Contraception and CKD

[cariad]

Religion is all about social control, and women with their scary sexuality and their independent thoughts have always been target one of any and every religion. It is mind boggling to me that any male thinks they should be given a say in what I do with my body. It is laughable that people can talk about losing freedoms and then rail against women being able to control their own physical person. I control what happens to my body. Live with it.

Do whatever you want, what business of that is mine!!

But that is the point isn't it, you want the privacy of making your own choices which I agree, make your own choices. I believe we are all individually accountable for our own actions. No problem Cariad, abort away all you wish. But keep it your private issue and don't make it a public issue that my tax dollars pay for.

Once again, why not read through the entire thread and see that I am actually looking at the rights you will lose by Federal control of contraception and abortion. You fail to understand that those are not actions I am the least bit interested in for myself so his edict has absolutely no affect on my life whatsoever. You fail to understand that your private issues are now public issues under Obamacare and they will assuredly regulate them.

So you are right, I could really care less what you do, it is your life after all, and you are right, if the Feds wish to regulate your sex life, so be it, that is what you are asking for. Perhaps one day you will wake up and it will be the Feds telling you what to do and you will have no recourse but to realize, you asked for their control of your private affairs. So be it, have it your way and I hope all of you in support of these issues enjoy your brave new world of Federal control of even your "private" affairs. Guess what, they are now public and under control of the Feds. Enjoy.

I am not in the least concerned with any of your specious arguments. The Federal government is securing the rights of millions of women through their involvement, because as any healthcare provider can tell you, cost is one way to control a society's actions, and when cost or availability are prohibitive, then that renders the right to do something useless.

I don't need your permission to do anything with my body, did not ask for it, reject it out of hand. I don't read these threads in their entirety because of your continued use of bible quotes and your appalling lack of respect for Obama. He is not a dictator by any definition and your inflammatory remarks are not appreciated. If you truly do not care what people do in the privacy of their own homes then I find it bizarre that you would bring up gay marriage rights in a discussion of contraception. How many Einsteins have been aborted? What a ludicrous argument. Have you really reached that point? I don't know, how many Einsteins died by hospital error, or by preventable disease because their parents did not have health insurance, or because they were deported back to some hellhole country, or because they were sent to war and blown to pieces before they could reach their full potential? How many were never created because someone said "Not tonight, dear, I'm just not in the mood". How many were gay and told 'your sexual desires are an abomination' by some religion and snapped and killed themselves? You can play that laughable game all day.

As I said, enjoy Federal regulation of sex in America. Not the first country to walk down that path. Perhaps we can learn from what other countries have accomplished in state countrol of the bedroom. Not pretty in my opinion, but please have your precious freedom. Just be careful what you ask for.

And as I said, I do not need nor desire your permission to do anything. I will enjoy seeing Barack Obama reelected and continue to outwit the Republican party. Enjoy your outrage and your attempts to scare women out of demanding that their very basic human rights be preserved by the federal government.

[Hemodoc]

The same applies to individuals who accept Federal money for any entitlement, they must also comply with all of those Federal regulations in exchange for the money. That will also apply to people who have Federal payment for contraceptives and abortion. Very simply, the Feds never give anything for free, it always comes with strings attached.

My apologies for being thick, but this is the bit I don't quite understand.  I am not vastly educated on this topic, so maybe you can help.

As I understand it, and I may certainly be wrong, the only time that the federal govt subsidises abortion is if the woman is a Medicaid recipient and if she has become pregant due to rape or insist, OR if her pregnancy is deemed to be medically dangerous and her life would be endangered should she continue with the pregancy.  Is this correct or not?  If this is correct, then yes, you are right...there are strings attached. 

I am not sure, however, which strings are attached to any federal funding of birth control which are applied to INDIVIDUALS as opposed to those regulations imposed upon Catholic institutions.  I'd like to hear more about these strings.  Thanks.

Go read the Obamacare health care act.

As far as contraceptives, just about every insurance provider offers that already depending on the type of coverage you purchase. I would be very surprised that there is any more than a handful that don't.

On the other hand, I know of no insurance provider that provided abortions as part of the coverage. Everyone is focussing on contraceptives which are widely available in this nation already. Having insurance companies equate abortion to just another form of contraceptives is what hardly anyone is talking about, but that is the real issue in this entire debate. Since folks can go and get plan B in vending machines in some areas, who can say that access to contraceptives is not already universal?  Adding abortion as just "another" form of contraceptives crosses the line on so many different levels.

[KarenInWA]

Just because Obama is mandating that certain services be covered, does NOT mean that one is forced to use them!!! To not cover something because it affects my sex organs is just plain discrimination! What Santorum is prescribing for this country, and what the Republicans are trying to sign into law in VA, scares me more than my President signing into law services that I, as a hard working American, must have *access* to! Giving me access vs taking that access away??? Thank you, but I'd rather have as many choices available to me as possible, so I may get the coverage for the healthcare I need.

Bear in mind, I am a spoiled union employee. I have been lucky to have been through 7 months of dialysis with no out-of-pocket expense for it, and am now almost 3 months post-transplant with only drug co-pays out of my pocket. I do pay for Medicare, so I am sure that has helped, too. But, I did not pay for that until shortly before my surgery, so my dialysis was paid for 100% even w/o Medicare. I am very thankful that my job affords me this healthcare that I need. I guess this means I have higher expectations when it comes to caring for my own health. If only everyone could be as lucky.

KarenInWA

[Hemodoc]

Religion is all about social control, and women with their scary sexuality and their independent thoughts have always been target one of any and every religion. It is mind boggling to me that any male thinks they should be given a say in what I do with my body. It is laughable that people can talk about losing freedoms and then rail against women being able to control their own physical person. I control what happens to my body. Live with it.

Do whatever you want, what business of that is mine!!

But that is the point isn't it, you want the privacy of making your own choices which I agree, make your own choices. I believe we are all individually accountable for our own actions. No problem Cariad, abort away all you wish. But keep it your private issue and don't make it a public issue that my tax dollars pay for.

Once again, why not read through the entire thread and see that I am actually looking at the rights you will lose by Federal control of contraception and abortion. You fail to understand that those are not actions I am the least bit interested in for myself so his edict has absolutely no affect on my life whatsoever. You fail to understand that your private issues are now public issues under Obamacare and they will assuredly regulate them.

So you are right, I could really care less what you do, it is your life after all, and you are right, if the Feds wish to regulate your sex life, so be it, that is what you are asking for. Perhaps one day you will wake up and it will be the Feds telling you what to do and you will have no recourse but to realize, you asked for their control of your private affairs. So be it, have it your way and I hope all of you in support of these issues enjoy your brave new world of Federal control of even your "private" affairs. Guess what, they are now public and under control of the Feds. Enjoy.

I am not in the least concerned with any of your specious arguments. The Federal government is securing the rights of millions of women through their involvement, because as any healthcare provider can tell you, cost is one way to control a society's actions, and when cost or availability are prohibitive, then that renders the right to do something useless.

I don't need your permission to do anything with my body, did not ask for it, reject it out of hand. I don't read these threads in their entirety because of your continued use of bible quotes and your appalling lack of respect for Obama. He is not a dictator by any definition and your inflammatory remarks are not appreciated. If you truly do not care what people do in the privacy of their own homes then I find it bizarre that you would bring up gay marriage rights in a discussion of contraception. How many Einsteins have been aborted? What a ludicrous argument. Have you really reached that point? I don't know, how many Einsteins died by hospital error, or by preventable disease because their parents did not have health insurance, or because they were deported back to some hellhole country, or because they were sent to war and blown to pieces before they could reach their full potential? How many were never created because someone said "Not tonight, dear, I'm just not in the mood". How many were gay and told 'your sexual desires are an abomination' by some religion and snapped and killed themselves? You can play that laughable game all day.

As I said, enjoy Federal regulation of sex in America. Not the first country to walk down that path. Perhaps we can learn from what other countries have accomplished in state countrol of the bedroom. Not pretty in my opinion, but please have your precious freedom. Just be careful what you ask for.

And as I said, I do not need nor desire your permission to do anything. I will enjoy seeing Barack Obama reelected and continue to outwit the Republican party. Enjoy your outrage and your attempts to scare women out of demanding that their very basic human rights be preserved by the federal government.

You are too funny since I don't have outrage about this at all. Sadness yes, outrage no.

In fact, contraception is universally available in America already. So is access to abortion services, many of which are free and already funded by the Feds.

So go ahead and demand that the government have control over every aspect of your life. I am not the least of which stopping you from that demand. Go ahead, I could care less as I have stated a dozen times over. I probably don't have that much time left in this world anyway. It is not going to affect me. In the end, the only people that Obama is outwitting is those not smart enough to see what he is doing. But if that is what you want, then by all means, enjoy.

[cariad]

Giving me access vs taking that access away???

Exactly! It's a desperate, last-gasp argument from people who want to whine that they cannot control every last dollar spent by this government and every last woman who lives in this country.

Yes, I'll keep my freedoms and I will enjoy.

[Hemodoc]

Giving me access vs taking that access away???

Exactly! It's a desperate, last-gasp argument from people who want to whine that they cannot control every last dollar spent by this government and every last woman who lives in this country.

Yes, I'll keep my freedoms and I will enjoy.

Thank you, and I will enjoy my freedom to protest what the government is doing and interfering in personal, private matters and my freedom to quote the Bible when and where I please as well.

[cariad]

Giving me access vs taking that access away???

Exactly! It's a desperate, last-gasp argument from people who want to whine that they cannot control every last dollar spent by this government and every last woman who lives in this country.

Yes, I'll keep my freedoms and I will enjoy.

Thank you, and I will enjoy my freedom to protest what the government is doing and interfering in personal, private matters and my freedom to quote the Bible when and where I please as well.

Go for it. Women who consider it an interference to be given these services free of charge will enjoy their right to refuse that assistance and pay for any desired services out of pocket. It's a win for all. 

[MooseMom]

I'm going to exercise my freedom of speech and try to get this discussion back on track because for those of us with severe renal disease, it's a relevant discussion.  I'm not sure how many of us on IHD have the energy for indulging in wanton sex, so let's just assume that for us, the birth control dilemma is a medical issue. 

I know that this is still a personal question, however, but I would still like to know if there is anyone out there who is struggling with making this decision.  Is there anyone who feels that using birth control is wrong but is still having to consider it because of renal disease?  If so, what things are influencing your thinking?  Or, even more difficult, are you a man whose wife has CKD and is considering using birth control (and may well be encouraged to do so by her medical team), but YOU are the one who doesn't like the idea for religious reasons?  How do you, as a husband, cope with the situation?  We hear a lot from our female members, but if you are a husband of a woman with CKD, what do you think?

Thank you.

[MooseMom]

I probably don't have that much time left in this world anyway.

Wait a minute.  This is a troubling comment.  I hope there's nothing wrong...

[Hemodoc]

I probably don't have that much time left in this world anyway.

Wait a minute.  This is a troubling comment.  I hope there's nothing wrong...

Northing more than renal disease which is enough. The average life expectancy for someone my age is about 10 years, I have used half of them up already with 5 years of dialysis to date. No firm data for daily dialysis, but it is a reality for all of us on dialysis. I made the comment in relative terms in that I don't expect to see the full effects all of this political mess, but I may be surprised.

[MooseMom]

You're hardly "average", Hemodoc!

I suspect that yes, you WILL be surprised.  That's my hope, at least.

[Hemodoc]

You're hardly "average", Hemodoc!

I suspect that yes, you WILL be surprised.  That's my hope, at least.

One can only hope.

God bless,

Peter

[MooseMom]

I have one last question.  It has occurred to me that men can control their own fertility by having a vasectomy in cases where their wife might have renal disease and for whatever reason cannot tolerate various forms of birth control.  How does all of this "religious liberty" debate affect access to vasectomy?  Does anyone know?  Is it usually a urologist that performs this procedure?  Do Catholic institutions ban insurance coverage for vasectomy?  Do Catholic urologists routinely avoid doing this procedure?  Is vasectomy considered to be against any religious teaching?

Thanks to anyone who might have some answers!

[KarenInWA]

I have one last question.  It has occurred to me that men can control their own fertility by having a vasectomy in cases where their wife might have renal disease and for whatever reason cannot tolerate various forms of birth control.  How does all of this "religious liberty" debate affect access to vasectomy?  Does anyone know?  Is it usually a urologist that performs this procedure?  Do Catholic institutions ban insurance coverage for vasectomy?  Do Catholic urologists routinely avoid doing this procedure?  Is vasectomy considered to be against any religious teaching?

Thanks to anyone who might have some answers!

MM, I think I can answer some of those questions. Yes, it is a urologist who performs vastectomies. I used to work in a multi-specialty clinic and was friends with the urology nurse. I know if I were married or in an otherwise commited relationship, I would want a permanent option such as vastectomy. I would probably still be on the pill, though, due to my obnoxious periods (which have taken a break since shortly after my tx - no complaints here! and no, I'm not currently on the pill, either.). From what I understand, vasectomy is a sin in the Catholic church, and also is not covered under their insurance. However, I do not know that as a fact, since I am not Catholic, nor do I work for anything they are affiliated with. I did work for a Catholic hospital for one year back in the 90's, but I was not benefit-eligible. I think you hear less about vasectomies in this whole issue because men only get them for one reason - to prevent conception. Where as women use contraception for reasons other than preventing pregnancy, and get some procedures done that eliminate fertility for reasons other than to prevent pregnancy (hysterectomy, ablation procedure, etc). Interestingly, in some of the googling I have done, I found out that the Mormon church supports tubiligation in rare instances, one being if the woman has renal disease. I thought that was interesting.

KarenInWA

[MooseMom]

Thanks for that, Karen.  And yes, you are right that the controversy centers on the fact that women do use birth control methods for reasons other than preventing pregancy.  Funnily enough, my gyn put me on the pill when I was 17 because I'd go sometimes as long as 6 months without having a period, and other times my period would LAST for 6 months.  So, the pill regulated my cycle.  What's interesting about this is that while I was told that I'd probably have trouble conceiving because my cycle would revert to its original chaos once I came off the pill, what actually happened was that even once I stopped taking it, my cycle remained regular, and as a result, I easily got pregnant.  How's THAT for irony.

[cassandra]

HELP HELP HELP> ON this subject!! I WANT birthcontrol. I hate condoms. I am finallymarried and refurse to use them, especially not that i am not sinning. But no doctor will give me birth control. One of the reasons why I want birth control is to get rid of my chest and facial hair, and my severe acne. Well the one birth control that im on is NOT working! A blood test has shown that I have high testortone levels (sp?) I was hoping birth control would get rid of those effects. And its not doing anything.

So, I am not suspose to have any kids on dialysis, and now because of dialysis I cant have birth control that will even help with my hormone levels??? WT_? I was on birth control before dialysis. THey say lupus + dialysis = no birthcontrol.
 I am so angry over this. I take nothing but vitamins and stool softners. Havent seen a lupus doctor in almost 2 years, been in remission for 13. Not on any blood pressure meds for over 2 years. 
 My facial hair and acne are NOT going away. I was told that dial ysis does not get rid of all of the testortone (sp?) in the blood stream.

Lisa

Dear Lisa, I sent you a PM before, but maybe that didn't arrive. Maybe you could try to decrease your testosteron by diet. I've just done some research how to increase my testosteron, cause that's too low, and found that very informative, and possitive. There was also information on how to lower it naturally, I will research that now and come back to you. I hope that will help a bit.

Cas

[Lillupie]

HELP HELP HELP> ON this subject!! I WANT birthcontrol. I hate condoms. I am finallymarried and refurse to use them, especially not that i am not sinning. But no doctor will give me birth control. One of the reasons why I want birth control is to get rid of my chest and facial hair, and my severe acne. Well the one birth control that im on is NOT working! A blood test has shown that I have high testortone levels (sp?) I was hoping birth control would get rid of those effects. And its not doing anything.

So, I am not suspose to have any kids on dialysis, and now because of dialysis I cant have birth control that will even help with my hormone levels??? WT_? I was on birth control before dialysis. THey say lupus + dialysis = no birthcontrol.
 I am so angry over this. I take nothing but vitamins and stool softners. Havent seen a lupus doctor in almost 2 years, been in remission for 13. Not on any blood pressure meds for over 2 years. 
 My facial hair and acne are NOT going away. I was told that dial ysis does not get rid of all of the testortone (sp?) in the blood stream.

Lisa

Dear Lisa, I sent you a PM before, but maybe that didn't arrive. Maybe you could try to decrease your testosteron by diet. I've just done some research how to increase my testosteron, cause that's too low, and found that very informative, and possitive. There was also information on how to lower it naturally, I will research that now and come back to you. I hope that will help a bit.

Cas

No, intrestingly I never got your pm. Let me know if you find anything on how to lower it naturally. Apparently birth control does not help, or is not helping. After 3 months, my acne and facial hair will not go away. My Ob/gyn is willing to give a hormonal birth control a try on me. If this doesnt work I am going to stop it.. Im leaving it all to God's hands. But yeah let me know.

Lisa

[MooseMom]

Oh, look at your wedding photo, lillupie!  How lovely!!

[cassandra]

Okay dear Lillupie, What I can find is that 1. Wholegrain grains,wheats, and rice are good for increasing your oestrogen (therefore lowering T).           
                                                       2. Eating as little sugar, and sweeteners will reduce insulin levels, and therefore reduce production of androgenlevels which would increase T.
                                                       3. Low fat, less meat, nutmeg and thyme.
                                                       4. Apples and cherries are phyto-oestrogen rich (plant oestrogen)
                                                       5. replace tea/coffee for spearmint (regulates hormone imbalance)
Although quite difficult I think that is still possible while on D. On all sites it mentioned to loose weight too, but on your picture you don't look as if you need that (I still don't know how the smileys work, otherwise I would have put some in) Many more 'treatments' were mentioned, including herbs and natural meds, but I would not take them, so I would not 'advise' you to take them either of course. I hope I have helped a teeny weeny little?

good luck Cas

[Lillupie]

Oh, look at your wedding photo, lillupie!  How lovely!!

Thank you!