Dialysis and Depression

[Bub]

Seems like so many of us are on antidepressants.  I know that my doctor has slowly been working through different drugs and dosages, and I am feeling much better mentally and emotionally.  My real life (my life away and unrelated to ESRD) has been very chaotic lately but I feel more stable and more able to deal with all of these other things going on.  I feel my depression was situational as opposed to clinical and I have always understood that antidepressants were not called for in situational depression, and in fact would not help.  This is apparently not true.  I waited a long, very dark time before seeking help and I wish now that I had spoke up much sooner.

[paris]

Bub, Great to hear you are doing better.  I didn't really think I needed meds, but what a difference they have made in my everyday life.  I can handle situations better and just feel more in control of me.  I still get mad, cry, and can get upset, but everything is in perspective.   Your experience will help another who may be hesitant to try medication.   Thanks for sharing.   

[cariad]

I'm so glad antidepressants helped you, Bub. I did not have a positive experience with them, and was actually kicked out of a psychiatrist's office once for refusing to try more. I think chronic illness and depression are the norm, and those who get a boost from medications are truly fortunate.

I used to volunteer at a suicide hotline, and it was amazing the number of people who would say they would rather kill themselves than try medications. But.... But.... you can always change your mind about the meds and come off them....

[girliekick]

situational or clinical, the chemicals in ur brain do the same thing. Glad u feel better, im in the process of getting back on something. 

[dwcrawford]

For any depression, take what you need to get through it.  But when the chemicals work t start using the tools you learned in therapy or wherever you got them, to work through it without the meds.  The tools work.  Like me back when I had a job, they didn't work all the time, but most of the times they can get the job done.  Be ready though, to recognize the symptoms if and when they come up again, and when you need meds,  go for it.

Depression sucks.  Depression makes everything else suck too.

[Sunny]

I've been on and off of anti-depressants for years. Now I only take them in crisis when I'm feeling really low for too long. Constant every day use is not affective for me anymore. I'm glad they helped you. I agree with cariad that chronic renal disease and depression go hand in hand. In addition to your anti-depressants, try to learn coping mechanisms too. One of my favorites is to "disappear" into a favorite place I've been -- a good relaxation technique when feeling overwhelmed or stressed.

[paris]

I've been on and off of anti-depressants for years. Now I only take them in crisis when I'm feeling really low for too long. Constant every day use is not affective for me anymore. I'm glad they helped you. I agree with cariad that chronic renal disease and depression go hand in hand. In addition to your anti-depressants, try to learn coping mechanisms too. One of my favorites is to "disappear" into a favorite place I've been -- a good relaxation technique when feeling overwhelmed or stressed.

I disappear too, Sunny.  I swim with the sea turtles.  In a secluded bay in Kona, swimming beside these calm huge turtles, exotic fish, coral reefs.  It is one of the best relaxation techniques for me.   And I always go back to Lamaze training and deep breathing.  It worked for labor pains and all these years later, it still helps relax me.     Anything we can find that works!   

[JennyGiggle]

Its good to know that others have been feeling down. I felt kinda ashamed to mention this to my doctor, like I wouldn't be appreciating the wonderful treatment and 2nd chance that i've been given with Dialysis. I think I might tell him how down I have been feeling. I suppose i am just worried that people have been thinking I am really strong and coping really well, I don't want to admit that I am not.

[dwcrawford]

Again, I post my thought processes and have not reached any conclusions as to my statements here.

 I don't think dialysis or physical illness cause depression but rather that symptoms, treatments, life restriction, etc. tend to prod a little and accent the depression.  Is that possible.

Also, I wonder if it is healthy to share depression issues with others "in the same boat" so to speak.  I keep thinking "my dog is bigger than your dog" and  "my dad can beat up your dad".  Could it be that "my depression is worse than your depression."

As always, I don't really accept this as fact, but it is running through my mind at the moment.

[willowtreewren]

Dan, I think that is a good question. And I think the answer will be particular to the individual and the situation. I sometimes find that simply saying that I'm feeling the cold fingers of depression starting to strangle my heart will bring relief. Other times it is better for me to suck it up and push through it. For about 2 years of my life (many years ago) I struggled with suicidal thoughts. It was a dark, dark period.

I was listening to a report about post tragedy (like Haiti) depression. For many, focusing on the current issues only magnifies them. I have learned to over-ride my internal voice when I hear it say that I'm so unhappy. It isn't easy.

So, there are many ways of dealing. But depression is a real issue for many!

Aleta

[RobinX2]

My wife tried to commit suicide on 13th of January because of depression / PTSD...  so I feel sooooooo compelled to post on this thread.  I feel like I am living in that "dark" place right now... even if it wasn't my choice.  I can tell you this for a fact... and please take it as fact... depression can strike anyone at any given time!  It does not discriminate!!!  DEPRESSION is nothing to over look or think it will go away in time, when things get 'easier' for us. Please, don't be fooled to think depression can just go away. It follows and lerks us all, until one snaps.  There is no shame in taking meds... infact, I respect the individuals who gets treatment and is honest about it.  Do relaxation or whatever.  Do anything to help!  Because I can gaurantee.. if you don't recognize 'depression' when it hits home... the consequences are dang fatal! 

The mere fact that someone was genuine enough to start this post... is admirable!  Thank you for posting, and acknowledging for us.  You may have saved someone's life!  Ya never know.

[fc2821]

Again, I post my thought processes and have not reached any conclusions as to my statements here.

 I don't think dialysis or physical illness cause depression but rather that symptoms, treatments, life restriction, etc. tend to prod a little and accent the depression.  Is that possible.

Also, I wonder if it is healthy to share depression issues with others "in the same boat" so to speak.  I keep thinking "my dog is bigger than your dog" and  "my dad can beat up your dad".  Could it be that "my depression is worse than your depression."

As always, I don't really accept this as fact, but it is running through my mind at the moment.

Dan, I think that is a good question. And I think the answer will be particular to the individual and the situation. I sometimes find that simply saying that I'm feeling the cold fingers of depression starting to strangle my heart will bring relief. Other times it is better for me to suck it up and push through it. For about 2 years of my life (many years ago) I struggled with suicidal thoughts. It was a dark, dark period.

I was listening to a report about post tragedy (like Haiti) depression. For many, focusing on the current issues only magnifies them. I have learned to over-ride my internal voice when I hear it say that I'm so unhappy. It isn't easy.

So, there are many ways of dealing. But depression is a real issue for many!

Aleta

    I think  Aleta's right.   I was  pretty depressed, for a time before dialysis, but I just "lived with it".  Not something everyone can do.  Sure it affected my outlook on life, but I was able to "function".  It was like (I know this sounds rude, sorry) being a "functional illterate". You do "things" to "get by" and hide it from others.  Oh, they notice some is wrong, but you "seem ok" most of the time.  And, of course you don't feel you need any professional help, because "are they going to make things the way they were?  Of course not, they can't bring someone back from the dead?  Of course not. Are can they give the life I knew back. Don't silly. "  Not a good attitude to have.  So, I just "plodded along" till things changed in my life.  I was lucky, someone cared enough about me to make me care and make me realise the person I was geiving would not have wanted me to be like that. And, luckily I didn't get worse. 
      I know, and knew then, I wasn't as depressed as some people. I could function, maybe needing to be there for someone else (my mother) who was dependent upon me did that.  I have no doubt, if my wife (now) had not come back into my life, when I lost my mother things would have gotten worse.  I'd lost my first wife and all my family. I was all alone.   Hey, when you tell yourself, "I hate my life" you're in pretty bad shape.  You need to get help, you won't get better on your own.

     I look at things differently now, I no longer hate my life.  I know will sound silly to some of you. But almost dying and loosing my kidneys were nothing compared to how depression can take over your life. I wish I could tell you "It'll get better, just give it time"  But things don't work that way.  I think it is different for everyone and you need to get help no matter how well you "function".  It is foolish to Expect someone to come into your life and change it.  Oh, it happens, but it highly unlikely to happen. So, if you feel depressed, you are and you need to get some help.
       Like Robyn said it can hit anyone.  Don't "It can't happen to me!"  oh yes it can. There's no shame in it. No one is up beat all the time, not lettings things affect them.  God, or the Flying spaghetti Moster, or Mother Nature or whatever you believe in didn't make help available if you weren't meant to use when you need it.   my

[willowtreewren]

And I just want to add that some people think that medicating for depression is a sign of weakness. NOT SO!

Depression is a chemical imbalance in the brain that often becomes a self-sustaining feedback loop. Meds can break the cycle.

It is REALLY hard on folks who are suffering from depression to hear that they could get better if they wanted to, so if anyone here on IHD feels the need to voice that opinion (again), please bugger off.

Sorry to get a bit emotional about it. But that is MY 

We need to be supporting of one another, not condemning or belittling. 

[dwcrawford]

I didn't really see where anyone said not to take meds.  Rather most people are adovcation take them to "break a cycle" and then easy off when you can -- if you can. 

[paris]

My wife tried to commit suicide on 13th of January because of depression / PTSD...  so I feel sooooooo compelled to post on this thread.  I feel like I am living in that "dark" place right now... even if it wasn't my choice.  I can tell you this for a fact... and please take it as fact... depression can strike anyone at any given time!  It does not discriminate!!!  DEPRESSION is nothing to over look or think it will go away in time, when things get 'easier' for us. Please, don't be fooled to think depression can just go away. It follows and lerks us all, until one snaps.  There is no shame in taking meds... infact, I respect the individuals who gets treatment and is honest about it.  Do relaxation or whatever.  Do anything to help!  Because I can gaurantee.. if you don't recognize 'depression' when it hits home... the consequences are dang fatal! 

The mere fact that someone was genuine enough to start this post... is admirable!  Thank you for posting, and acknowledging for us.  You may have saved someone's life!  Ya never know.

Thank you for sharing this.  I am so sorry for your wife's struggle.  And for what you are both going through.  Your statement was very real and heartfelt.  You may have touched someone today and make a difference in their life.   

[dwcrawford]

I was once told by an IHD member that he could  slap the depression out of me.  He didn't.

[willowtreewren]

Perhaps he thought that slapping you would cure HIS depression! 

Couldn't resist, Dan. You set that one up! 

[dwcrawford]

actually I think sluff cured lizard's depression

[cariad]

For me, the biggest help, maybe the only help, for situational depression is to have a clear plan with very specific steps. I think that's why I am OK with my life at the moment - I am sloooowly moving through this process that has taken some 5 years to come to fruition. I am so sure this is going to work that I have to suppress my enthusiasm, because the transplant surgeon insists that I articulate my understanding that it could fail.

The depression that I hate the most is when I have no idea what would help or why I am feeling so low. If I knew what to do when that strikes, I would let all of you know. It feels like you can't breathe.

[willowtreewren]

The depression that I hate the most is when I have no idea what would help or why I am feeling so low. If I knew what to do when that strikes, I would let all of you know. It feels like you can't breathe.

OMG, Cariad, you nailed it!

Being blind-sided by depression just plain sucks! Because there is no thinking through it and working out of it by figuring it out.

I HAVE learned through the years that February is the worst month of the year. I have finally figured out that I suffer from SAD. It helps to know....but doesn't fix anything.

[RichardMEL]

Its good to know that others have been feeling down. I felt kinda ashamed to mention this to my doctor, like I wouldn't be appreciating the wonderful treatment and 2nd chance that i've been given with Dialysis. I think I might tell him how down I have been feeling. I suppose i am just worried that people have been thinking I am really strong and coping really well, I don't want to admit that I am not.

Jenny - welcome to the human race!! Guess what - you're normal!  (that doesn't mean boring btw!)

I understand that you wouldn't want to admit to being down or stuff like that but it's VERY understandable and you don't need to be superhuman. It's GOOD that you discuss this stuff with your doctor, because your treatment isn't just about dialysis and drugs, but your attitudes and emotional well being too.

A nurse said to me around the time I started on dialysis that your ATTITUDE is as important to your treatment as your meds. Being positive and feeling OK with things (yeah, easier said than done!) really can affect ypur physical health.

That doesn't mean "smile and pretend the world is awesome!" because that's faking it and inside you still feel like crap. I get that. Some days, specially when D is going wrong or I feel like crap... I just don't want to know about it. Other days I feel upbeat(usually on non-D days when I'm working, or chasing girls, or doing other "normal" stuff - well as normal as I get anyway  ).

That's what I try and do - concentrate on positives in my life. Focus on what I've got rather than what I haven't... and of course I have that goal in the back of my mind of a life with transplant hopefully much more normal to look forward to (to be totally honest if I did not have that option to look forward to as a goal I am not sure HOW I would deal).

It's totally normal and totally understandable to be upset, depressed, down, angry and all kinds of other things about the bad stuff life has thrust your way. If you didn't I think it would be a worry too because nobody's like that and going to be OK I reckon. Better to let it out and deal with it than bottle it up and pretend it isn't there.. that can only lead to bad places I reckon (like Robin's post illustrated).

When I feel like that and how sucky life is and how much I want to drink that ice cold coke.... I think of others I know who are suffering through much worse than I am....

[girliekick]

ive always struggled w depression, that i feel is closely related to anxiety.  i have been off meds for 4 or 5 mo. Last month my pdoc suggested cymbalta that may also help w some physical symptoms. (my health and tx status have been below par for 2 mo) during a few day stint of feeling better, i tried to start the new med. It brought back my nausea w a vengeance, i only took it for 4 days.  i felt good today, so i am trying to decide if i should try it agian or just talk to my docs about it. Ive tried celexa, effexor, and lexapro. I also take attavan prn. I have been nauseated for 2 to3 mo and just cant stand the thought of risking it. My depression is not as bad as it has been in the past, but i am sad most of the time lately. Im not having suicidal thoughts. Just sad and have a strong urg to isolate and then feel lonely once i do. Thats the loop i am in.  feedback welcomed
girl

[peleroja]

It's official; I am now depressed.  Kaiser sent out a flyer yesterday, and according to it I am officially depressed.  My depression has nothing to do with my kidney problems (at least I don't think so).  I am just so tired of being in constant pain and fatigue.  My pain comes from my arthritis (knees, back, pretty much everywhere there's a joint).  My fatigue could either be the kidneys or the low thyroid.  So many illnesses; so little time!  I think it's time to investigate that stuff they shoot directly into the knees and it allegedly lasts for 3-4 months.  It's for darned sure none of the pills are working to alleviate the pain.

[cariad]

That's what I try and do - concentrate on positives in my life. Focus on what I've got rather than what I haven't... and of course I have that goal in the back of my mind of a life with transplant hopefully much more normal to look forward to (to be totally honest if I did not have that option to look forward to as a goal I am not sure HOW I would deal).

I feel the same way, Richard. I have actually been told (multiple times) that I could not get the transplant I wanted, and I went in to a profound depression every time. I think if I were told there was no hope of another transplant, I would have to concentrate on investigating new technologies as much as possible and try to find a doctor willing to take a chance on me. (Which is essentially what I had to do to get the stem cell trial I am about to receive.)

I think it is really helpful to focus on the positives as much as possible, but if someone in perfect health were to tell me this, I would probably step in with This is not something that one can admonish someone else to do. It really has to come from within. A few years ago, I was on a transplant listserv and a psychologist wrote in with her results of a study that she had done with volunteers from the list. She divided volunteers into two groups, and had them chart their moods - one group also would spend time every day listing what it is they are grateful for in life, the other group acted as a control and would just chart moods. She found (from a very small sample) that those who made the "gratitude list" reported better moods. All right, fine, I can see that. She then said that she was going to present her findings at a convention of transplant doctors, and urge "gratitude interventions" for patients. All I could think was "Oh, sweet Jesus, NO!!!!"

I heard throughout my life what a pessimist I was, and constantly had doctors and my parents tell me that my attitude was the problem. I admit, I was probably the angriest kid they'd ever seen, and anger and non-compliance have been shown to be strongly correlated in kids (duh!). (I shut the hospital down the day I climbed out onto a ledge and threatened to jump from about 7 stories up.) Not once have I ever felt that anyone has helped me by telling me to look on the bright side, but when I do it of my own volition, it works. There is the subtle (not really) difference for me. I am not a pessimist, I am a realist, and being told by any medical person that I am causing my own illness or exacerbating it through attitude would not go over well with me - never has, never will. And of course, my transplant has lasted 34 years, so today doctors love to look at me and rewrite history: "Wow, so you must have really followed that drug regimen faithfully and taken a true, active interest in your health from a young age." Yeah, sure.

[ODAT]

I take anti-depressants. They have helped me so much. I used to cry all the time, extremely emotional. Crying wasn't the only thing though, I would get so anxious and agitated other times. The antiD helped for years. All the while taking them I still had anxiety attacks (especially right before my cycle - sorry ). About two weeks ago I started another med in addition to the antiD, 10mg daily of prozac. I am just starting to feel "evened out." I know this may sound like I am loading up, but I also got Ativan for rare occassions. I sometimes get so worked up I shake all over.

I can say I like myself now and feel stable. Everyone is different and sometimes it takes a while to get the right type of med and dosage. Good luck and take care.

And, as others have found, if you've been on antiD's and you're feeling so good you think you can go off, most of the time that doesn't work. You are feeling better BECAUSE of the med. Depression is real. When you can recognize that you need help, you are fortunate. Granted, there are mild depressions people can deal with by themselves, but you shouldn't be afraid to try and help yourself with meds.