Pump speed

[Panda_9]

I dont know how you guys can handle running at 400+ I am on 225 at home, but when Im in centre if I even push it up to 300 I get giddy.

[angieskidney]

I dont know how you guys can handle running at 400+ I am on 225 at home, but when Im in centre if I even push it up to 300 I get giddy.

Giddy?

They said I could run as high as 800 (but won't ever do that) so I know running at 400 is easy for me .. now that my fistula is finally working without blowing

[Kelly528]

Pump speeds vary, depending what your Doctor prescribes. Most patients with good working fistulas should be able to reach 450 to 500. Needle placement is also very important. If you have a new fistula and when they first access it. They should access it with 17gauge needles to be on the safe side then work up to the standard 15gauge. Max pump speed on 17 gauge needles should be no more than 300. Another thing not all fistulas mature some just fail so be aware.
I also noted someone said on lab day they use a bigger needle.. Well they are suppose to go by your prescription. If it says use 15 gauges then they should be using 15 gauges unless the doctor tells them otherwise. why use a bigger needle on lab day? to meet your URR and KT/V goal if that is the case then they should be using them all the time not just on lab day. You should be meeting your URR and KT/V every time you dialyze not just on lab day..something to think about..

have a good evening!

Kelly

[angieskidney]

I have a question! What happens if they put you up on a faster pump speed? In my unit they don't have pump speed written down on my sheet. I pretty much have to tell them or they just go with what ever they feel like.

[AlasdairUK]

The faster the pump speed the better your clearance. I try to run my speed at my maximum comfort zone, but there is a practical limited as to how much strain your heart can take. Age plays a big role in your pump speed. Younger people will be able to run at a higher pump speed without getting giddy.

I don't know how you guys can handle running at 400+ I am on 225 at home, but when I'm in centre if I even push it up to 300 I get giddy.

What is yor age? How long is your session?

It also depends how much fluid you have to take off as this will also make you feel tired. Being overloaded will add extra strain on your heart. I would aim to run at a constant speed so you know what your clearance is and able to make adjustments if need be. I would only change my pump speed if my pressure was above average. This would normally be down to the position of the needles.

[BigSky]

You do have a very good point there Angie! Im not sure thats what was meant in the previous post, which is why I questioned it.

That is kinda what I meant.  Seems to me if a larger needle was used on that day it would lower the pressure thus letting them run a faster pump speed which in turn would process more blood.

Sorry for not being more clear.


On another note.

I heard there was a limit to speed at which a patient could be run as if it runs too fast it will crush or destroy the red blood cells.  Anyone know if this is true or not?

[angieskidney]

I heard there was a limit to speed at which a patient could be run as if it runs too fast it will crush or destroy the red blood cells.  Anyone know if this is true or not?

I am curious about that too since I am in a self care unit. I want to understand everything. The nurse I had on Wed was from the States (I live in a border Canadian city) and she said I was able to run at 400 and have 3.5kg taken off in one sitting (3 1/2 hrs) because I am so young (32). I know they put my pump speed at what ever number is as close to 400 as possible without my Arterial and Venous pressures going crazy. I am still not sure of how to know myself .. but they seem to know what they are doing.

[Panda_9]

The faster the pump speed the better your clearance. I try to run my speed at my maximum comfort zone, but there is a practical limited as to how much strain your heart can take. Age plays a big role in your pump speed. Younger people will be able to run at a higher pump speed without getting giddy.

I don't know how you guys can handle running at 400+ I am on 225 at home, but when I'm in centre if I even push it up to 300 I get giddy.

What is yor age? How long is your session?

It also depends how much fluid you have to take off as this will also make you feel tired. Being overloaded will add extra strain on your heart. I would aim to run at a constant speed so you know what your clearance is and able to make adjustments if need be. I would only change my pump speed if my pressure was above average. This would normally be down to the position of the needles.

Im 27 and pump speed is 225, I dont need too change the speed.

I couldnt even imagine running at up too 800?!?!?! WTF? The blood would be pumping like mad! I do know if the pump rollers are stiff it can crush the red cells. Dont know about pump speed, but Im sure your heart wouldnt like it.

[Zach]

I think someone was mistaken about a blood pump speed of 800.  They may be thinking of dialysate flow of 800.

Even the best High Flux filters usually have a maximum blood flow (pump speed) of 600 mL/min.  This means any speed faster will not result in better clearance of toxins.  You're just spinning your wheels, so to speak.

In fact, some Hi Flux filters have a maximum blood flow of 500 mL/min., such as the Fresenius (Optiflux) F160NR.  Standard flux filters have even a lower threshold.

[SpeedFleX]

woa some people have 500 that is really fast. It's like the Porsche of Fistula's

[angieskidney]

I think someone was mistaken about a blood pump speed of 800.  They may be thinking of dialysate flow of 800.

Even the best High Flux filters usually have a maximum blood flow (pump speed) of 600 mL/min.  This means any speed faster will not result in better clearance of toxins.  You're just spinning your wheels, so to speak.

In fact, some Hi Flux filters have a maximum blood flow of 500 mL/min., such as the Fresenius (Optiflux) F160NR.  Standard flux filters have even a lower threshold.

Well I am not sure what to call it but I was talking about this test they do where they use different tubing than normal where they reverse the lines 1/2 way through the test.

Anyway, yes. It my dialysate flow is a800.

[Joe Paul]

Never heard of "crushing"blood cells, only thing I was cautioned about, was to high a temperature on the machine (blood warming), can cause the red blood cells to explode.

[BigSky]

Well I am not sure what to call it but I was talking about this test they do where they use different tubing than normal where they reverse the lines 1/2 way through the test.

Anyway, yes. It my dialysate flow is a800.

They are measuring the actual  blood flow of the access itself when they do that.

[angieskidney]

Well I am not sure what to call it but I was talking about this test they do where they use different tubing than normal where they reverse the lines 1/2 way through the test.

Anyway, yes. It my dialysate flow is a800.

They are measuring the actual  blood flow of the access itself when they do that.

Ah ok THAT  is what I meant when I had said 800 previously 

[kevno]

Damn not typing it again Bloody computer

The short version.
Pump speed never over 220 and going down.

Lines in for 3 years now, not bad really.

Infection in lines, they want to put new ones in. Lab results, well to put it one way Crap!

Can not have lines put in usual way. Tried two times, failed two times. Needles Phobia, that held down child keeps coming out of me So have to be put in down in theater. Not sure what to do. See if the antibiotics work. But even if they do work will never get good pump speeds out of these lines The lines are just to old, I was told lines last 3 months to a max of 1 year

[angieskidney]

And you said yours is a Fistula Kevno? I thought they lasted a lot longer than that .. well depending on certain circumstances...

[kevno]

No My lines have been in for 3 years now. I have not mentioned my fistula, or should I say my so called re-vamped fistula. Had the first needle in the fistula today since about March. This fistula I have had since 1980, it stopped 2000. The surgeons had a go at starting it again 2001. After a 3 hour operation 2 surgeons, one was not too sure how to compleat the operation. 44 staples a cut from my wrist to my shoulder. I have a 2 inch stretch which can be needled. Pump speed today was a little bit better 250 WOW! Not happy about being needled.

[Panda_9]

Wouldnt needling more regularly help your fistula a bit kevno?

[kevno]

No Amber, The vein below it is fully blocked, and the vein above is the artery, but too small to do anyting with So just this small stretch which can never in prove.