Las Vegas STRONG

[KarenInWA]

All I can say is, I am so thankful I'm not a heartless NRA-loving supporter. To say that those victims don't deserve donations from them that are freely given to various politicians in exchange for votes is beyond the pale. I can't even 

KarenInWA

[Simon Dog]

All I can say is, I am so thankful I'm not a heartless NRA-loving supporter. To say that those victims don't deserve donations from them that are freely given to various politicians in exchange for votes is beyond the pale. I can't even 

KarenInWA

You are misunderstanding what I said.

What I said is that the law abiding NRA members do not bear a collective responsibility for the criminal actions of an individual not acting on their behalf, in the same way that the Jewish community does not bear a collective responsibility for the criminal actions of a Jewish criminal.

[KarenInWA]

And you don't understand what I said. The NRA spends A LOT of $$$ buying out politicians. $52 million just last year. Why do you think they do that???  Each and every politician who accepted a donation from them last year needs to take that $$ and donate it to the victims. Then the NRA needs to match that and donate as well. No more buying votes. Not for the NRA, not for anybody. We aren't the land of the free anymore. We're the land of the bought and paid for. Personally, I'm sick of it. Let's start with this tragedy and the NRA. As for NRA members, big frigging whoop. You choose to be a card carrying member. Are you telling me NRA members would rather their dues go to buying politicians than cover innocent victims bills?? Wow, that's choice. What a gawd-awful lot of people.

Is this what they call "Compassionate Conservatism?" Or is that not a thing anymore??

KarenInWA

For the record, if I was an NRA member, I'd be embarrassed and begging them to man/woman up. But that's just me.

[Rerun]

Okay.......  First of all the NRA does NOT KILL anyone.  They preserve our rights to carry guns and protect ourselves.  You would ban guns and then what.  Get Shot!  I don't give any $$ to them.  But I do give to the prolife foundation.

You are a supporter of Planned Parent hood who kill a million people a year.  Sad I have to bring this up.  But you don't think about it.  Just the woman's right to her body.  What about all the little women?  You should be the one embarrassed. 

Oh all PP does is Cancer Screenings..... BS  I called the Eastern WA and N. Idaho chapter to see if I could get a mammogram (to prove it to a friend) and "Oh, we don't do them here, but we can refer you".....   Well, hell, I can refer myself.  What a bunch of killers and liars. 

[solid98]

While it is true that it is the shooter's responsibility, it is also the responsibility of the NRA and the NRA-bought politicians for preventing reasonable gun control that allowed this gun nutter to purchase and harbor so much artillery w/o so much as a blink from anybody. Why is this a thing in this country??? Why are we a nation of paranoid, ball-tucking snowflakes who feel the need to collect mounds and mounds of things made for one purpose only ---- TO KILL??

NRA supports guns and ammo and little to no laws regarding purchase. They buy our government to make sure this is so. As a result of their lobbying, we had a tragedy happen upon innocents this past Sunday night. Now those people's lives are forever changed, as is the life of a thriving city. NRA needs to donate their $$ - as does their political puppets. These people never asked for any of this. I honestly don't see how anyone doesn't get that.

Now that it looks like "bump fire" stocks are going to be banned, the manufacturer's web site is all but shut down with all the people clamoring to buy all they can at premium mark ups. It was the same thing with "assault rifles" when the Brady Ban went into effect, and ratcheted up 10 fold after Barak Obama took office. When Trump took office, gun sales dropped dramatically. Now they will ramp up again. People in general, not just gun nuts, are like 2 year olds. You tell them something is off limits and that thing is all they want. All this over reacting is just putting more of these useless things on the street.

Do Pro-NRA people cuddle their guns at night???

KarenInWA

Just the one I sleep with under my pillow. 

[solid98]

even went so far as to form a trust

You might appreciate my trust name - "The Dog Gun Trust".  Carefully chosen since it has to be engraved on any SBR I make.

I wish I had done more research before I did the trust so I could come up with a better name than "The (My last name) Trust".

lso, couldn't make up my mind to go 5.56 or 300BLK.

9x19.  Way cheaper to shoot, easy to make ammo for, loads of fun.  5.56 is pricey; don't even want to think about paying for 300 blackout.

I wanted a rifle caliber and decided to do a 14" "just because".  I used to work with a guy who bent his own AK receivers and he had me mill him up a drill jig to finish them off. Funny thing, in Kansas, you are allowed to build your own firearms, and if you PROMISE to not take it out of state or sell or transfer it, you don't need a serial number. Gov Sam Brownback (who is up for the "Religious Ambassadorship") and Kris Kobach of Voter Suppression fame, passed legislation to try to say the firearms laws in Kansas "trumps" (see what I did there) federal law in regards to suppressor manufacturing. Some idiot made his own suppressors without a federal license, sold some, and made a YouTube video of him bragging about it. Long story short, he's doing federal time.

It's now being reported he was given a script for Valium, which, as we all know causes violent outbursts. 

Studies suggest that long term use of Valium, or any benzo, significantly increases the risk of dementia in late life.

I had always heard Valium was a "downer". The claims it caused violent tendencies just struck me as odd. Like they were trying to blame something, anything, for his behaviour.

For the record, I would not ever consider Fox News a credible news source.

The bias in both CNN (Clinton News Network) and Fox is obvious.  Remember when the homeowner held the escaped cons a gunpoint for the police?   I knew before even going to the web sites that how it went down with a civilian gun owner would be the headliner in the Foxnews story and buried very late in the article in the CNN store.   Each side has a tendency to claim that the network that takes their political side is the biased one, but the truth is both are.   You need to pay attention to not only those news sources that support your politics, but those that are on the other side, to get a balanced view.  And that is true no matter what side you are on.

I'm actually extremely skeptical of any "news" online or on TV, because they all just fall all over themselves to get the "news" out first. I put more stock (not much) in print media.

[lainiepop]

So saddened to see this terrible shooting massacre in Las Vegas. We booked our flights and hotel  for our 30 day usa trip bext summer literally the day before this happened. As soon as my 10 yr old son came home from school he was watching live updates from the situation and couldn't believe it either. Here in the UK cannot even comprehend this level of indiscriminate violence how can people even wander around with that many deadly weapons?  I guess u guys have a different way of life? Do u think America will ever tighten their gun laws? My heart and prayers go out to all of the innocent victims and  their families and the Las Vegas people.

[kickingandscreaming]

Do u think America will ever tighten their gun laws

Not really.  The NRA is very powerful and the 2nd Amendment people are passionate and misguided.  So the rest of us suffer.  I think Americans are more naturally violent than many other peoples.  And we have a "toxic masculinity" problem.

[Jean]

I am so grateful to live in The good old USA. At least we are allowed to have an opinion. It may not matter much, but we can still have it. The idea that American men have "violent tendencies" is rather ludicrous to me. Most of the men I know are very gentlemanly, tons of fun and very nice to us ladies. Of course, they are also all old too. Maybe they even wore out their "toxic Masculinity" problem too.  Yes, the NRA is very powerful and oh, hell no, the 2nd amendment people are not misguided at all. Maybe its you that is misguided. On the other hand, maybe it is me. Not every thing is black and white and not everything is set into cement. At any rate, we should all be praying for all these poor people who are homeless and especially as in Puerto Rico, no shelter and no food. How horrible.

[PrimeTimer]

I am so grateful to live in The good old USA. At least we are allowed to have an opinion. It may not matter much, but we can still have it. The idea that American men have "violent tendencies" is rather ludicrous to me. Most of the men I know are very gentlemanly, tons of fun and very nice to us ladies. Of course, they are also all old too. Maybe they even wore out their "toxic Masculinity" problem too.  Yes, the NRA is very powerful and oh, hell no, the 2nd amendment people are not misguided at all. Maybe its you that is misguided. On the other hand, maybe it is me. Not every thing is black and white and not everything is set into cement. At any rate, we should all be praying for all these poor people who are homeless and especially as in Puerto Rico, no shelter and no food. How horrible.

I totally agree with you, Jean.

We've been in the middle of moving so no TV, no computers, no news. Hubby heard it on the car radio. When I finally watched the news, I was sick. I am mourning for my country. I am praying for God's help with this.

When I think of countries where the people are not/were not allowed guns, I think of Pol Pot, Mao, Stalin and Lenin, just to name a few. I've been to and lived in countries where the people live under oppression. Real oppression. I don't want to ever be a subject, I want to remain a free citizen under our Constitution. 

[Rerun]

Last night I was listening to "Ground Zero" with Clyde Lewis on the radio.  People were calling in with a much different theory.

This was probably an international  illegal gun deal gone ..... very bad.  They were saying this 64 year old (out of shape) guy could not hold one of those guns and shoot it for more than a minute.  No way 10.  They kick and buck so bad that only an in shape soldier could do it.  Thus the 23 guns (that were left)  were laid out so orderly.  Explains the other guns in his house.  There was a phone charger found in the room that did not match Stephens phone.  There is proof that when he was gone in his vehicle someone used "his" card key to enter his room.  He did not act alone.  Not sure we will ever know the truth.  Something the government may never want us to know.

Police can't find anything on this guy?  He doesn't fit the profile?  He was a businessman...

[Jean]

 Well, that is interesting. I wonder if we will ever have everything explained to us in full.

[Simon Dog]

They kick and buck so bad that only an in shape soldier could do it.

I do not know about the other things, but the "kick and buck so badly" is just plain wrong for a 5.56/.223, and minimal for a 7.62/.308 in a gas operated rifle.  (the calibers and gun type reported).

The fact that the reporter got this simple item so wrong causes me to question the veracity of the rest of the report.

[kickingandscreaming]

He was a businessman...

in.


Only if you acknowledge that he was a professional gambler.  That's the business he was

[iolaire]

My conservative high school classmate on Facebook are already posting liberal conspiracy theory memes as if he didn't do it. And unfortunately also the anti vaccination liberals go for the same conspiracy theories as well.   Overall it's just sad.

[KarenInWA]

We all know that Vegas hotels/casinos have cameras everywhere, although most of them are focused on the casino itself. How long will it take for them to come up with video showing this kook bringing in all of his luggage filled with all of this? Even if he brought up one at a time? Are there cameras in the staircase that has been reported to be near the entrance of his suite? This is what I'm curious about. There should be concrete evidence, unless he's really good at detecting and avoiding all of the camera's eyes.

KarenInWA

[Rerun]

It wasn't a "reporter" but callers who know guns.  So, I don't know.  The show was pretty convincing. 

http://www.groundzeromedia.org/106-pathological-politiks-red-flags-vegas/

      Maybe I'm reaching....

[Simon Dog]

It wasn't a "reporter" but callers who know guns.

If the callers claimed the rifles he would use would "kick and buck badly" and that only a fit person could handle them, they did not know what they were talking about.   My guess is that they never fired a semi auto or full auto AR.   I've have experience with both calibers he was reported to use, and am factory certified by Armalite, so I know of what I speak.   Note that semi automatic (and full automatic) AR style rifles use a gas operated mechanism that significantly reduces felt recoil.

Carrying a gun case into a LV hotel was, until now, not an eye raising activity.   There are numerous places to shoot near LV, and there have been cases where hundreds of people checked in with long guns for competitons at Desert Sportsmens, and additional ones where 500+ people checked in with handguns.   To retroactively say someone doing something that had been accepted as normal for years is to blame the hotel for not having a qualified psychic on duty.

I watched the first 40 minutes of the CNN special on each of the victims.  It was very nicely done, but what was astonishing was the statistical fluke in which every single person killed was a "wonderful person" who would "give you the shirt off their back".  It was like Lake Woebegon where all children are above average.

[Bill Peckham]

There are so many weird things about this guy but one I have not heard talked about is the idea he was a "professional gambler" who played video poker - no professional gambler plays slots/video games unless they are cheating. Pro gamblers play sportsbook, blackjack and/or poker (face to face against other people) that's it, every other type of bet is just a way to give casinos money over time.

The security guard drew the nut's fire at the end of the rampage  https://www.cbsnews.com/news/jesus-campos-las-vegas-shooting-police-reveal-new-details-about-hero-security-guard/   over 200 rounds were fired into the hallway and none at the crowd after the security guard came on scene. How many people would have died if those two hundred rounds were directed at the crowd?

[Rerun]

There is no "peace" w/o Jesus and this country has turned its back on Him.

The Mainstream Media has no talk of another shooter.  Just the nut.  The conspiracy Media has the audio of the gun going off and you hear another one but different than the first one.  Not an echo either.  FBI and CIA are hiding something.

       

[Bill Peckham]

There is no "peace" w/o Jesus and this country has turned its back on Him.

The Mainstream Media has no talk of another shooter.  Just the nut.  The conspiracy Media has the audio of the gun going off and you hear another one but different than the first one.  Not an echo either.  FBI and CIA are hiding something.

   

So the President is in on it too?

[MooseMom]

I watched the first 40 minutes of the CNN special on each of the victims.  It was very nicely done, but what was astonishing was the statistical fluke in which every single person killed was a "wonderful person" who would "give you the shirt off their back".  It was like Lake Woebegon where all children are above average.

Yeah, I'd be willing to bet that at least one of the victims was a nasty piece of work, but no one would say that.

What I'd like to know is how many of those in attendance at this dreadful event are pro-gun and are now rethinking their position.

[MooseMom]

What I said is that the law abiding NRA members do not bear a collective responsibility for the criminal actions of an individual not acting on their behalf, in the same way that the Jewish community does not bear a collective responsibility for the criminal actions of a Jewish criminal.

This is probably a false equivalency.  Jewish people do not vote for Jewish criminals, whereas "law-abiding NRA members" vote for congressional representatives who will make it easier to get access to as many weapons as possible and so DO bear some collective responsibility.

However, if Israeli voters vote for government representatives who advocate the building of illegal settlements, then those people DO bear a collective responsibility for the conflict that ensues.

Elections have consequences, and the murders in Las Vegas are the consequence of voting in people who run on a pro-NRA agenda.

[Rerun]

Oh, now the timeline changed.  I'm telling you, this nut was an arms dealer, drug dealer, and a human trafficker probably to the Philippines.  He had two airplanes that have the numbers of a different plane on one tail that belongs to another tail.  Follow the money.   That explains all the money he gambled away or laundered.  He thought he had a good gig going until he got popped. 

Just saying......   

[MooseMom]

This....

http://time.com/4968842/one-undeniable-factor-in-gun-violence-men/?iid=sr-link3

Another mass shooting in America, another round of questions.  Was the shooter a terrorist or a lone wolf?  (Read: "Was he a Muslim?")  Did he have a political agenda?  Was he mentally ill?  Why would someone do this?  One question we never ask:  Was the shooter a man?  The answer is always the same.

Of the 134 mass shooters who have preyed on Am
ericans since 1966, three have been women, making mass shooting a 98% male enterprise.  Ninety percent of murderers are men-firearms at used in close to 70% of homicides.

Plenty has been written about the relationship between masculinity and guns:  how gunmakers center advertising campaigns on mach status, ow a startlingly high proportion of mass shooters have a history of abusing women, how more than half of mass hooting involve a man killing (or trying to kill) an intimate, taking others out along with her.  But the reality of American men and gun violence is as much about a hypermasculine fetishization of murder toys as it is about tribal identity, a deepening identification of self and clan that radicalizes marginal views and magnifies personal entitlement and social distrust.  This is a communal masculine ideology, not an individual one.  There is no lone wolf.  There is a rabid wolf pack.

Almost half of the world's civilian owned guns are in the hand of Americans.  But those guns are not distributed equally.  Many are hoarded by "super owners," a group of mostly male extremists who make up just 3% of the adult population but own an average of 17 guns apiece.  Women are increasingly buying handguns for protection, and that seems to be their actual motivation  they own a single gun, and they keep it in case of an emergency (one suspects that the imagine assailant they are protection themselves from is a man).

Male gun owners are more likely to bind their recreational lives and identities to guns and "gun culture," according to Pew:  they hung, go shooting, watch gun related shows on TV and seek out more gun related recreation and information.  This intersects with other aspects of identity  95% of conservative Republican gun owners agree that "the right to own guns is essential to their own sense of freedom."  White men are much more likely to own guns than non-whites, and the super owners amassing arsenals of weapons are particularly likely to be white, male and conservative.  Among gun hoarders-those who own at least five guns-almost half say being a gun ownder is "very important" to their identity....

In other words, there is less a broad American fixatin with guns than there is a subculture of mostly white, mostly male, and mostly conservative gun obsessives.  Within this group, gun ownership is as much a hoppy and an effort at self-defense as it is a way to forge an identity and bond with a like-minded community.  The gun is simply the (extremely literal) exterman symbol of the underlying ideaology:  white male power comes through physical domination....[/I]

There is more.  I'd be interesting in thoughts from those who've read the entire article.