Baxter vs. Fresenius?

[carlosld]

Hi you!!
I'm from Panama and we received our treatment by social security institution. We are about 500 patients on PD, some use Baxter and others use Fresenius. Currently we are facing a bid that would force all patients using the treatment of one of these companies. I would like to hear from you as to which of the two companies is best in equipment, supplies, technical support, etc.. in short, which helps us get a better quality of life and treatment?
thanks to everyone,

[Willis]

I use a Baxter HomeChoicePro at home and it is a very modern and up-to-date device. It has a pump so it drains and fills very quickly (about 15 mins) and the the pressure-flow rate is adjustable for comfort. I like it that I can change most of the settings to meet my needs. I can for example reduce the total dialysis time if I start late and need to get started an hour earlier the next day, or if I'm sleeping in I can add an hour. Or if I just need to get discconnected or stop a dwell ten minutes from the end it's easy to bypass. The Baxer tubing is thin, light and easy to manage. Delivery service and special orders have been perfect after more than 2 years: A+ for service.

My experience with Fresenius PD was while in the hospital. I believe the Fresenius unit I used is the institutional version. It is GRAVITY fed and very slow and drain/fill cycle was sometimes 40 mins. It alarmed frquently unless I was lower than than top of the machine which is raised up on a stand and quite unstable with 3-4 full bags on the top tray. Also, the Fresinius catheter connection is quite a contraption. Even the renal nursing assistants had problems getting things hooked up and running. The Fresenious hookup is so non-obvious and convoluted that one night a RENAL nurse put it on backwards and then 3 other RENAL nurses took 30 minutes to figure out why it wasn't working. Now perhaps there are newer machines, but they told me that all the Fresenius units have this same hookup system to the catheter connector. Also, connections are long and heavy (about 8 inches compared to Baxter's 4 inch connector) while the tubing is quite large in diameter (at least a half inch), heavy and stiff--very hard to deal with. I can't comment on Fresenius customer service, but at least the Fresenius unit I used seemed to be a very out-dated technology.


 

[JLM]

Willis, I have no idea what you are describing with the Fresenius hookup.   I use Fresenius and the hookup is very easy.  The tubing is not large and clunky.  Although I have not used Baxter's cycler, I did have to do their manuals two years ago while vacationing in Wisconsin.  The staff was very nice, I wasn't crazy about the Neph.  I was doing well when I arrived, but after on the Baxter system my feet looked like two little pumpkins with 5 sausages attached to them.  They even had me on Red, and I tend to be dehydrated.  After getting back to Texas every thing was back to normal.  This year I'm in Wisconsin for the summer, I chose to drive 70 miles so I could go to a Fresenius clinic instead of using that Baxter clinic 10 miles away.  BUT we all can have horror stories with either system.  Go figger, eh?

[obsidianom]

We use Nxstage home hemo dialysis BUT Fresenius owns the clinic we work with and supplies our dialysis needs other than the actual Nxsage supplies. I am happy with fresenius so far after a year. WE order our supplies monthly and they use a very good delivery service to get it to us monthly out in the woods where we live. I have no complaints with the parent company /Fresenius. Any complaints I have are with the local clinic people here.  Basically I am satisfied with fresenius .

[tito]

I go to a PD clinic that uses Baxter. The cycler is ok - the pump tends to have problems, and I have gone through four units in four years. One problem with the Baxter unit is that you have to push buttons and scroll through the display to get to what you are looking for (total UF, time left to dwell, etc.). I had a Fresenius machine (Liberty) once in the hospital, and everything was clearly displayed on one screen. It worked beautifully!

I live part time in México, and the delivery of supplies in Puerto Vallarta was very unreliable. It has improved in the intervening years. They deliver from Guadalajara. I am assuming that your supplies will come from Panamá. I had good service on a recent trip to the Czech Republic.

Where are you in Panamá? I have visited 5-6 times - gone all over the country from Darien to Chiriqui. I love Chiriqui and Boquete the most! Used to import Café Duran to the US!

[Tío Riñon]

I too am a Baxter user.  While the equipment has generally been fine, I've had erratic delivery of my supplies.  In the last month I had three deliveries and only one of them went (more or less) as scheduled.  I have had good service at times, but when they are off, it is quite a hassle.

Another thing to look into is the connectors used.  Here in the US, we have a twist locking mechanism to connect bags to the cycler.  However, when I was in Ecuador earlier this year, the bags used the old spike connectors which I didn't like at all.  I found them to be more work.

Good luck with your research.

[Willis]

I just described my one and only experience with a Fresenius unit and it was at a major hospital and that is the picture of the unit I was on. So perhaps it is an old unit and the new stuff is better. Good!

But I couldn't be happier than I am with Baxter. I suppose a lot depends on your location and dialysis staff.

 

[KatieV]

I just described my one and only experience with a Fresenius unit and it was at a major hospital and that is the picture of the unit I was on. So perhaps it is an old unit and the new stuff is better. Good!

But I couldn't be happier than I am with Baxter. I suppose a lot depends on your location and dialysis staff.

My dialysis unit is a private center that focuses on NxStage and Nocturnal Nxstage, but also offers PD.  Their PD cyclers are Fresenius units and look like the picture.  I noticed because it looks so different from the Baxter cycle I had (used for 11 days total with 2 different catheters!).  I have no idea what the tubing or connections are like.

[JLM]

I am happy to say that this year in Wisconsin I had no problems like I had 2 years ago.  The nurse even drove to the cabin (70 miles) to draw my blood twice.  I drove for the 2 doctor's visits.  Of course, there was shopping in Appleton & Green Bay on the way back to the cabin.

[ianch]

Fresenius in New Zealand is great.  No issues with supplies that arrive monthly.  I dont have experience with Baxter as NZ is centrally funded.  I would say though that the Fresenius machines chosen for us (4008b) are good quality.  Not super modern but they are on 5-yr leases so we will get new ones in time.  I find the 4008B very reliable (no callouts in 9 months) and I'm a heavy user at 160 hours a month.  They get a full service every 6 months here.

I'm campaigning to keep Fresenius, and also keen to deploy self service facilities here as access outside the home is limited.  I'd definately chosse Fresenius at this stage, athough their existing infrustructure here does play a role in that.
   

[Simon Dog]

I just described my one and only experience with a Fresenius unit and it was at a major hospital and that is the picture of the unit I was on. So perhaps it is an old unit and the new stuff is better. Good!

But I couldn't be happier than I am with Baxter. I suppose a lot depends on your location and dialysis staff.

 

It looks like the hospital was using the older Newton cycler (gravity) rather than the newer Liberty (both by Fresenius).

Hospitals sometimes use older equipment.  The only time I saw one of the older Fresenius machines with the orang led dot display instead of the more modern LCD touch screen was in a high-end hospital.   They were actually using duct tape to hold the blood pump door shut.