I Hate Dialysis Message Board
Dialysis Discussion => Dialysis: General Discussion => Topic started by: KICKSTART on July 30, 2008, 11:15:55 AM
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Ok ive been on PD long enough to know my ups and downs and i know right now i desperate need of iron but .. i cant go for IV iron because my BP is way too high , easy solution i know is to lower BP, but i have had high BP for a few years now , so its not the answer. Im showing all the symptoms of needing iron especially breathlessness ( no its deffo not fluid overload). The hospital feel iron tablets useless , just because of the amount of iron needed, but have no other solution than IV iron . Anyone any suggestions what to do ?
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How about iron-rich foods KS ??? I don't do PD so I'm shaky about the dietary strictness but I'd try getting some iron that way if at all possible.
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meat usually helps for me, not to much though
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When Stephen was on hemo, I cooked an "eye of round" every week so that he always had beef for a sandwich or dinner. It's a good source of iron. It's not that expensive and relatively easy to cook (rub with dijon mustard, or garlic powder or pepper and roast at 450 F for 1 hour; let sit for 20 minutes; works for typical 2-3 pound roast). It's worth a try.
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If you can stomach the iron tablets, I'd take them anyhow - at least they would keep your iron levels from dropping any lower. Add in as much iron rich food as possible, and don't forget to take some calcium as well - it helps your body absorb iron.
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I'm not sure about others, but use caution with iron pills, they can cause REALLY BAD constipation, at least in our experience, iron infusion is no problem, but never again with pills.......
luckily, we both like canned spinach with a little vinegar, is high in iron and we can usually get by fine with a small dose of iron every 1-2 months.
Tom
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brrrrr...beef or spinich, blch :puke;...what else???, they loaded me with iron again today.
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When Stephen was on hemo, I cooked an "eye of round" every week so that he always had beef for a sandwich or dinner. It's a good source of iron. It's not that expensive and relatively easy to cook (rub with dijon mustard, or garlic powder or pepper and roast at 450 F for 1 hour; let sit for 20 minutes; works for typical 2-3 pound roast). It's worth a try.
What time should I be there :rofl;
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Er thanks for suggestions guys ..i think ! Spinach sorry :puke;
Pelagia ..er whats an 'eye of round' ? never seen or heard of that over here ( plus steak/beef is quite expensive over here)
Iron tablets ..no can do , unless i go hibernate in the loo (terrible constipation!)
You would think there would be some other solution when you cant have IV but are really in need of iron , the thing is to bring my levels up , i would need to eat food in quantities of a giant ! Normal food portions wouldnt provide anything like the amount , thats why thay dont really bother with tablets and give us IV because of how much we really need.
Anyway it was worth asking , there might have been some 'super' food out there i didnt know about!!!
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liver is supposed to be a great source of it...I wouldn't know from personal experience, but that's what I was always told.
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If you do a google search of "iron rich foods" you'll find a list and maybe you can find something you can eat more of to help a bit.
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Renal vitamins with an Iron Supplement: http://www.dialyvite.net/default.asp?edid=60 (4th one down)
I take them along with the IV Iron that I get...neph said it was okay and I no longer get the "Restless" feelings that go along with low iron levels.
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Pelagia ..er whats an 'eye of round' ? never seen or heard of that over here ( plus steak/beef is quite expensive over here)
Here's the best I can do -- the "eye of round" is at the back end of the beef.
http://www.banderagrassland.com/beef-diagram2.gif
This is one of the moderately priced cuts of beef in our grocery store, especially if you buy it on sale. Plus, there is almost no waste. It is not especially tender, but good when sliced very thin.
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When my late husband's blood count was very low (due to chemotherapy) we got it up by him eating liver bacon and onion casserole (bacon & onions to make the liver more palatable!) at least twice a week, 3 times if he could stomach it and broccoli at every meal. If you make the casserole with a nice tasty gravy and mix the spinach into it at the last minute it really isn't as bad as it sounds..............I used to eat it too and I don't like spinach or liver but the nice casserole gravy made it edible! :)
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Kickstart I'm sorry I don't know the answer. What is your Iron level at present? Mine is 71.5 and and I'm told that is defficient but they won't give me anything for it not because of high blood pessure but because my haemoglobin is so high (14.6)
What are the symptoms of low iron?
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There is quite a bit of good info on the web about foods to choose. Most seem to point to liver, but liver is also higher in phosphorus and potassium. According to my nutrition software the mineral contents of beef liver and beef roast are as follows:
beef liver, cooked (3 oz., 85 g) - 5.8 mg iron; 342 mg phosphorus; 200 mg potassium
beef, eye of round, cooked (3 oz, 85 g) - 1.2 mg iron; 162 mg phosphorus; 88 mg potassium
Looks like the liver is best if you can handle to P and K. You would have to eat more than 4x as much roast to get the same amount of iron as in a serving of liver. Good thing it's not the other way around! You'd have to really love liver :puke;
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This doesn't provide a ton of iron, but my neph told me to use old fashioned iron skillets for cooking...you actually pick up bit that way. If you fry up a burger or steak or something, even more.
There are also gentle release (Soft FE) iron tablets that are gentler on the system...I took them for awhile with no real problems.
And spinach is great, but not the canned or cooked kind...just use it instead of lettuce for salads...or mix some in with lettuce and it's tasty.
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The thing is with all the foods suggested you would have to eat such large quantities to get any benefit and sorry but even the smell of liver makes me want to :puke; never mind eat it .
The thing is its not going to right itself and if my bp is always too high whats going to be the answer? Today i feel as weak as a kitten , light headed and very tired and i pretty much think its the anemia . I rang the venofer clinic to see what they say and guess what ...3 phone numbers and all answer machines (no despite ringing this morning , no one has contacted me) so it looks like i will have to try again on monday.
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Sorry that you are feeling so bad Kickstart.
Here's one more idea. When my husband was trying to get his magnesium up post-transplant, the neph had him spread his mag pills out as much as possible over the course of the day. If you have the option to take more than one iron pill, or split a pill, maybe you can try this. In principal it should increase overall absorption.
I also found this on the web:
"A number of dietary factors influence iron absorption. Ascorbate and citrate increase (comment from me - e.g. vitamin C) iron uptake in part by acting as weak chelators to help to solubilize the metal in the duodenum (comment from me - small intestine). Iron is readily transferred from these compounds into the mucosal lining cells. Conversely, iron absorption is inhibited by plant phytates and tannins. These compounds also chelate iron, but prevent its uptake by the absorption machinery. Phytates are prominent in wheat and some other cereals, while tannins are prevalent in (non-herbal) teas."
"Heme (comment from me - iron-rich compound inside blood cells) is absorbed by machinery completely different to that of inorganic iron. The process is more efficient and is independent of duodenal pH . Consequently meats are excellent nutrient sources of iron."
This suggests that taking iron pills with something acidic would help with absorption, while taking pills with bread, cereal and tea would lower absorption. On the other hand, the iron from meat should be easily absorbed.
here's one site http://sickle.bwh.harvard.edu/iron_absorption.html
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If your hemoglobin level is low, no amount of iron will help because your hemo count (red blood cells) is what processes the iron. So first make sure your hemo count
is within range. If it isn't then EPO shots are in order to bring your hemoglobin count within range. However, remember that kidney disease patients are likely to have
low hemo levels and doctors take the position that being in the low range is acceptable because EPO shots are thought to produce negative side effects. (hence the
whole stink about medicare only paying for EPO under certain hemo levels for kidney dialysis patients). If your hemo levels are within range, then try SLO-Fe iron tablets,
maybe 1/2 a pill, to see if you can tolerate them. I used to take them when having chemotherapy at low doses. Warning, though, I kept taking them when not needed, and I ended up with an orange tongue and orange skin from overdosing.Too much iron can be dangerous.
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First thing this morning i got back onto the clinic and yay someone answered ! Anyway they are going to have a word with the doctors to see what can be done if i can have iron or not ..so i should know this afternoon. I told her if i cant can she ask what else i can do. fingers crossed ! x
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The clinic rang me about half hour ago and have said YES i can have my IV iron :clap; It seems there is a high risk when you have it of it raising your b.p. but seeing mine is through the roof anyway , i dont think they are bothered !