I Hate Dialysis Message Board
Dialysis Discussion => Dialysis: Medical Breakthroughs => Topic started by: okarol on November 28, 2006, 09:10:19 AM
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Overnight therapy puts z's in dialysis for kidney patients
Treatment - Slower sessions filter blood more thoroughly and cause fewer side effects
Monday, November 27, 2006
ANDY DWORKIN
The Oregonian
When workers at Vincent Jones' dialysis clinic asked whether he wanted to spend all night hooked to one of the blood-cleaning machines, he thought the idea was nutty.
"I can barely make 41/2 hours, and they want me to do eight hours?" said Jones, 72, a retired bus driver whose kidneys were damaged by high blood pressure.
"But I tried it. And I like it," he said "After four hours, I'd have to go home and take a nap before I'd feel OK. But here, after eight hours, I feel good."
Jones is one of a dozen patients in a 2-month-old nocturnal dialysis program at Southeast Portland's DSI Lake Road Dialysis center. It appears to be the first in-center overnight dialysis program in Oregon.
On Tuesday, Thursday and Sunday nights, participants nap, read and watch TV for eight hours -- twice the usual time -- while machines filter their blood at a slower rate. Patients bring pajamas, blankets and pillows to make beds out of the padded dialysis chairs, though it's hard to sleep hooked to the machines. A few people wear earphones or eye masks, while clinic staff dim the overhead lights and use flashlights to check patients.
Supporters say the slower, longer dialysis removes more toxins and is gentler on the body, leaving patients with less pain and more energy.
"The more dialysis the better," said Lana Shubina, the center's charge nurse. "Our kidneys are working 24-7."
More dialysis is the wave of the future. About 336,000 U.S. residents are on dialysis, including 2,500 Oregonians and almost 4,700 Washington residents, according to the federally funded U.S. Renal Data System. At least 95,000 patients start each year.
The number of dialysis users is projected to grow from 3 percent to 5 percent a year, fueled largely by an epidemic of diabetes. The disease is the main reason people need dialysis, said Dr. Michael Walczyk, a nephrologist with Northwest Renal Clinic.
While kidney transplants help some patients get off dialysis, donor organs are in short supply, and some people are too sick to get transplants.
"Until someone figures out how to transplant a pig kidney into people, I think we're stuck with dialysis," Walczyk said.
Fortunately, patients have an increasing number of ways to get dialysis, including daytime sessions, overnight treatments, machines for home use and peritoneal dialysis, which puts fluid in the belly cavity where a membrane in the body naturally detoxifies the blood.
Home dialysis, which is often done overnight, was more popular in the 1990s, when there were fewer dialysis centers. While dialyzing nightly at home is perfect medically, Shubina said, some find it difficult. Patients need specialized equipment, including the dialysis machine, chemicals and a water purifier, and someone to help with the machine. Many insurance plans don't fully cover the costs for home dialysis, she said.
So as more dialysis centers have opened, home dialysis has waned: 324 Oregonians and 548 Washington residents now dialyze at home, according to the Northwest Renal Network.
Most patients go to a center three times a week, where a boxy dialysis machine is hooked into their blood vessels. The machine uses fluid and an intricate membrane to pull toxins such as urea, potassium and phosphorous from the blood. The machine also removes pounds of excess fluid, another job normally done by the kidneys. Treatments usually last four hours.
"It's fast. It's hard. It's harsh on the body," Shubina said.
Taking fluid out fast can leave too little water in the bloodstream, causing painful cramps, said Dr. Susan Kauffman, medical director of the Lake Road clinic. Also, some medium-sized toxic particles that can tire patients are hard to remove.
The longer, slower nighttime treatments should remove more toxins but do it more gently, avoiding cramps and exhaustion, Kauffman said. Removing more toxins could also curb other harmful effects, such as having trouble thinking and hardening of the arteries.
Kauffman said the center has more nighttime openings for patients who meet a few criteria: They must have their doctor's permission, have been on dialysis at least one month, tolerate that treatment well, take any needed drugs and generally take care of themselves.
The biggest benefit of nighttime treatment may be flexibility, said Heather Stilley, the center's social worker. Surveys regularly show the main complaint about daytime treatment is the time it takes.
But night patients "have all their days free," Stilley said. "They can work, go to school, spend more time with their family, have close to a normal life."
By moving to nights, one woman was able to resume working, making her eligible for Medicare and able to get on a transplant list.
Switching to nights made it easier for 53-year-old Mike Schmitgen to keep working. Schmitgen has polycystic kidney disease, which killed his father and put him in the hospital a year ago when his kidneys failed. A supervisor at a Portland recycling firm, Schmitgen had to leave work early and rush to the dialysis center for daytime treatments, which left him tired the next day.
About two months ago, Schmitgen switched to nights and quickly started feeling better. Though it's hard to sleep, and he only catnaps, he has enough energy to leave the center and work 13 hours the day after dialysis.
"I wouldn't go back on days," he says. "No way."
Walczyk, who is not affiliated with the Lake Road center, said the exact benefits of thrice-weekly nocturnal dialysis are hard to know. Most studies of overnight dialysis look at people treating themselves at home at least five nights a week. But getting more dialysis could well be good, he said. And simply having another option is a bonus.
"What I think is nice about this is that patients have choices now," Walczyk said.
Andy Dworkin: 503-221-8239; andydworkin@news.oregonian.com
original story: http://www.oregonlive.com/metro/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/news/1164597907319630.xml&coll=7
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Oh sure, then have no life at all, ever, since you have to be on the machine for eight hours a night in clinic! I would turn into a human popsicle in the freezer clinic I go to after eight hours! When do you get to go out and do stuff? If I had this arrangement I would go in at ten oclock at night and dialyze 10 to 5, then try to get to work on time by 7a.m. Hmmmmm. I do not think I could do it and still work. Are these people working a nine to five job, or are they on disability?
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Nocturnal is not an option everywhere. To my knowledge, nocturnal hemo is not offered or supported in the Chattanooga area.
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I would love to do this. It would be a pain to be in the unit but It would be awesome to feel normal again.
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I'm on nocturnal every second night(at home), and it's as close to normal as I've been since doing dialysis.
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But who would come and scratch my back and play with my hair until i fell asleep, i am sure they wont let hubby come in and do that for me (or would they) ::)
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I'm on a home hemo to do it at night...just I have been unable to do it because anxiety....I wanna, though
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My doctor asked me about it today.
I might be interested to try it, since it's still only 3-nights-a-week.
Always good to have options! ;)
But who would come and scratch my back and play with my hair until i fell asleep, i am sure they wont let hubby come in and do that for me (or would they) ::)
Conjugal visits, I'm sure! :P
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But who would come and scratch my back and play with my hair until i fell asleep, i am sure they wont let hubby come in and do that for me (or would they) ::)
I think it would be allowed as long as the hair isn't on your back. ;D
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But who would come and scratch my back and play with my hair until i fell asleep, i am sure they wont let hubby come in and do that for me (or would they) ::)
I think it would be allowed as long as the hair isn't on your back. ;D
ok, nevermind then,,, :-\ ;)
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This is the kind of dialysis I would love to have. Then my days would be totally mine. I have no problem with sleeping on the machine. In fact, my nurses are always waking me to make sure I am okay.
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I would try it if offered.
Very doubtful it will be offered here anytime in the foreseeable future. :)
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Do these "medical professionals" think we are bloodless, feelingless Barbie or Ken dolls with nothing to live for except die-alysis? Oh, that's right, we re on dialysis at THEIR centers, so that means we belong to THEM. Our lives should now be all about dialysis and "improving our outcomes" (in reality, that means improving their bottom line.) Since they want us to sleep there now, what point is there in having relationships, pets or a private residence?
I think what they really want is to corral us all into nursing homes where they will give us a bed, a dialysis machine which will be on 24/7, and a 5 inch arm television with basic cable (with all the "offensive" material filtered out, of course.) After this, you will of course be so beaten down by your whole life surrounding dialysis, that you will stick your arm out to any yahoo with a needle
You don't want the mean-a$$ tech who yanks your arm and yells at you to "STAY STILL!!!" because you alarmed after you dared to move after you cramped from laying in that godawful "on your back" position that all those ratholes seem to think is so good for us 3 1/2 hours, who can't hit the broad side of a 747 sticking you? That's too bad, because "If we let you pick your technician, everyone else would want to do that too, and nothing would ever get done." This happened to me, and how I solved it was saying, "Okay, well, that's fine, but you know I'd really hate to infiltrate or need a fourth surgery in one year and have to find another center that can accommodate my needs better.
The benefits of sleeping in a dialysis center can include, but are not limited to:
1. The "So what, if you have to go, I'm busy and you'll wait" program:
If you have to urinate in the middle of the night, you have to wait for the inexperienced (and that is who gets night shifts, sorry to say) night tech to put down her copy of "Ok!" Magazine or her romance novel, get off her "working here to keep her welfare check" a$$ and unhook you and send you to the can.
2. The "Of course not, you can't have anything to drink or eat for 8 hours, you're on dialysis and you're under the care of these caring,informed individuals who don't want you to choke or gain fluid" program:
Even if you urinate normally, you're still not supposed to drink, end of story, Eating is a no-no, as well, as you are viewed as a child even a cup of pudding can cause a choking incident.
3. The "Say goodbye to your partner unless you see them in passing after you split up, and you'll never have to date again either" program:
This one is the best benefit yet! The eight hours three times a week you spend with strangers and dialysis technicians who are only there to earn their checks will put a strain on that pesky engagement, marriage or life partnership you have and will most likely end it! Think about it, how much time that could be spent on a dialysis machine, do you waste cuddling, kissing, making love, or hugging? With this program, that time could be cut in over half! And it will prevent you from having to date again once your partner gets fed up, since you will have to, nay want to tell any potential partner about your wonderful, beneficial, medically perfect, 3 nights a week nocturnal dialysis, which will cause most normal people to run like hell.
4. The luxurious accommodations you will receive:
Your dialysis center, which most likely will look, smell, and feel like a prison will be the perfect place to contemplate suicide, as your amenities will include a hard, broken-down dialysis chair which in some more upscale locations comes with a stained 5-inch arm TV with 65 wonderful channels. (Some locales will have basic broadcast only) However, to cut costs, and make your experience more enjoyable, you will be asked, no told to bring your own pillow and blanket, which must be minis, so as not to take up too much room. Not even a glass of warm tap water will be offered to you and you must stay in one position all night or you will be hollered at.
5. You will never have to have a hobby again:
You will find all those pesky trips, power metal concerts, et cetera that start in the evening to be a thing of the past as you enter your center. You will be amazed at your techs lack of empathy as they tell you to shut up "because there are new patients there" as you scream in hellacious pain as they attempt to take the cheap, lazy way out," twisting"" the needle to try and make it work, but ending up having to put another one in anyway, causing more swelling and pain to the site.
Sound good? No? Then, you my friend are non-compliant! Call 1-800-TOTAL-BS to find a concentration camp that thinks this nonsense will fly and to become compliant and reap all these benefits. From there, we will also give you the number of different suicide prevention hotlines that you will undoubtedly want to call after dealing with 8 hours of in-center hemodialysis every other day.
Seriously, whoever posted this obviously has never been on dialysis or they wouldn't want it either. This is just another attempt to make more money for the doctors who try and impose it on us. If 4 hour dialysis is hard on the human body and spirit already, what is so great about 8 hour dialysis? If my nephrologist asked, I'd tell him to jam it. What a joke.
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Well, I feel very differently than you do Kitsune although I did laugh at your description of things. I want to do whatever makes me feel as well as I can and I've just gone to daily (2&1/2 hours), five days per week. I feel way way better and it's only been a week and a half. My nurses are fantastic, really nice people, very caring and fun, respectful of patients and we can eat whatever we want. They serve coffee or tea halfway through each run.
My first choice would be home nocturnal and cuddling would be mandatory. I don't at all experience ESRD and dialysis as things that are or have been done to me but rather as a very unfortunate set of circumstances that I have to endure and actually make the best of so that my entire life is not stolen.
It's understandable to be angry about the crappy cards we've been dealt and our system here is very different than yours so for sure I have'nt had your experiences but one thing I am sure about is that I don't want bitterness to further rob me of any speck of joy that I can squeeze out of life and my life at the moment has to include dialysis.
I also choose to do my own needles so that I can take the control of that stress out of the hands of any less than great needle pushing nurses (we don't have techs here doing needles).
I did laugh out loud reading your post K and you have a real talent for writing (and especially for hyperbole which is an honourable literary technique).
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My Top 10 reasons not to do nocturnal:
1) I still have a night life
2) I prefer sleeping in a bed
3) I don't want to worry about a needle popping out and no one noticing.
4) I feel fine with 3x hemo during the day
5) I don't want to give dialysis a bigger chunk of my life.
6) My doctor is only a couple of minutes away (same for Nurse Practitioner, Dietition, etc.)
7) I don't sleep well with needles and a blood pressure cuff.
8) I would miss a lot of my favorite TV shows
9) No family life
10) Nocturnal isn't even offered here.
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I hope, I hope I hope that in-center nocturnal comes my way soon. I have asked some of the corporate powers-that-be about bringing to the Bay Area. I would have to drive 2 hours each way to take advantage of this-- but I think it would be worth it, so I can return to full-time employment. I just interviewed for my first professional position, and having to work around my dialysis days was a bit of a sticking point. So 3X a week, in-center nocturnal would make a huge difference.
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My old center called it 'nocturnal', but it really wasn't. So, beware of what they offer as nocturnal. The latest you could arrive to the clinic was 8:00pm, but they really wanted you there by 6 or 7. It is scheduled for Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Sundays. They offered both hospital beds and dialysis chairs. The treatments are a minimum of 6 hours, most are 8 hours. Who goes to bed by 6 or 7? I would arrive by 7:00 and have 6 hours of dialysis. I work full time, so I pretty much just went to the clinic right after work. I didn't think this was nocturnal, this was spending my evenings at the clinic. For the most part, even though I tried, I could not sleep until about 11:00 or 12:00. So, if I was lucky I would get about an hours' sleep before having to drive home at 2 or 3 in the morning, get a couple more hours of sleep before getting up for work. I felt horrible all the time! I much prefer home hemo dialysis.
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I have done every form of dialysis. PD, 4 hour Hemo, home hemo, 3 hour hemo, transplant and 8 hour in center nocturnal. OK, I haven't done Nx stage. BUT.... Next to a transplant the 8 hour in-center hemo is the best. I feel safe, I watch my movie and eat my snack. I suppose it depends on the staff, but I have the best nurse and tech there is. They joke around and let you do pretty much anything except bring in a live chicken to eat. I sleep pretty good. The best thing is I feel so much better and I don't have the fuzzy thinking and wiped out feeling. I'm glad it is an option for me. I've gone on vacation and had to return to the 3 hour sessions and it sucks.
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Hubby hates having to do short sessions now especially in center!! He does nocturnal but has a machine at home. He has his life back. And yes at home you can cuddle!!! He sleeps through the sessions most nights and his bloodwork is awesome. He is much more free with his diet. Basically he eats whatever he wants. This was not the life he would have chosen but hey it's the cards he was dealt (might have been crappy) and we are making the best of it. He has a very positive attitude ( most times) and that is a big help!
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You can have a somewhat "positive" attitude when you feel half way decent. My attitude has improved since I've been on nocturnal. I actually care if I live now. I still hate dialysis.....that has not changed.
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I don't think anyone "likes" dialysis rerun. My husband has been very lucky and we are both very thankful for that. In 11 years he has had one period when he was sick. That was when PD stopped working. He came very close to dying. Hemo has been really good for him and nocturnal has been excellent. He does not have any other health issues so that has really helped. I know other people who are on dialysis and no matter how well they try to look after themselves it doesn't seem like anything helps and they have an awful time. Each person is different and different treatments work for each person. I'm just thankful dialysis is available so that hubby is still here with me!!
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I do have a positive attitude, and I'm also positive that I'd rather eat dirt than spend my night in a dialysis center in a rock-hard chair with a blood pressure cuff on and needles in my arm for 8 hours. I can barely take the 4 hours twice a week I have now. Also I tend to like to party with my soon to be husband at night and we all know that a dialysis center's idea of partying is cheering when the USA takes the gold in the Olympics as you raise your 1/2 cup of piss warm water. Also, I like sleeping with the man I'm basically married to, so what makes them think that a young person who already has good labs is going to decide that sleeping in a comfortable bed with no needles and no BP cuff is going come for more treatment? Good grief, someone slap these people, they have no clue what young people think. Oh, right, yes they do....we think about dialysis 24/7 and hope one day they wil come up with longer and more personally invasive ways to dialyze us so we can be at a place we hate instead of having a life with someone we do love. Well they can kiss my :sir ken;, because I'm not doing nocturnal, not now, not ever.
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No one HAS to do nocturnal. Doctors aren't saying "Do nocturnal, we want to torture you longer". WTF??? It's an option. And a good one at that for many people. Not for ALL but for many. Like PD, or hemo, or daily or whatever. An option. It's NOT some medical conspiracy.
Also many "old" people like to sleep with their partners too, we like comfortable beds and no BP cuff and we too have better things to do than dialysis. I've been on dialysis young and now much older but my age hasn't changed too much in terms of how D interferes in my life and derails me from my preferred way of living. Old people aren't that much different than young people, they're just older and hopefully a bit wiser but even that isn't a given. They come in all varieties, just like young people.
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The only offense I have with Kitsune on her first post on this topic is the statement "Seriously, whoever posted this obviously has never been on dialysis or they wouldn't want it either."
Apparently you haven't been here long enough and to make that assumption of Okarol who posted it is dead wrong. First of all, it is a news article concerning dialysis, which is a concern of this site. Okarol takes time to post any news regarding dialysis or transplantation and belongs to other dialysis related sites. If you take he time, you'll find many post by her regarding various news articles and will also post research she found regarding a question that was asked. Secondly she does have experience with dialysis. Not personally going through it, but having her young daughter gone through it.
So now comes the famous quote that fits, "assumption is the mother of all f*@$ ups" And this one hit it right on the nail big time.
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No one HAS to do nocturnal. Doctors aren't saying "Do nocturnal, we want to torture you longer". WTF??? It's an option. And a good one at that for many people. Not for ALL but for many. Like PD, or hemo, or daily or whatever. An option. It's NOT some medical conspiracy.
Also many "old" people like to sleep with their partners too, we like comfortable beds and no BP cuff and we too have better things to do than dialysis. I've been on dialysis young and now much older but my age hasn't changed too much in terms of how D interferes in my life and derails me from my preferred way of living. Old people aren't that much different than young people, they're just older and hopefully a bit wiser but even that isn't a given. They come in all varieties, just like young people.
monrein,
I'm not talking people in their 40's-60's, I'm talking 80-90 year olds who go home to nursing homes or whatnot anyway. From what I've seen of nursing homes, the only difference would be the needles and the BP cuff. Let those who have no family or partner do it, it will save room during the daytime for those of us who actually have something to go home to besides a picture of a adult child who never visits or a spouse who died 40 years ago.
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Kitsune, I think I react a little to your posts because it occasionally feels to me that you don't have much empathy for "old" people and their situations although of course you want, as do we all, our nurses and techs to have empathy for our situations. It is not nice to want to take away from old people the control or choice over treatment and what works for them. It isn't easy being old (I hope to get there myself though and I hope you will too) and just because a person isn't very active anyway certainly doesn't mean that being hooked up to dialysis wouldn't be much different than what they'd be doing anyway. It sounds pretty disrespectful and non-empathic to say that all they're doing is looking at photos of dead spouses or waiting for uncaring kids who never visit. On top of being old and lonely you think they won't notice they're on dialysis? My mother-in-law is almost 90 and I'm sure that despite the differences in our levels of activity, I can tolerate D better than her. And yet this sweet soul would take this burden from me AND would love to give me her kidney. I'd be pissed if she were on dialysis and got met with an attitude of "you're old so you won't mind what we tell you to do". And pray tell, why should a person who has no partner or family be shoved into something THEY didn't want. True compassion, it seems to me, is reaching out to understand those whose circumstances are different than our own. It's harder than understanding what we already know.
I don't like generalizations about "young people today" from older people nor do I like reverse ageism towards old people. We all need as much choice and control as we can exercise.
Besides, where I am there aren't enough nocturnal spots for everyone that would like to do it so I don't know where the idea that people will be forced to do it came from.
But hey, I for sure get why YOU don't want to do nocturnal Kitsune and I'd always advocate for you to have as much latitude and flexibility as you could get with treatment so that you could have as full and satisfying life as you possibly could. Including work, school, love, partying and anything else you wanted.
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Nobody is "forced " to do any dialysis treatment. It is a treatment of choice. You can choose if you want not to do any dialysis of any type but we are know what happens if you need dialysis and refuse treatment. As for being forced into nocturnal I don't think anybody would be forced into it. It IS a lot better treatment for your body but if you don't want it you are quite free to choose another option. By the way I know a lot of "older" people 70+ who are on dialysis and I don't think they should be forced into any treatment they don't want. They are living full lives as well as the "younger" people!! There aren't any in center noctural units here. There are 12 people doing nocturnal home hemo in Newfoundland and they love it (as much as you can love dialysis :sarcasm;)
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As far as "Nocturnal Dialysis" goes...... don't knock it until you've tried it.
As far as "Old People" go... You may be old too one day. I am the 47 year old lady who lives alone with a dog and just pictures of my nieces who never visit. But, one day long long ago I was married with a promising career and the want of a family..... then my kidneys failed. Just wait sweetness!
:waving;
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I just started Nocturnal dialysis. I am one of the most vocal about how much I hate dialysis. However my blood pressure was going to kill me off pretty quickly if I don't do something about it. The pills were no longer working and stronger pills were in the offing. I am trying it out for awhile. Just got to learn to sleep in this new center.
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Kitkatz,
I am excited for U and would love to try "sleep over" Dialysis, how is it getting up at 4am and going to school that day?
do you go home and eat breakfast and how do you feel during the day
if you said you mailed me something; I did not get it and if you didn't say that-----my bad
Mibarra mailed me a shark postcard and I never got it
so
please let me know about "slumber party" Dialysis and how U feel during the day
and ( I am living through you)
SIT DOWN, SHUT UP, I mean - be quiet, little darlings, WHEN IS THE BELL GOING TO RING, ARE THE BUSES HERE LATE, OH GOD,
BUS DUTY AGAIN, WHERE ARE THOSE FREAKING ARD PAPERS
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I feel good during the day. I am sleepy in the mornings, but who isn't. The school days tarts at 6:45 a.m. for me. I have a tremendous amount of energy now. I will answer questions later, got to go hit the kids now. Ohhh...I mean go to work!
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So glad nocturnal is working for you kitkatz :clap; :2thumbsup; :yahoo;
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As far as "Nocturnal Dialysis" goes...... don't knock it until you've tried it.
As far as "Old People" go... You may be old too one day. I am the 47 year old lady who lives alone with a dog and just pictures of my nieces who never visit. But, one day long long ago I was married with a promising career and the want of a family..... then my kidneys failed. Just wait sweetness!
:waving;
Could it be because you chased away your husband and any and all men who might want you with your overbearing attitude and your right-wing propaganda, and your whininess about dialysis?
Your aloneness most likely has nothing to do with dialysis, it was probably due to your self-righteous attitude and as for your claim that because I'm on dialysis, my husband will eventually leave, sorry but I got together with my husband after I started dialysis, so BOOM! there goes your theory, mon ami. Oh yeah, and please never call me "sweetness" again, I don't know you from Adam.
Oh, as for me I'm 31 and I've got a husband, friends in power metal bands, offers to model, and a 131 I.Q. What do you have? Pictures of your nieces, and a dog who probably fantasizes about running away but won't because you feed it. Woo hoo, quality of life right there.
Just because you're a bitter person who only has a dog for company and goes to nocturnal dialysis so that you can have people to keep you company at night doesn't mean I will be at your age.
Go on with your bad self, stay on nocturnal, so that people like me who have a life don't have to be around you.
Enjoy your 3 day a week 8 hour long needles and blood pressure cuff sleepover. I mean, you like it so much, right?
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All hell's gonna break loose when Rerun reads this.
Adam
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Just because you're a bitter person who only has a dog for company and goes to nocturnal dialysis so that you can have people to keep you company at night doesn't mean I will be at your age.
Why are you so angry?
8)
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WTF?
Kitsune, that is one of the rudest, most uncalled for, unkindest, meanest and downright cruel posts I have seen.
PS. Did you have a really crap day by any chance? If so, I'm sorry you did but don't take it out on us who really want to give a damn about you (and the other members of this board also).
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That is my opinion on what was said to me. I do not take being talked to like I'm stupid, furthermore I'm tired of not being able to say what I feel without being censored or told that my opinion is wrong when it is just that, an opinion. I also don't appreciate basically being told that my feelings aren't valid because I don't express them in a nicey-nice way. If you don't like it, I'm sorry. But I will not hold words back, it isn't me to not say exactly how I feel..the way it is for me. Everyone get a grip, it's an internet forum, not real life. Get a hobby....outside this forum.
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:)
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My mum does nocturnal and she likes it (well, as much as you can like dialysis, anyway!!)
She used to come home after doing it during the day at the center and sleep straight away for a couple of hours.
But now she's got heaps more energy. Nocturnal has helped her return to as normal as she can for the moment.
Also, my dad still sleeps in the same bed!! He's actually said that the noise of the machine 'soothes him' lol, and helps him get to sleep.
But obviously we have the advantage of nocturnal being offered in our area.
It would be a lot different for those people who had to go in to the center; but a thing one should remember is 'different strokes for different folks'!!! Everyone is different, has different preferences too!!
And note: My mum has no trouble whatsoever with needing to pee during the night - she hasn't actually peed (as I'm sure many of you know already, from your own experiences - or maybe she's told you all, I dunno!!) for 4 years now, so that's not a problem.
xx
Oh, and I know that my post is a little irrelevant considering the last few posts to which I replied, but I just thought I'd put this post out there.
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Also Kitsune, how can you possibly say that rerun is alone because of the way she types on here...like you said, this is an internet posting board, not real life :)
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Hi all. I am back again. :cheer: Been away for a while.
I have now been doing nocturnal for nearly a year at home. I love it. I do eight hours every second night and I feel alot better. I have had no real serious problems (needles coming out, etc). It has freed up my days. I get to lie in my comfy bed, watch my tv, see my kids, catch up with my hubby. I started nocturnal as my son was going through chemo, and I needed to be home through the day for him when he was recovering. I now don't need to worry about childcare for my kids in the holidays as I am now home and can actually go and do things with them, instead of using up the whole day at the dialysis unit. Nocturnal isn't for everyone, but I am happy that I am. Liz :flower;
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Hey babi and babi's baby!
Good to see you post again! I am happy you're feeling better.
How is your son doing now? Best wishes to all of you. :cuddle;
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Glad you are back babi. :flower; Nocturnal is a great therapy isn't it. Hubby has been doing it for 2 years now and we really like it. A lot better than driving over an hr to the dialysis unit 3X a week. Plus you feel so much better with the long gentle treatments.
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That is my opinion on what was said to me. I do not take being talked to like I'm stupid, furthermore I'm tired of not being able to say what I feel without being censored or told that my opinion is wrong when it is just that, an opinion. I also don't appreciate basically being told that my feelings aren't valid because I don't express them in a nicey-nice way. If you don't like it, I'm sorry. But I will not hold words back, it isn't me to not say exactly how I feel..the way it is for me. Everyone get a grip, it's an internet forum, not real life. Get a hobby....outside this forum.
Kitsune we are all entitled to our opinions and are free to express them but we also need to respect other people's opinions.The purpose of this site is for all people to be able to express their opinions. Personal attacks are not the way to do this. :banghead;
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I am on nocturnal because regular dialysis was killing me off.
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I'll be doing nocturnal training in a couple months.
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Oh sure, then have no life at all, ever, since you have to be on the machine for eight hours a night in clinic! I would turn into a human popsicle in the freezer clinic I go to after eight hours! When do you get to go out and do stuff? If I had this arrangement I would go in at ten oclock at night and dialyze 10 to 5, then try to get to work on time by 7a.m. Hmmmmm. I do not think I could do it and still work. Are these people working a nine to five job, or are they on disability?
Now this is funny, because here I am on nocturnal at night and liking it! Hehehe! It takes experience to really understand what happens at nocturnal. I am sleepy the next day but it is not bad at all. I feel better and it is working my labs out better than ever!. After almost ten years on dialysis here I am finally feeling a lot better!
I would not be so adamant against it if I were some people on here. Here I was several months back saying I would not ever do it, and here I am on nocturnal. However I am not a party girl. Before you call me an old woman, I am 45 years old. I have over half my life to lead. I have been on dialysis for almost ten years. I think it took the reality of dialysis almost killing me off to make me change my modality over to nocturnal. I felt bad and my labs were horrible.
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It takes courage to admit that one wasn't as open about something as one could have been. Main thing though is that you didn't cut your nose off to spite your face and just maintain how it wouldn't work for you.
And best of all, it's working really well and you're feeling better. That's fantastic.
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Sometimes it take a baseball bat across the head for me to get it. :Kit n Stik; :Kit n Stik;
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Hey hubby loves nocturnal (well as much as you can love dialysis). He has had to do 2 treatments in center because of a machine breakdown. It has been a real pain in the butt. :thumbdown; I always like to say don't knock something until you have tried it!!!
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But Kitkat does in-center nocturnal. (I'm not sure you knew that or not) :)
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As far as "Nocturnal Dialysis" goes...... don't knock it until you've tried it.
As far as "Old People" go... You may be old too one day. I am the 47 year old lady who lives alone with a dog and just pictures of my nieces who never visit. But, one day long long ago I was married with a promising career and the want of a family..... then my kidneys failed. Just wait sweetness!
:waving;
Could it be because you chased away your husband and any and all men who might want you with your overbearing attitude and your right-wing propaganda, and your whininess about dialysis?
Your aloneness most likely has nothing to do with dialysis, it was probably due to your self-righteous attitude and as for your claim that because I'm on dialysis, my husband will eventually leave, sorry but I got together with my husband after I started dialysis, so BOOM! there goes your theory, mon ami. Oh yeah, and please never call me "sweetness" again, I don't know you from Adam.
Oh, as for me I'm 31 and I've got a husband, friends in power metal bands, offers to model, and a 131 I.Q. What do you have? Pictures of your nieces, and a dog who probably fantasizes about running away but won't because you feed it. Woo hoo, quality of life right there.
Just because you're a bitter person who only has a dog for company and goes to nocturnal dialysis so that you can have people to keep you company at night doesn't mean I will be at your age.
Go on with your bad self, stay on nocturnal, so that people like me who have a life don't have to be around you.
Enjoy your 3 day a week 8 hour long needles and blood pressure cuff sleepover. I mean, you like it so much, right?
Okay, I just now read this because I wanted to read some of your other posts after you blasted me on what I said about abortion. Ya know what? You go girl!! You say whatever you want on this site because that is what it is for. Doesn't it feel good to just come on here and blast the HELL out of ME! You can't do it in real life. If something ever pisses you off in the future I'm here for you sweety oops! I mean I'm here for you Girlfren'!! You hate dialysis and it has interrupted your otherwise normal life; I understand. When you get your transplant you go..... Never look back. You are the only one who hates dialysis like I do. And when I was 25 I really hated it and a transplant was my only way out. It was great and I hope you have yours 3 times as long. I like your spirit. I'm glad I can be here for you. Blast away!!!!
:boxing;
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:clap;
Way to go, rerun!
Classy, lady!
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I have been waiting to hear (read) Rerun's response on this, it seems like forever... you go girl :clap; :clap; :cheer: :clap; :clap;
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I had planned on going to nocturnal this year but my clinic has canceled their nocturnal plans. I'm told it's due to monitoring issues. They use Gambro Phoenix machines in-house. I'm on Nxstage now.
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:thumbup; :thumbup; rerun!!!! Nice reply!!! :beer1;
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I'd love to go on nocturnal dialysis. But I don't see it happening at my center. Hospitals are already going broke, and the extra four hours of nurse time would be too costly. The waiting list for a transplant at my center is 8 years, and with my heart and liver issues, I probably am not a good candidate for that in any event. I'm hoping they develop the new artificial kidney transplant within my lifetime. I'm almost 59, on my 1st month of dialysis, and it blows my mind that people endure it for 10 years or longer.