Go back in time !

[KICKSTART]

Take a look at this , im glad its now and not then !
http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/tomorrowsworld/8001.shtml?all=1&id=8001

Look for the one that says FIRST EDITION  its about 18 mins long though ! Or you cant get it through the link ,search for Tomorrows World First Edition , then look for First Edition on the main page that comes up . People in the UK will remember this program ! Its really worth watching !

Ive just tried it , click on the link , then on the screen that comes up to play it !

[Stoday]

I was rather amused by the comment that in America "they have death committees to sort out who gets dialysis and who dies". Now where else have I heard that recently?

We don't have death committees in Britain, even in 1965. How the use of these limited resources is controlled is not mentioned. It is, of course, rude to talk about such things. Best left unsaid that if you have the money you give a machine to the hospital. As the film said, the NHS will then maintain and run it. This subtle way of begging for funds is the British way...

[cariad]

It won't let me watch the video! I guess it's not viewable in the US.

Stoday, perhaps I am misinterpreting your comment, but of course we truly did have death committees for dialysis at one time in the US. More precisely "life or death committees" or more formally "patient selection committees" (the latter term is still used, much to my horror, to describe the transplant team meetings to decide if one is eligible for the operation or not). From reports I have read from family members of the victims of these committees, selection was based almost entirely on income. According to my father who used to be up on these things, the state of Wisconsin eventually decided that these committees were too disgusting for them to participate, and established their famously excellent renal program that apparently provided dialysis to all comers. I have not been able to find anything on the Internet about the accuracy of this, though.

Was dialysis available to all from the start in the UK?

[Bajanne]

I was not allowed to view it either.  AND I LIVE IN THE COLONIES - British Virgin Islands, also known as Virgin Islands (UK)!!!
In the eighties, a family friend who lived in Britain was taken off dialysis and sent home to die.

[paris]

Just an example of how little we (or our doctors) know about other countries policies, my first nephrologist told me to be glad I don't live in the UK because no one over 65 gets dialysis, they just let them die.   Lots of stories out there about every country.

My best friend from childhood, was diagnosed with kidney failure in her teens---this was in the early 60's.  She came from a lower income family and it was never a problem getting dialysis. Never a question. Then she received a transplant in her 20's and went on to have a baby.   This was in Ohio. 

So much conflicting information. 

[Stoday]

Was dialysis available to all from the start in the UK?

Of course not! It was run exactly as you describe for the US except no one mentioned the selection procedure. And it was the rich who could afford to buy a dialyser and donate it to the hospital who went to the front of the queue. It helped the poor too, because the dialyser was there to help them too.

The film you couldn't see sniffily deplores the US "death committees" during the 1960's but does not mention the British equivalent in that era.

As for not getting dialysed if you're over 65 these days, that's not true, fortunately: I'm 68. The oldest bloke in the unit I shall be attending is 92. Does not inhibit certain republican senators from quoting such in order to kill off Obama's health proposals though.

[cariad]

My best friend from childhood, was diagnosed with kidney failure in her teens---this was in the early 60's.  She came from a lower income family and it was never a problem getting dialysis. Never a question. Then she received a transplant in her 20's and went on to have a baby.   This was in Ohio. 

So much conflicting information. 

Really, Paris? Was her case discussed by the committee? According to this article, she was one of only 800 or so on dialysis, while around 10,000 were denied nationwide. http://www.davita.com/dialysis/lifestyle/a/892

[cariad]

Was dialysis available to all from the start in the UK?

Of course not! It was run exactly as you describe for the US except no one mentioned the selection procedure. And it was the rich who could afford to buy a dialyser and donate it to the hospital who went to the front of the queue. It helped the poor too, because the dialyser was there to help them too.

The film you couldn't see sniffily deplores the US "death committees" during the 1960's but does not mention the British equivalent in that era.

As for not getting dialysed if you're over 65 these days, that's not true, fortunately: I'm 68. The oldest bloke in the unit I shall be attending is 92. Does not inhibit certain republican senators from quoting such in order to kill off Obama's health proposals though.

Ah, I feared that was what you were getting at. Thanks for the clarification. 

[Ang]

I was rather amused by the comment that in America "they have death committees to sort out who gets dialysis and who dies".


the terminology  i  use  is  "the  god squad"

[KICKSTART]

Oh so sorry you couldnt get to see it , to be honest i didnt put it on for its political content , though it does seem that a lot of people did die in 1965 if they had kidney failure , irrc the hospital featured dialyized 19 people a week ! I really was hoping you would get to see it for the type and size of the machines ! Its amazing how we have progressed and yet no better process has been invented. Also EVERYONE had a fistula in the leg !!

[paris]

My best friend from childhood, was diagnosed with kidney failure in her teens---this was in the early 60's.  She came from a lower income family and it was never a problem getting dialysis. Never a question. Then she received a transplant in her 20's and went on to have a baby.   This was in Ohio. 

So much conflicting information. 

Really, Paris? Was her case discussed by the committee? According to this article, she was one of only 800 or so on dialysis, while around 10,000 were denied nationwide. http://www.davita.com/dialysis/lifestyle/a/892

Yes, Cariad, really.  I have no idea about the "committee".  I just know that Nancy was a sick teenager and she received dialysis in the late 60's and then a transplant in the 70's.  It was my first introduction to kidney failure.   I don't know about statistics in a Davita report but I do know about a girl in mid Ohio in the 60's who was on dialysis.

[Goofy]

I live in the US and I don't know all the "details" of what Obama has planned for our future in health cure, but it is my understanding that there may be some type of committee that will dictate as to who gets what type of health care based on their age.

I hope that is not true and just a rumor because I'm not getting any younger!!  And with kidney issues, it may cost too much money to keep us alive.

[cariad]

My best friend from childhood, was diagnosed with kidney failure in her teens---this was in the early 60's.  She came from a lower income family and it was never a problem getting dialysis. Never a question. Then she received a transplant in her 20's and went on to have a baby.   This was in Ohio. 

So much conflicting information. 

Really, Paris? Was her case discussed by the committee? According to this article, she was one of only 800 or so on dialysis, while around 10,000 were denied nationwide. http://www.davita.com/dialysis/lifestyle/a/892

Yes, Cariad, really.  I have no idea about the "committee".  I just know that Nancy was a sick teenager and she received dialysis in the late 60's and then a transplant in the 70's.  It was my first introduction to kidney failure.   I don't know about statistics in a Davita report but I do know about a girl in mid Ohio in the 60's who was on dialysis.

Thanks for the reply, Paris. I wasn't doubting you when I posed those questions, I was just seeking more info. If I offended you, I'm sorry.

If she did not require dialysis until the late 60s, then that is probably why it was a non-issue. The committees disbanded in 1967 after an engineer and a doctor developed the first home dialysis machine, or at least that's how I've heard the story told. I think there are different versions.