Transplant Surgery abroad is not the same in every country

[mitchorganbroker]

Epoman, You have been an inspiration to so many people. You are a believer in  free speech while considerate to peoples feelings from the group. I agree with you to close this thread when you are ready to. Now I got to know and understand your struggle and how you help others. I will not spam nor annoy any good people like you.
Nor will I spam  nor annoy Angie. Good luck with you and Epokid.
There is a saying, enjoy them while they are young.

[Rerun]

Mitch, it was good to hear you side too.  I am for organ sales.....but only in my own country.  Thanks for sharing your thoughts!

Rerun

[Sluff]

Both sides have been exhausted and fairly exposed. Overall Mitch had the right to post here as much as anybody and was allowed to do so.

I think fairness was awarded to both sides by Epoman.
 
No matter your position on this subject, I hope after reviewing all the posts that everyone gets something positive from it.

[angieskidney]

No matter your position on this subject, I hope after reviewing all the posts that everyone gets something positive from it.

Agreed!  Good luck with your site Mitch and all the information you have supplied.

I myself am more for what BigSky said on my forums which was:

there is a need for some sort of inbetween the two of organ buying and non paid donation to where people can donate but yet receive some sort of limited compensation to make up for lost wages.

I think that is a great idea and I also really like the idea of health care!

This thread has given us perspective and ideas.

[Sara]

My final thought: Buh-bye.

[sandman]

My final thought: Buh-bye.

* sandmansa repeats that same statement.

[kitkatz]

You all have noticed I took my toys and played elsewhere and refused to say anything to this thread.
Because Epoman asked for our opinion of this thread I will answer here today.  I would say Bye, bye to Mitch as soon as possible.  The rudeness he has displayed towards member of our community make me want to listen to him less and less.  If I came upon this thread as a new person looking for a transplant option, I would have run screaming away from him and his services very quickly.  He often does not make sense in his replies.  He is out to make a buck. While that is not bad, unfortunately that buck is going to come from a very gullible sick person, who may or may not get what he needs-a new working kidney at a reasonable price, with doctors who care, and followup care in their home country afterwards.  Final vote:  Get rid of him!

[mitchorganbroker]

Kitkatz, I understand your feelings. If i have offended you , I am sorry. I have learned so much from everyone, especially those of a different opinion. This is how I learned the intensity of the the donors fragile future and how good Health Insurance was his right, rather than a privilege.

I am not the enemy , ignorance is the enemy  of all of us? The Philippines was an American possession and shares many American values, in time of war or peacetime.

[Sluff]

Kitkatz, I am not a punching bag. The rudeness always starts from one of you guys. I simply responded back in kind which seems to be all you remembered.  NOW is it me or you being rude FIRST?

What , happens is , you guys show temporary insanity as soon as I say," hello, I can get you a live donor transplant in 2 weeks at a cost of 50% the US cost", Many of you start calling me names FIRST. Then comes the slander out of ignorance. But for the most part here I have been swallowing insults.

Five years from now with gradual education I bet your view turns 180 degrees.

What is the worse that I ever said to you ? While you in your post above are very negative hinting that I may or may not give the patients what they need. I guess you don't need proof to slander me. Don't you think you are being rude FIRST ?
     But in reality isn't it your transplant center which has refused to list you. Are you running away screaming from them. ?

I am not the enemy , ignorance is the enemy . There are many smart people here who are well educated on every aspect of kidney disease. But how many of them know alot about live donor transplants in the Philippines ? The Philippines was an American possession and shares many American values, in time of war or peacetime.

Why then Mitch do you feel the need to respond in an attacking mode?  We were asked to state our final opinions and that is exactly what we are doing. You have stated yours so move on. We have listened, you have spoken so it's time to pack up and leave with a positive attitude as some here have listened and spoke well of you and your services, don't be so quick to pounce on our respected members for speaking what they feel.  This thread will be locked very soon, is this the way you want it to be remembered? How about a simple thank you to the ones who gave you the opportunity to voice your services. You thanked Epoman as you should but what about everyone else who listened? Anyway without rambling on about this I just think this thread could be ended on a positive instead of a negative. Good Luck in your future endeavors.

[mitchorganbroker]

Sluff , you are correct. Thank you for your help.  Geoff Thanks for making me put on my thinking cap. and finding some stats,Angie , thanks for your help about the donors health needs Rerun, thanks for teaching me to strive for what i believe in,Mallory, Meadowlands and Sara thanks for showing me what people go through. Livecam I want to apologize for insinuating that you may be e-mailing me virus attachments. I tracked the sender to a part of Manila. Goofynina, Thanks for showing me your efforts to achieve with a big heart. Sandman, thanks for all your help and sacrifice for kidney patients, you are a better man than me. Kitkatz, you showed me what a real fighter does by helping all those kids , while struggling with your medical issues.. Zach , you are a real impressive guy along with Epoman , leading and encouraging people in need. Big Sky, I learned alot from you, thanks.
Glitter, thanks for putting things in perspective.
    The members of IHD are the real heroes.

[Zach]

And thank you, Mitch, for providing a possible option for the dialysis patient.
Salamat po.

[mallory]

I think it's always a good thing to understand what options are available to you.  Thanks, Epoman, for letting Mitch post so that we could explore other options.  Mitch, thanks for the information.

[angieskidney]

Sluff , you are correct. Thank you for your help.  Geoff Thanks for making me put on my thinking cap. and finding some stats,Angie , thanks for your help about the donors health needs Rerun, thanks for teaching me to strive for what i believe in,Mallory, Meadowlands and Sara thanks for showing me what people go through. Livecam I want to apologize for insinuating that you may be e-mailing me virus attachments. I tracked the sender to a part of Manila. Goofynina, Thanks for showing me your efforts to achieve with a big heart. Sandman, thanks for all your help and sacrifice for kidney patients, you are a better man than me. Kitkatz, you showed me what a real fighter does by helping all those kids , while struggling with your medical issues.. Zach , you are a real impressive guy along with Epoman , leading and encouraging people in need. Big Sky, I learned alot from you, thanks.
Glitter, thanks for putting things in perspective.
    The members of IHD are the real heroes.

Salamat po.

Salamat po. (that is thanks right? I learned the meaning on a sick kids show on Canadian TV where a little girl came from the Philippines for face tumor removal surgey). 

[meadowlandsnj]

Both sides have been exhausted and fairly exposed. Overall Mitch had the right to post here as much as anybody and was allowed to do so.

I agree.  There's nothing wrong with debating an issue or hearing different sides of it  Have an open mind (but not so open your brain falls out).  Thanks Epoman for having this forum available.

Think for yourselves and let others enjoy the privilege to do so too.
Voltaire, Essay on Tolerance
French author, humanist, rationalist, & satirist (1694 - 1778)

Donna T

[sandman]

Sandman, thanks for all your help and sacrifice for kidney patients, you are a better man than me.

Well, I don't know if I am better then anyone but I am much wiser then I use to be thanks to everyone involved with this community.  But thanks for the kind, parting words.  One thing I am happy to see come from this discussion.  Thanks to this community and Mitch, the people living in the Philippines will some day be provided with better health care services.

[Epoman]

Get your finally thoughts in, as this thread will be LOCKED in 48 hours. Remember this is FINAL thoughts, don't ask questions or start a new debate, simply state you final thoughts on the matter so others can use this thread and make their own decision.

- Epoman
Owner/Admin

[geoffcamp]

Thanks Mich for bringing this subject to light and debate.  It was informative and a learning experience.  I do hope one day we (the US) will do something about compensating living donors family, friends and strangers.  Could be done with a tax break or maybe a combination of tax incentive and some kind of payment.  Maybe a list of willing living donors that have been tested and approved too.  The ideas are endless and I do hope we truly take a look at all options and find a way to make things better.  I also believe we are not far away from doing exactly what you.  We already routinely send people overseas for procedures for the simple matter it is cheaper for the insurance companies, so how far can we really be from doing it with transplantation??  Anyway to quote the Dead "What a long strange trip it has been". 
Cheers, Geoff

[mitchorganbroker]

Geoff, You have some advanced thinking regarding the insurance connection for transplant patients.
The other important thing that I have learned, from you guys talking about your fistula and the central line being put in , you all on HD .

This is exactly what the Philippine dialysis patients lack. Since they do dialysis on good German equipment but less frequent because of money problems, putting in a central line or fistula would allow their flow rate to increase from less than 100 to more than 400 without increasing the dialysis cost.

   I wonder if I can get some of the Surgeons here to volunteer to at least put in a central line. After all there are already a bunch of Nephrologists in Manila who volunteer their services at the one free Dialysis center.

[AlasdairUK]

What a well read topic,

I'm glad it was brought up as we need to push the boundaries as to what is ethical and what is required to treat kidney failure. With the problem becoming an ever bigger issue, we need to look at new treatment options to increase the level of health care available. All options should be considered.

Best of luck Mitch,

Cheers Alasdair.

[mitchorganbroker]

23 Oct 2006                         Page 1
Flaws Reported in overview of US organ transplants   
The United Network for Organ Sharing which oversees the U.S. organ transplant system often fails to detect or fix problems at the hospitals that it is assigned to supervise according to the Los Angeles Times on Sunday.

According to the newspaper when it does act, its findings are usually kept a secret leaving patients and their families unaware of potential risks, such as including excessive death rates.

http://www.medindia.org/news/view_news_main.asp?x=15288

[sandman]

Get your finally thoughts in, as this thread will be LOCKED in 48 hours. Remember this is FINAL thoughts, don't ask questions or start a new debate, simply state you final thoughts on the matter so others can use this thread and make their own decision.

- Epoman
Owner/Admin

 

[angieskidney]

23 Oct 2006                         Page 1
Flaws Reported in overview of US organ transplants   
The United Network for Organ Sharing which oversees the U.S. organ transplant system often fails to detect or fix problems at the hospitals that it is assigned to supervise according to the Los Angeles Times on Sunday.

According to the newspaper when it does act, its findings are usually kept a secret leaving patients and their families unaware of potential risks, such as including excessive death rates.

http://www.medindia.org/news/view_news_main.asp?x=15288

You didn't add the link to D&T City when you posted this

[Epoman]

OK, Time is up this thread is LOCKED and I hope you all understand why I left it open for so long and allowed it in the first place. Now when a member or visitor comes to this site, they can read 322 replies to this matter and hear BOTH sides of the story and make their own decision when it comes to using the services of someone like Mitch. We had a peaceful debate and thankfully it stayed relatively calm.

Here is the link to Mitch's website and the services he offers: http://www.liver4you.org/ for those of you who are looking for more answers.

ihatedialysis.com,.org,.net and any of IHD.com sister sites, do not endorse www.liver4you.org in any manner what so ever.

- Epoman
Owner/Admin

[okarol]

This thread will remain LOCKED - but for news about the status of Mitch go to http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=12971.0


okarol/admin