Help Me Explain Things 2 My Uncle!!!

[TynyWonder]

I have just recently moved to TN to be close to an Aunt & Uncle and they (well my Uncle) has begun to ask me questions about dialysis and kidney failure and he asked me to explain the deal about the dialysis machine only doing 10% of our kidney function.  I cannot really exaplin it to him and I did try but I did not make sense.  Basically, what he would like to know is.........since the machine only does 10% kidney function does that mean a good kidney only needs to function at 10% to do what it needs to do?  I soooo hope someone can help me explain things to him.........send me a link...........tell me what you know in "plain english" where he and I both will understand it............SOMETHING!!!        Thanks so much!!!!

Tammy

[Chris]

I'm sure someone can explain it better.
10% is still not enough, but helps. The machine can not clean the body 24 hours a day like a natural kidney can do. So toxin build up that would normally be cleaned out by the kidney and flushed out thru urine. I should read the Baxter packet about the forms of dialysis I have somewhere that explains it in well in a non intelectual way.

I think either Stauff or Zach explained this in an old post or someone did. I can't remember. Hopefully they will see this and reply tomorrow or the next day.

[twirl]

only 10%
I did not know that

[RichardMEL]

Chris is spot on. Let's say you do 4 hour treatments x 3 a week, so 12 hours of dialysis a week that's 7% of the week doing dialysis. The other 94% of the time you are not having your kidney function replaced by the machine, so yes, it only does 7-10% of the work of a normal functioning set of kidneys to keep you alive - because normal kidneys function 24/7.

[Hawkeye]

Try the article I posted here http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=9439.msg159088#msg159088 .  It a pretty good basic explanation of dialysis and other things involved with it.

[TynyWonder]

Thanks to everyone who has already responded and I did read the link/article and did not really find any explanation about dialysis only doing 10% kidney function.  I also changed the subject thinking it might help me to get more answers.............I dunno.......... Also, I feel like this topic is in the wrong forum but how it ended up in this forum is because, I was looking through the FAQ and did not find any info I was looking for and just reacted before I thought and put it in here.  Therefore, if anyone feels this topic needs to be moved then please feel free to do so.  I would move it myself but I don't know how.   You all have a happy little day!

Tammy

[Chris]

Have you asked anyone at the clinic who seems smart enough to work there?
I didn't read the link yet, at school and now I was thinking that maybe the two methods can be broken down. Kidney Can Do This and Dialysis Machine Can Do This. We know the kidney has many functions a dialysis machine can not perform, which means more meds in some cases. I'm pretty sure there is material out there on the web or atleast maybe the local hospital library. I'll try searching tomorrow.

[TynyWonder]

Thanks again for your help and I do plan to ask my clinic tomorrow...........I had just forgotten to ask yesterday while I was there............

[paris]

I hope you find the right answers.  I do know that at I am at 14% and the neph says I am still functioning at a level better than dialysis.   So, he explained it that right now I have that function 24/7 and dialysis would not match that.  Let us know what your center says.

[TynyWonder]

will do!   

[flip]

Okay...here's a question for the experts:

If a patient has 10% residual function and dialyzes 3x weekly, does that mean that they are at or near 20% overall?

[boxman55]

 Maybe this will help


Dialysis removes urea and other waste products from the blood. To find out how well dialysis is working, you will have blood tests that look at the level of urea in your blood. Usually, these tests are done once a month, at the beginning of your session and again at the end. In general, two measures indicate how well dialysis is working: urea reduction ratio (URR) and Kt/V.

Urea reduction ratio
One way to measure how well hemodialysis is removing urea from the body is to measure blood urea nitrogen (BUN) level. The BUN is measured before and after your treatment session. Then, the two numbers are compared to see how much the urea level in the blood has decreased. This difference is called the urea reduction ratio (URR), and it is usually expressed as a percentage. An adequate dose of hemodialysis should result in an average URR of 65%.1

Kt/V
Another way to measure the effectiveness of hemodialysis is to compare the amount of fluid that is cleared of urea during each dialysis session with the amount of fluid that exists in the body. This is called the Kt/V.

Kt represents the amount of fluid that is cleared of urea during each dialysis session. It is measured in milliliters per minute (mL/min).
V represents the volume of water a person's body contains.
The Kt/V is the most accurate measure of hemodialysis because it also measures the amount of urea removed with excess fluid and takes into consideration other factors, such as weight loss during dialysis. An adequate dose of hemodialysis should result in an average Kt/V of 1.2.1

What to think about
An adequate dose of dialysis can usually be delivered in 3 to 5 hours.
Inadequate doses of hemodialysis (hemodialysis URR percentages that average below 65% or Kt/V values below 1.2) increase the risk of complications and death

[flip]

I'm familiar with URR and Kt/V. I'm wondering how accurate a GFR measurement is when a person is on dialysis.

[TynyWonder]

Thanks boxman, I am going to send that to him and see what he says...........thanks so much!

[Wallyz]

Yes, you can get along with 10% kidney function, but its like trying to breathe with 10% lung function.

Flip, i think so, because they tried to add my residual function to my clearance to say that 3 days was enough in center.  I argued that I needed 4 ,as it was decreasing rapidly,and they relented.

[Rerun]

Just tell your uncle that he can live with one kidney just fine!  That is all he needs to know!  Get It? 

                                                                                                         

[okarol]

Just tell your uncle that he can live with one kidney just fine!  That is all he needs to know!  Get It? 

                                                                                                         

Yeah, tell him he can give you one and see it in action!

[Chris]

Just tell your uncle that he can live with one kidney just fine!  That is all he needs to know!  Get It? 

                                                                                                         

Yeah, tell him he can give you one and see it in action!

Ummmm, you might want to rephrase that one. 

[flip]

If I take my serum creatinine from the latest labs and plug it in to the GFR calculator, I come up with 19. I'm assuming that reflects my 10% from dialysis plus my residual kidney function.

[TynyWonder]

Thanks guys for so many responses!    I am sure I can just tell you all that he was/is beginning to irriate with me all his questions like in "how" he asks them...........it's kinda like in disbelief of everything to do with the dialysis machine and kidney failure??  WTF?!!!  U KNOW?  Anyway, I am definitely going to ask them tomorrow at dialysis and I will report back to yall and him, deal?      Until then, tho, keep the responses coming, I am enjoying them!

Tammy

[twirl]

you will be tired
you may come home with bloody clothes
your arm will change as time goes on
you will be cranky
but you will be alive