11:12:01 PM »

I am SO totally with you on this one, Rerun(referring to your earlier posting).   Society today is in the trouble it is in, because people want to shy away from moral absolutes.  If we don't have any, what is to stop people from sexually abusing underage children, etc.  There MUST be an absolute somewhere.  And there is!!!

« Last Edit: June 08, 2006, 11:15:14 PM by bajanne2000 » Logged

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« Reply #52 on: June 09, 2006, 06:33:30 AM »

Kikny Freidman is running for governer in our state (TX).
He is pro gay marriage and his rationale is "They should have the right to be as miserable as the rest of us..."
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« Reply #53 on: June 09, 2006, 06:49:49 AM »

Kikny Freidman is running for governer in our state (TX).
He is pro gay marriage and his rationale is "They should have the right to be as miserable as the rest of us..."
;D  ;D
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« Reply #54 on: June 09, 2006, 07:29:14 AM »

I just want to make this point, because it doesn't seem to be coming across:

Gay marriage, even if you find it immoral, does not harm anyone, or violate anyone's personal rights.
Sexually abusing children does. There will never be a movement to allow this. That is ridiculous.
Having sex with animals is animal cruelty. There are also implacations such as cross breading, which is illegal to do with humans. There will never be a movement to allow this.

Stop comparing gay marriage to sexual crimes, such as molestation, rape, or sodomy. Because "sex" is such a taboo in our society (thanks to religion), anything that has to do with sex gets clumped together in one category. How is 2 men or 2 women having sex in their own privacy, the same as an adult taking advantage of an innocent child?

You say we need an absolute somewhere, well the absolute should be that 2 adults can do whatever they want as long as they aren't harming anyone else, or themselves.

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« Reply #55 on: June 09, 2006, 09:40:18 AM »

Surely Gay marriage does harm someone, the men and women who become tied into a fruitless marriage, ie, no ability to produce children with one another, and even if they do adopt, then should people who are totally lost about there own sexuality lay the foundation for the sexuality and personality of the next generation, its about breaking Gods law, just like most of us tried to push the boundrys with our parents in order to set up new bed time rules, or less chores or whatever else, these people are trying to establish a new order, calling black white and white black, and the gullible are falling for it.

Logic, not all this emotional political correct we must people please everybody rubbish, thats brainwashing taught in school. heres logic, many health junkies tried for a while to teach that drinking urine is healthy good for your skin and many other stupid things, now why would drinking toxins be usefull to the human body, men are made to be knit to gether with women, eg the male organ the female organ.. I'm not trying to be crude or rude and offensive, I grew up believing I was homosexual and for a long time I believed the stupid lie that this is the way God has made me, or its in my genes.
that Changed when I met God. not church not religious rubbish, but God.

the way people are is a direct result of parenting and environment, be it spiritual or physical. my damage was an absent unemotional father and abuse. I understand this isn't a Christian site, but since most Christians cop out and go with the political correct rubbish I thought Id ad my two pennies worth.
 
this weekend I celebrate my second year of marriage, for most people two years isn't really long, and of course 5o years of marriage is something to show off about, but if this world had had its way I wouldn't be married, or worse Id have lived somewhere where gay marriage was OK and that would have been my path..
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« Reply #56 on: June 09, 2006, 10:14:20 AM »

Surely Gay marriage does harm someone, the men and women who become tied into a fruitless marriage, ie, no ability to produce children with one another, and even if they do adopt, then should people who are totally lost about there own sexuality lay the foundation for the sexuality and personality of the next generation, its about breaking Gods law, just like most of us tried to push the boundrys with our parents in order to set up new bed time rules, or less chores or whatever else, these people are trying to establish a new order, calling black white and white black, and the gullible are falling for it.

Logic, not all this emotional political correct we must people please everybody rubbish, thats brainwashing taught in school. heres logic, many health junkies tried for a while to teach that drinking urine is healthy good for your skin and many other stupid things, now why would drinking toxins be usefull to the human body, men are made to be knit to gether with women, eg the male organ the female organ.. I'm not trying to be crude or rude and offensive, I grew up believing I was homosexual and for a long time I believed the stupid lie that this is the way God has made me, or its in my genes.
that Changed when I met God. not church not religious rubbish, but God.

the way people are is a direct result of parenting and environment, be it spiritual or physical. my damage was an absent unemotional father and abuse. I understand this isn't a Christian site, but since most Christians cop out and go with the political correct rubbish I thought Id ad my two pennies worth.
 
this weekend I celebrate my second year of marriage, for most people two years isn't really long, and of course 5o years of marriage is something to show off about, but if this world had had its way I wouldn't be married, or worse Id have lived somewhere where gay marriage was OK and that would have been my path..

How does entering into a "fruitless marriage" harm someone? I know of many straight couples who have decided not to have children, yet they are still married. And believe it or not, having gay parents does not negatively affect a child. If anything it teaches them to be more accepting of others. Check out this website: http://www.colage.org/resources/facts.htm

I like your statement about how drinking urine was at once "thought by health junkies" to be beneficial. And then you go on to say something along the lines of "how gullible". Well yeah it seems absurd, becuase there is scientific evidence that drinking urine is not benficial at all. But then again, I could say that you are gullible for beleiving in an "All-Mighty Presence" ie: God. Where's the proof that a God really exists? What if people started beleiving that the world we live in, was really just a grain of sand inside an enormous dessert, on an enormous planet, run by cows with super-brains. Pretty crazy wouldn't you think? But really theres just as much evidence of that "reality" as the one you are beleiving in.

And just to let you know, homosexuality is not just a "human thing"

http://www.cnn.com/NATURE/9909/18/gay.vulture.parents/
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« Reply #57 on: June 09, 2006, 10:59:37 AM »

I wasnt saying that not having children is fruitless but the ability to have children was commited to a man and a women, men cannot get together and make a baby.

paedophiles are not just inherently evil people. they are convinced that is the way they are.that preying on children is their sexuality. young guys who get urges towards other young guys also believe that makes them homosexual. because of the publicity and protection the homosexual religion has recieved and the lack of truth, they continue that lifestyle. 

you are very welcome to say I am very gullable to believe in an allmighty presence or God, feel free.
the problem with athiests or unbelievers whatever youd like to call it, is they dont believe and because they dont believe they avoid all the places and situations where their beliefs might be challenged. in the last two years I have seen 6 deaf people get there hearing,by the power of God, three were totally deaf in both ears and three partially deaf either in the left or the right ear. Before I met God I never saw a miracle and due to controlled media never heard of one. In the world deaf people dont get there hearing back. yet Ive seen it and they heard it. Ive met my wife, as yet you have never spoken with her, but for that you cant say she doesnt exist, Ive met God, you have as yet not met Him. but scientifically you cannot disprove my friend who you have not met.

in regards to homosexual animals, I wont deny that, but if we want to get biblical, it says "The whole world lies under the sway of the evil one, or the world is in bondage to corruption. this all came as a result of the adam and eve story..

I love gay people , but I love them enough to turn the lights on when they are walking in the dark. telling them the dark is light doesnt really help.
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« Reply #58 on: June 09, 2006, 11:36:50 AM »

Heres a little side-thought: theoretically, the ability to have children could belong to more than just a man and a woman. Two men could produce a child if their genes were inserted into an egg that had had it's genes removed. So in essence the child would be a "clone" of the two men (a mix of the two, so not really a clone)...Now I know there are many that would find this to be an unforgivable sin. I'm not sure I would agree with it either, but I am saying that it is possible.

Pedophiles are evil people. Anyone who prey's on an innocent person and does harm to them is evil. End of story. I'm not saying they are pure evil, but their actions are evil.

I'm not trying to say you are gullable for believing in God. I believe in God, I just don't believe that he (or she  ;D) is going around granting miracles and watching us all and judging us like Santa Claus. The God I believe in started the Universe. That's it. And the reason I believe that, is because it hurts my brain to think about nothingness before the universe was created (as a human being, I can't grasp the concept of nothingness). You say that people who were completely deaf got their hearing back. There must be a medical explanation for this. Maybe these people had some sort of nerve that was blocking their auditory sensory pathway. Maybe this nerve got knocked back into place? Who knows...A magician like Chris Angel or David Blaine can make it appear as though they are floating, or make something dissapear or whatever. The average person believes it, that doesn't mean its really happening.

Ive seen those shows on TV, on sunday mornings where they have huge auditoriums full of people, and an old lady who "couldn't walk" comes running out onto the stage. Healed by the power of God. And then the priest or whatever he is puts his hand to her face, and she passes out. Thats not a miracle. Its a way to make money.

True miracles can happen, like surviving a deadly cancer. But there is an explanation behind them.

And yes scientifically I can disprove your friend whom I have not met. I could drive to wherever you live, and see this person. I could touch that person. I could hear that person...etc
There is no way to see God, to take his picture, to touch him. But I'm not arguing that God does or doesn't exist. And I'm not arguing whether or not he thinks homosexuality is right or wrong. You dont know what he thinks, neither do I. The Bible might say something, but that was written by men, more than a thousand years ago. Its just an interpretation of what those men thought.

What I AM arguing is that gays should be allowed to get married (whether is a civil union, or a marriage in a church) if they want to. If a certain church or minister or priest does not want to wed a gay couple, than that is his choice. Let them find another church that will do it. But don't write it into the constitution so that your religion is basically forced upon them. If you're going to do that, you might as well write into the constitution that being Muslim, or Jewish, or Buddhist is illegal, and teaching the ways of these religions is illegal.
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« Reply #59 on: June 10, 2006, 02:28:50 AM »

Ive seen those shows on TV, on sunday mornings where they have huge auditoriums full of people, and an old lady who "couldn't walk" comes running out onto the stage. Healed by the power of God. And then the priest or whatever he is puts his hand to her face, and she passes out. Thats not a miracle. Its a way to make money.

sorry don't know how to do the quote thingy.

This was very funny. I agree there are many out there making money this way, I'm sorry to tell you that the reason that you don't know The God of the bible, is because you are hanging around the wrong places, I have friends who walk with God and have healing ministries, seeing crazy things like metal pins dissolving out of peoples bodies, totally paralyzed people get up and walk, men growing new eye balls where there were none. thats why I hate religion, religion is the reason the average person does not know the Goodness of God, its not a money making gimmick,

I have prayed for people myself in the name of Jesus and seen deaf ears open, and seen the shock on the peoples faces and the tears of their wives(tears of Joy) do you know the first thing a blind person who has received sight does. they walk around the room and learn the names of colors, they seek the people they know and get a first glimpse of their faces. people who were deaf have to learn to talk properly as for the first time they hear clearly how the world sounds. there is an entirely awesome hidden world in God that you have not yet found.

I'm talking about documented miracles not ludicrous claims, and scientists cannot understand neither can Dr's. 

these things follow God and cant be found outside of Him. The liberal God you spoke of is simply the God of your own understanding, a God who plants a planet just to leave it floating around in space, its a bit stupid like a man building a huge mansion just to walk away and leave it derelict.

and I like your statement about the bible being a book written by men who thought they heard from God. if you have heard of Nostradamus he has nothing on the bible, many of His prophecy's fell to the ground, eg failed, but throughout the bible are prophetic words that have come to pass, for instance Jesus told the leaders of the Jews not one stone would remain on top of another , ie the destruction of Jerusalem, which happened in 70 ad when the Romans overturned every stone.

the Bible is a prophetic document that fortells many future events and fortold many past events before they took place. no man has ever fortold the future so vividly and accurately as this. the bible is a book of mystical of supernatural nature.

I'm not preaching at you its just easier if you know some of the facts that the lazy sleepy church isn't telling.

all the events eg marriage amendments are really to do with breaking Gods law, nothing to do with "Gay" people living in happily married situations. in fact all the political arguments that have become so popular are to do with man opposing Gods law, ie abortion,same sex marriage, polygamy, etc.

and all of these have very logical answers but people aren't seeing the logical answers but the immoral anti Christ answers.

I wont go into it now, even though this is an of topic post. maybe if people want to discuss and debate interesting stuff like that we could ask epoman if we could set up such a post, we need to get our minds of the daily chore of dialysis.
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« Reply #60 on: June 10, 2006, 05:08:43 AM »

Hephziba wrote:
Quote
I have friends who walk with God and have healing ministries, seeing crazy things like metal pins dissolving out of peoples bodies, totally paralyzed people get up and walk, men growing new eye balls where there were none.
Aren't you on Dialysis?
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« Reply #61 on: June 10, 2006, 05:28:24 AM »

Yes I am on dialysis, regardless of that God remains true to His word and me being on dialysis has no bearing on whether God performs miracles around the world. One of my friends had torn ligaments out of his shoulder and couldn't move it. He prayed for people and saw them healed even while he was waiting for surgery. Two days before surgery, God healed him. Contrary to popular belief, God is not the author of sickness, so regardless of whether my major organs have failed or I have a headache, this is no reason to doubt or blame God. God is just as good on my bad days as He is on my good days. Good things happen to good people and bad people, and it rains on good & evil, the bible doesn't claim a perfect wonderful life for christians, it claims a relationship with an awesome, loving God. Saint Paul was stoned, beaten and suffered shipwreck, yet still praised a loving God. Saint Peter was allegedly nailed on an up side down cross and many other horrendous things have happened to others who have held fast to the truth.  I don't understand it all.  ???

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« Reply #62 on: June 10, 2006, 07:21:58 AM »

Hephziba -  Amen to what you are saying.

Why do homosexuals need to be married in the church or under the covenant of God?  Why do they care?  They can't honestly think that they are Christians and living a godly life.

It makes me sad to read some of these posts.  I don't know how people get through daily dialysis without the faith that God exists and he has a better place for us after we die. 

The Bible says that sex is meant to be between a man and a woman and it is beautiful.  It doesn't NOT say that sex is taboo.  Only immoral sex is taboo.  Homosexuality is cauterized as immoral sex in the Bible.  I try to tell the children in my life to wait to have sex until after marriage.   Your virginity can only be given away once.  Give it under the blessing of Marriage.

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« Reply #63 on: June 10, 2006, 08:07:56 AM »

Ive seen those shows on TV, on sunday mornings where they have huge auditoriums full of people, and an old lady who "couldn't walk" comes running out onto the stage. Healed by the power of God. And then the priest or whatever he is puts his hand to her face, and she passes out. Thats not a miracle. Its a way to make money.

sorry don't know how to do the quote thingy.

This was very funny. I agree there are many out there making money this way, I'm sorry to tell you that the reason that you don't know The God of the bible, is because you are hanging around the wrong places, I have friends who walk with God and have healing ministries, seeing crazy things like metal pins dissolving out of peoples bodies, totally paralyzed people get up and walk, men growing new eye balls where there were none. thats why I hate religion, religion is the reason the average person does not know the Goodness of God, its not a money making gimmick,

I have prayed for people myself in the name of Jesus and seen deaf ears open, and seen the shock on the peoples faces and the tears of their wives(tears of Joy) do you know the first thing a blind person who has received sight does. they walk around the room and learn the names of colors, they seek the people they know and get a first glimpse of their faces. people who were deaf have to learn to talk properly as for the first time they hear clearly how the world sounds. there is an entirely awesome hidden world in God that you have not yet found.

I'm talking about documented miracles not ludicrous claims, and scientists cannot understand neither can Dr's. 

these things follow God and cant be found outside of Him. The liberal God you spoke of is simply the God of your own understanding, a God who plants a planet just to leave it floating around in space, its a bit stupid like a man building a huge mansion just to walk away and leave it derelict.

and I like your statement about the bible being a book written by men who thought they heard from God. if you have heard of Nostradamus he has nothing on the bible, many of His prophecy's fell to the ground, eg failed, but throughout the bible are prophetic words that have come to pass, for instance Jesus told the leaders of the Jews not one stone would remain on top of another , ie the destruction of Jerusalem, which happened in 70 ad when the Romans overturned every stone.

the Bible is a prophetic document that fortells many future events and fortold many past events before they took place. no man has ever fortold the future so vividly and accurately as this. the bible is a book of mystical of supernatural nature.

I'm not preaching at you its just easier if you know some of the facts that the lazy sleepy church isn't telling.

all the events eg marriage amendments are really to do with breaking Gods law, nothing to do with "Gay" people living in happily married situations. in fact all the political arguments that have become so popular are to do with man opposing Gods law, ie abortion,same sex marriage, polygamy, etc.

and all of these have very logical answers but people aren't seeing the logical answers but the immoral anti Christ answers.

I wont go into it now, even though this is an of topic post. maybe if people want to discuss and debate interesting stuff like that we could ask epoman if we could set up such a post, we need to get our minds of the daily chore of dialysis.

You don't have to ask me, this is Off-Topic you can talk about ANYTHING here.  :) You can talk about the color of your poop! if you want.  ;D

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« Reply #64 on: June 10, 2006, 11:41:27 AM »

It's not that gays want to be married under the church, or even accepted by the church. It's that they want to be given the status of "married" or "civily unionized" (haha or whatever the word is), so that they can be given the same benefits that married couples recieve, such as tax benefits, and healthcare coverage etc. If a church does not want to marry them, than that is the church's choice. You can't force someone to do something against their beliefs. BUT if a certain church or religion has no problem with "wedding" two gays, whether it's under God's watchful eye or not, or whether it's just a civil union, that should be the church or religion or whatever's own decision. By writing into the constitution that Gay's can not get married, or enter into a "formal relationship" or whatever you want to call it, the government is taking away the freedom of choice. If church's feel so negatively towards the notion, than they should choose to not wed these couples. But don't write it into the constitution so that those people out there who are more accepting, cannot. Just because your religion says it's wrong, doesn't mean that someone else's religion says it's wrong.

Here's an example that might hit home:

Let's say that we lived in a country that was populated by a group of people that were predominatly Jehovah's Witnesses. Now lets say that there were many people (millions) that were not Jehovah's Witnesses, but the majority of the population was. Now lets say that the government was upset with the increasing amount of people who were donating blood and organs, and the increasing number of people who were accepting this blood and organs...etc. (because that is against their religion). Don't you think it would be ridiculous for the government to write into the constitution that the donation of these organs is illegal? Why should the government make something illegal for everyone, when a very large portion of the population did not believe in this, as it was not part of their religion? All of the Christians that lived in this country who needed these donations to live, would be outraged. Why not let the people that want to donate their organs, or receive these organs, do so? They aren't harming the other people...Just because the majority of people that live in North America are Christians, doesn't mean that everyone else should be...
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« Reply #65 on: June 10, 2006, 08:06:46 PM »

I guess I wouldn't have such a problem with all this going on if it weren't thrown in our faces every day.

If what people do in their own bedrooms is their own business then why are they constantly parading it around in the street. I think there is a time and place for every thing. I don't need to see couples of any orientation groping each other in public. That just drives me crazy, keep it where it belongs, behind closed doors. I think if people would do that then people that didn't approve wouldn't be so upset by this. You get sick of it being in your face every place you look. If it is your own business then keep it there.

I don't think it needs to talked about in class rooms of young children. If a child for what ever reason was to ask a teacher about such a thing then they should be directed to ask their parents. It should be up to parents to teach their own children what they believe.

I think gays are born that way, I mean why would any one decide to be treated the way they are through out their life.

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« Reply #66 on: June 10, 2006, 08:13:09 PM »

I guess I wouldn't have such a problem with all this going on if it weren't thrown in our faces every day.

If what people do in their own bedrooms is their own business then why are they constantly parading it around in the street. I think there is a time and place for every thing. I don't need to see couples of any orientation groping each other in public. That just drives me crazy, keep it where it belongs, behind closed doors. I think if people would do that then people that didn't approve wouldn't be so upset by this. You get sick of it being in your face every place you look. If it is your own business then keep it there.

I don't think it needs to talked about in class rooms of young children. If a child for what ever reason was to ask a teacher about such a thing then they should be directed to ask their parents. It should be up to parents to teach their own children what they believe.

I think gays are born that way, I mean why would any one decide to be treated the way they are through out their life.

Constantly parading it around in the street? I don't know where you live, but where I live there aren't constant gay parades in the street...If you're talking about something like an annual "Gay Pride Parade", then yeah. Very wierd. Grosses me out. But that's why I don't go to it.

And yes I agree with you, no need to talk about it in the class rooms of young children...but I definatly don't think they talk about homosexual relationships in elementary school. I know they didn't talk about it when I went to public school (not that long ago)...
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« Reply #67 on: June 12, 2006, 02:16:45 PM »

I guess I wouldn't have such a problem with all this going on if it weren't thrown in our faces every day.

If what people do in their own bedrooms is their own business then why are they constantly parading it around in the street. I think there is a time and place for every thing. I don't need to see couples of any orientation groping each other in public. That just drives me crazy, keep it where it belongs, behind closed doors. I think if people would do that then people that didn't approve wouldn't be so upset by this. You get sick of it being in your face every place you look. If it is your own business then keep it there.

I don't think it needs to talked about in class rooms of young children. If a child for what ever reason was to ask a teacher about such a thing then they should be directed to ask their parents. It should be up to parents to teach their own children what they believe.

I think gays are born that way, I mean why would any one decide to be treated the way they are through out their life.



This is so true, homosexuality is all over T.V., movies, books, bumper stickers, it really is forced down our throats, all of this politically correct bullshit.  :-\
I personally believe what EVER two consenting adults do in the privacy of their own home, is their business, but damn don't brag about it.  ::) I mean why have a gay pride parade? Why can't we have a "straight" pride parade. Oh wait we can't because the would insult the gays.  ::)

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« Reply #68 on: June 12, 2006, 07:11:45 PM »

Nobody's saying you can't have a "straight pride parade"...but its kind of like how theres no such thing as "white history month". Or a White-Entertainment-Television TV station...As much as I hate to say it, its not really a "two-way street". Is that being "politically correct" ? Maybe...but when you're dealing with minorities, vs. a majority, the rules are different.
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« Reply #69 on: June 12, 2006, 08:49:49 PM »

What about a dialysis pride parade........har har har... :D
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« Reply #70 on: July 29, 2006, 12:27:47 PM »

Well it has been awhile since anyone said anything on this thread, so here goes my thoughts.

I think if any couple wants to get married, let them.  Why should someone who has been together for years  be prevented from getting married and having the protection marriage gives them?  In this day and age a divorce is easy to get.  They will just divorce if things do not work out.

Let the rumble begin again!

Epoman get the lawn chair out again!

Katherine
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« Reply #71 on: July 29, 2006, 12:52:20 PM »

I think it would be okay if gays got married but not in a church because it is against the bible. I think if they wanted to get married in a court, so be it. I know a lot of people may be against what I have to say (including my own boyfriend) but I believe in the Bible very strongly and in what it says. I am not, however, against Gays. I accept all people equally but a marriage under God should be men married woman. That is just how I feel. But maybe that is only because I have only known 2 gay guys in my entire life and one bisexual girl.
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« Reply #72 on: July 29, 2006, 12:53:55 PM »

My cousin (who is gay)  doesnt want to have a wedding but a comittment ceremony, i thought that sounded cool
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« Reply #73 on: July 29, 2006, 01:09:56 PM »

My cousin (who is gay)  doesnt want to have a wedding but a comittment ceremony, i thought that sounded cool
That is cool :)
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« Reply #74 on: July 29, 2006, 04:27:54 PM »

Well it has been awhile since anyone said anything on this thread, so here goes my thoughts.

I think if any couple wants to get married, let them.  Why should someone who has been together for years  be prevented from getting married and having the protection marriage gives them?  In this day and age a divorce is easy to get.  They will just divorce if things do not work out.

Let the rumble begin again!

Epoman get the lawn chair out again!Katherine

If that is truly the case then by all means they can draw up a contract to protect themselves.  The fact that the majority of gays do not do such a thing speaks volumes on the issue.  If they didn't have other motives on this they would in fact draw up contracts at the very least to protect themselves.  After all even if contracts are drawn up there is no down side to it even if sometime at a later date they are given the OK to marry.


Doesn't much matter what the feds do on the issue anyway.  The issue belongs to states and many states are amending their Constitution to fit their view.

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