The Trump/Russia connection thread

[MooseMom]

Wow, thanks Cassandra.  I'd bet that Robert Mueller has all of that information now, and more.

I still am uncertain as to why Congress is being so meek about all of this.  The real test will be to see if stronger sanctions are put on Russia in light of the 12 indictments.  Some Republican Congresspeople are really pushing for stronger sanctions while others, well, not so much.

[Jean]

With all respect to Cassandra, who I really like and with respect to WTW who said, research,research,research:

Avaaz was founded by two men, named Ricken Patel and Jeremy Heimans. the problem comes a little further and this " black Ops" is founded by George Soros. Now THERE is a nasty man. Research anything this man says and all of it is bad. He wants to separate and segregate America and put most of us into gas ovens. I would be left alone for that, because I am fair haired and REALLY fair skinned. Altho I AM old.  In this life, I would never, ever want this man to attain his goals and if you were smart, so would you. Needless to say George SOROS Hates DJT and now you can see why. If it aint there, George will either make it up or make it happen.

[iolaire]

With all respect to Cassandra, who I really like and with respect to WTW who said, research,research,research:

Avaaz was founded by two men, named Ricken Patel and Jeremy Heimans. the problem comes a little further and this " black Ops" is founded by George Soros. Now THERE is a nasty man. Research anything this man says and all of it is bad. He wants to separate and segregate America and put most of us into gas ovens.

Can you point me out to where George Soros says he wants to put people in Gas Ovens on either of the Soros websites or foundations?
https://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/
Our Mission
The Open Society Foundations work to build vibrant and tolerant democracies whose governments are accountable and open to the participation of all people

https://www.georgesoros.com/philanthropy/
Open Society Foundations
Open Society was established in 1979 when George Soros decided he had enough money. His great success as a hedge fund manager allowed him to pursue his ambition of establishing open societies in place of authoritarian forms of government. “Open society is based on the recognition that our understanding of the world is inherently imperfect,” Soros said. “What is imperfect can be improved.” He started by supporting scholarships for black students at the University of Cape Town in South Africa and for Eastern European dissidents to study abroad.

[Jean]

Not at the moment, but I will start looking for his posts. I have read a LOT of them in the past few years.

[MooseMom]

I absolutely agree with Jean that, especially these days, we all have a patriotic duty to research, research, research.  As part of that, it is again absolutely critical that we look at the source(s) of stories we read because fake news IS out there.

I don't know anything about these avaaz people, but just looking at the links that Cassandra posted, it doesn't look like avaaz made up those stories (many of which I'd already read), rather, they just aggregated them.

Avaaz and/or George Soros is not the story here.  The story is the possible conspiracy of Trump/his campaign with Putin's Russia, probably for financial gain.  The story is also becoming one of whether or not certain members of Congress may also be involved.  The story is also becoming one of obstruction of justice as Trump doubles down on his contempt for Mueller, his investigation and for our intelligence services.

[PrimeTimer]

With all respect to Cassandra, who I really like and with respect to WTW who said, research,research,research:

Avaaz was founded by two men, named Ricken Patel and Jeremy Heimans. the problem comes a little further and this " black Ops" is founded by George Soros. Now THERE is a nasty man.

Of course Jean is right. She's a Republican and Trump supporter.    Here's who Ricken Patel is and his connection to Soros. Both are anti-Trump. Gee, wonder why...

You can read more about who are Lefties and unAmerican commies at Discover The Networks
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/individualProfile.asp?indid=2498

[cassandra]

WHAT? He is a Christian? I'm an atheist, so I clearly should not engage, read or have anything to do with an organisation started by christian people?
Obviously nobody is perfect, but reading through this thread and tonnes of info in the real world, the Trump/Russia connection is scary. And so is the Brexit/Russia connection

[Rerun]

You can't show the beauty of music to a deaf person and you can't show the beauty of art to a blind person.  In other words, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.

So I won't argue.  If a person is willing to listen, then we have debate. 

[willowtreewren]

You can't show the beauty of music to a deaf person and you can't show the beauty of art to a blind person.  In other words, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.

So I won't argue.  If a person is willing to listen, then we have debate.

The problem with your "arguments," Rerun, is that you offer up opinions, but little in the way of substance. While others are doing their due diligence in researching the veracity of claims, you seem to fall back on "spin" from known propaganda sources. Having said that, we are all subject to the echo chambers of our bubbles. It just pays to read through information coming from reliable sources to see if it makes sense.

One of the scariest conditions of the "fake news" era we are now living in, is the break down of trust over all in news sources. THAT is a great first step in destabilizing our democracy. The question to ask is: Who benefits politically from that strategy?

Another good question to ask is: Who stands to make money from current policies?

If you follow the money trail, you might discover that this administration is NOT championing the regular people.

[iolaire]

Another "prominent" patriot accepting money from the alleged Russian spy and NRA friend:
Ex-Sheriff David Clarke’s 2015 trip expenses paid by alleged Russian agent’s group
https://fox6now.com/2018/07/17/woman-charged-with-being-covert-russian-agent-had-ties-to-former-sheriff-david-clarke/

[Rerun]

I cannot SEE enough to READ your reams and reams and reams of research.  But, BY GOD, I've got my opinion from what I hear and I'm going to say it!!  You can show me reams and reams of research that man walked on the moon....  but you can't prove it.  All you've got is reams and reams.  Reams and reams of science offering Evolution.  It changes every few years. 

Faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.  I have FAITH!

If Donald Trump colluded with Russia there would be evidence.  If there were evidence he would be impeached.  There isn't any evidence..  He said there was no collusion! And I believe him.  We are on like page 20 of this thread for God's sake.  Reams and Reams of links.  Nothing done to Trump except pure hate.  I feel sorry for you folks. 

Poop stinks -  I want to see all your links to prove me wrong on that one!  I'm sure MM will try...... 

[MooseMom]

Rerun, there is such a thing as misplaced faith.  Sometimes "faith" is merely believing what you want to believe is true. 

Do you really think that men didn't walk on the moon?

Yes, poop stinks. 

[Rerun]

But, you also need to RESERVE THE RIGHT TO BE WRONG.  I do, do YOU? 

I believe that Trump did not collude with the Russians.  So?  We will see. 

Any links I do put up people say they are not "valid"  Fox isn't valid, Rush isn't valid.  And I say to you.... NYT is FAKE NEWS, CNN is FAKE NEWS.  So there you have it.  A divided Nation.

I do question weather Man walked on the moon.  The Space Station is 240 miles up.  The Moon is 240,000 miles up.  Yes, I question that back in 1969 we had the technology to get to the moon, walk on it, televise it, and get home.  I saw it on TV, but what if that was filmed in a studio.  Remember, again with Russia, we were in a space race.  Bright idea:  Let's just film that we go walk on the moon to screw with Russia.    Could be.

 

[kickingandscreaming]

Sounds like you're just a very paranoid person who worships idols.

[Jean]

Now that is a very sad statement if I have ever heard one. Sounds like you are saying, " if you dont agree with me and I cant change your mind, then there is something wrong with you "  We are all entitled to our opinions and we have the right to disagree with each other but name calling is NOT acceptable.

[willowtreewren]

I offer this for anyone who is interested. It analyzes different news sources for reliability/accuracy and left/right bias.

When I consume news that has definite bias, I try to keep that in mind. While I don't totally avoid sources that fall low on reliability, I keep THAT in mind, too.

When listening to news that has a high number of "emotional" hooks, I tend to be VERY WARY, because that is often a way for commentators to manipulate us. We CAN arm ourselves against manipulation if we want to.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-biased-is-your-news-source-you-probably-wont-agree-with-this-chart-2018-02-28

Aleta

[Michael Murphy]

For those keeping track, Michael Cohen has indicated he has proof that Comrade Trump knew about and approved the Trump Tower Russia meeting.   If true collusion is closer to be proven.  God this is more fun then Watergate. 

[Paul]

For those keeping track, Michael Cohen has indicated he has proof that Comrade Trump knew.........

This was one of my all time favourite radio news reports, not because of the content but because of the reporter's comment on the subject: The report included the fact that Rudy Giuliani defended POTUS by saying that Michael Cohen was a pathological liar. The reporter ended the peace by pointing out that if Rudy Giuliani is correct, then we can assume that when Michael Cohen worked for Trump then everything he said to defend Trump, was a lie!

[Michael Murphy]

Fourty six years ago my republican father had complete faith in Richard Nixon.  Defended him at every turn from attacks from the damn liberals who were persecuting his president.  His faith never wavered in the belief that Nixon was innocent.  When the recordings were released causing Nixon’s resignation my father was crushed. It took Reagan election to revive his faith. 

[Michael Murphy]

Now the Trump team is announcing that collusion is not a crime, yes it is not, but the charges would be conspiracy or accessory .
Both included in the meaning of collusion.

[Rerun]

There was collusion.... by the DNC and Hillary who PAID for the fake dossier about Trump.  And nothing was done.  This is just like Watergate only the teams have switched. 

[Simon Dog]

Now the Trump team is announcing that collusion is not a crime, yes it is not, but the charges would be conspiracy or accessory .
Both included in the meaning of collusion.

The planned or assisted act, however, must be a crime for conspiracy or accessory to be unlawful.

What crime are they talking about here, other than offending those who wanted a Clinton victory?

[Michael Murphy]

Hacking computers is a absolute crime.  It is both a federal crime covered under wire fraud statutes , and a cyber crime.  Breaking in to a system obtaining files should get 20 years in a federal prison.  Requesting the breakin is both accessory and conspiracy and felonies. 

[Bill Peckham]

Well now what can the President do? Manifort has signed a plea deal promising full cooperation in the Russia probe.

The thing I'm wondering - what about the R primaries? Did the coordination with Russia start when Manifort came on? I kinda doubt it. The analytic work and subsequent social media manipulation (the "bots") appears to have started before the first primaries. How are R supporters of one of the other 16 candidates for the nomination going to feel when it comes out the R primaries were Ratf***ed by Roger stone and the Russians?

Back when I had season tickets to the local hockey team this is the point where we would start rattling our keys, suggesting it was time for the other team to start up their bus because they were done. Does Marine One have keys?

[Michael Murphy]

A bad day for the presidunce first he announced that 3000 people did not die Puerto Rico, obviously believed that he is god and raised them from the dead.  Dialysis patient could not get treatments for months, no power no water.  The only help provided by thr Trump administration was a handful of rolls of paper towels carelessly thrown to a crowd by thr Presidunce.  Then Manafort signed a plea agreement to cooperate with the Muellar investigation.  Who knows what him and Mike Flynn can testify to about the Russians.  All told the Presidunce is in for a rough fall, with a Democratic house and possibly a democratic Senate.