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Author Topic: Pulling needles.  (Read 1868 times)
Jay72
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« on: August 18, 2008, 09:55:13 PM »

I was just wondering, any of you that do home hemo, do you pull both needles at the same time or do you pull one and hold it then pull the other and wait another 10 minutes?  I find by the time I am done I just want to finish, not have to hold for 20 minutes all together.  Please let me know how you go about doing it, and by the way I don't have a clamp I can use.

Thanks for the input,

Jay
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monrein
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« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2008, 07:57:27 AM »

I hold both at the same time Jay.  I pull the venous needle and press down with my index finger on it then pull the arterial and press with my middle finger.  I like to make sure I'm not leaking before putting on my bandages.  Ten minutes would be my maximum holding time.  I've never used a clamp and have been strongly advised not to as they can shorten the life of the fistula.  Many do use them however.

I forgot to say that I use a gauze pad to press down with, just in case anyone thought I meant with my bare finger.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2008, 01:12:30 PM by monrein » Logged

Pyelonephritis (began at 8 mos old)
Home haemo 1980-1985 (self-cannulated with 15 gauge sharps)
Cadaveric transplant 1985
New upper-arm fistula April 2008
Uldall-Cook catheter inserted May 2008
Haemo-dialysis, self care unit June 2008
(2 1/2 hours X 5 weekly)
Self-cannulated, 15 gauge blunts, buttonholes.
Living donor transplant (sister-in law Kathy) Feb. 2009
First failed kidney transplant removed Apr.  2009
Second trx doing great so far...all lab values in normal ranges
Meinuk
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« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2008, 08:24:38 AM »

Jay, we some of this when I was training on NxStage in a post here  http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=5229.msg83201#msg83201

Currently I:

pull the venous out 1/2 way, then sure seal, then pull the needle completely then wad a 4x4 and tape over the buttonhole & hold

Then do the same with my arterial. 

I actually don't have to hold for very long because I usually clot quite quickly.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2008, 12:30:00 PM by Meinuk » Logged

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47 with PKD
deceased donor transplant 11/2/08
nxstage 10/07 - 11/08;  30LS/S; 20LT/W/R  @450
temp. permcath:  inserted 5/07 - removed 7/19/07
in-center hemo:  m/w/f 1/12/07
list: 6/05
a/v fistula: 5/05
NxStage training diary post (10/07):  http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=5229.0
Newspaper article: Me dialyzing alone:  http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=7332.0
Transplant post 11/08):  http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=10893.msg187492#msg187492
Fistula removal post (7/10): http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=18735.msg324217#msg324217
Post Transplant Skin Cancer (2/14): http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=30659.msg476547#msg476547

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petey
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« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2008, 03:17:02 PM »

I pull both of Marvin's needles at the same time...well, not EXACTLY the same time.  I have a folded gauze ready, then pull the venous.  I pull it about 1/2 to 2/3 out then apply pressure with the gauze as I'm totally removing the needle.  Marvin and I "swap" the hold and he puts his thumb on it.  I get another gauze, fold it, and pull the arterial.  (Same quick method of gauze on top, quick pressure.)  Then, we switch again and Marvin holds this site with his index finger (same hand that thumb's holding the other site).  He sits there for about 10 minutes with his thumb and index finger holding the two sites at the same time.  While he's doing this, I "break down" and clean his machine.  When I'm done with clean up, I check first one site and then the other to make sure they've clotted and put band-aids on each.  This method works for us; however, when Marvin had surgery in late July on his other arm (the one he "holds" with), I had to do all the holding for him while his sites clotted.
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G-Ma
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« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2008, 03:29:32 PM »

We do venous first on mine and clots rather quickly and a couple min after that we do arterial but it goes on 10 min so don't know if it's because I'm still pressing down on venous or not.  Wish me luck I think I'm going to start self canu tomorrow.....trainer is afraid cuz I REALLY roll.....why didn't the Dr just stitch it in place????  :rofl;
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Lost vision due to retinopathy 12/2005, 30 Laser Surg 2006
ESRD diagnosed 12/2006
03/2007 Fantastic Eye Surgeon in ND got my sight back and implanted lenses in both eyes, great distance & low reading.
Gortex 4/07.  Started dialysis in ND 5/4/2007
Gortex clotted off Thanksgiving Week of 2007, was unclotted and promptly clotted off 1/2 hour later so Permacath Rt chest.
3/2008 move to NC to be close to children.
2 Step fistula, 05/08-elevated 06/08, using mid August.
Aug 5, 08, trained NxStage and Home on 9/3/2008.
Fistulagram 09/2008. In hospital 10/30/08, Bowel Obstruction.
Back to RAI-Latrobe In Center. No home hemo at this time.
GOD IS GOOD
Ang
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« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2008, 04:05:59 PM »

when  i  trained  for  home  haemo(did'nt  pass) i  used  to  watch  the  people  who  came  in  pull  their  needles  out  with  their  teeth
imagine  it,put the  tube  between  your  teeth,pull  the   needle  and  cover  with  gauze.
 :puke;  if  you've  never seen  it  before
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del
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« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2008, 04:17:12 PM »

I ditto Petey's method!!!  We were also told not to use a clamp because it cam damage the fistula.  Is your wife available to help you pull the needles Jay??  Just takes some practice to do it on your own.
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Bajanne
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« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2008, 05:16:58 PM »

I know that this is to do with home hemo, and I am in-center, but we have the choice of both or one at a time (venous always first).  I would love to do both, but I find I never am able to hold both properly.  Sometimes when I am racing against time, the nurse would try to let me hold both, but she usually ends up having to hold one for me.  My venous stops very quickly, but the arterial always takes a long time.  Once a month or so ago, it took over an hour to stop.
They always put a sureseal and then gauze.
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jbeany
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« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2008, 07:20:35 PM »

I only do one at a time - doing both tends to get messy.  I've got small hands, and I have a hard time stretching to cover both sites.  My hand ends up cramping up from trying to stretch that far, and then I end up off center and bloody!
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G-Ma
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« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2008, 06:02:51 PM »

Well, today I did my own cannulation and pulled the needles, did great on both..yipee...was holding and so proud of myself that I must have loosend my hold and yesireeee bob..........so much for good job......another day tomorrow.
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Lost vision due to retinopathy 12/2005, 30 Laser Surg 2006
ESRD diagnosed 12/2006
03/2007 Fantastic Eye Surgeon in ND got my sight back and implanted lenses in both eyes, great distance & low reading.
Gortex 4/07.  Started dialysis in ND 5/4/2007
Gortex clotted off Thanksgiving Week of 2007, was unclotted and promptly clotted off 1/2 hour later so Permacath Rt chest.
3/2008 move to NC to be close to children.
2 Step fistula, 05/08-elevated 06/08, using mid August.
Aug 5, 08, trained NxStage and Home on 9/3/2008.
Fistulagram 09/2008. In hospital 10/30/08, Bowel Obstruction.
Back to RAI-Latrobe In Center. No home hemo at this time.
GOD IS GOOD
flip
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« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2008, 06:10:55 PM »

Good job, G-Ma.  I'm still working on my clamping technique (when I get a nurse that will let me). You don't have to hold them and you can do both back to back. Much less time.
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G-Ma
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« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2008, 06:24:15 PM »

That was the first thing I looked for when I started at NXSt and I was beat soundly with a stick.......I feel a clamp would not be as dangerous as a tourneqet used incorrectly...but who the h_ _ _ am I??   :Kit n Stik;
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Lost vision due to retinopathy 12/2005, 30 Laser Surg 2006
ESRD diagnosed 12/2006
03/2007 Fantastic Eye Surgeon in ND got my sight back and implanted lenses in both eyes, great distance & low reading.
Gortex 4/07.  Started dialysis in ND 5/4/2007
Gortex clotted off Thanksgiving Week of 2007, was unclotted and promptly clotted off 1/2 hour later so Permacath Rt chest.
3/2008 move to NC to be close to children.
2 Step fistula, 05/08-elevated 06/08, using mid August.
Aug 5, 08, trained NxStage and Home on 9/3/2008.
Fistulagram 09/2008. In hospital 10/30/08, Bowel Obstruction.
Back to RAI-Latrobe In Center. No home hemo at this time.
GOD IS GOOD
del
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Our new "toy"

« Reply #12 on: August 21, 2008, 05:32:39 PM »

Hubby doesn't use a tourneqet since I started needling him.  He just holds his arm with his hand.  He has started putting in his own venous needle with me holding his fistula!!  :2thumbsup;
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G-Ma
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« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2008, 05:41:33 PM »

yahoo dels hubby and del.
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Lost vision due to retinopathy 12/2005, 30 Laser Surg 2006
ESRD diagnosed 12/2006
03/2007 Fantastic Eye Surgeon in ND got my sight back and implanted lenses in both eyes, great distance & low reading.
Gortex 4/07.  Started dialysis in ND 5/4/2007
Gortex clotted off Thanksgiving Week of 2007, was unclotted and promptly clotted off 1/2 hour later so Permacath Rt chest.
3/2008 move to NC to be close to children.
2 Step fistula, 05/08-elevated 06/08, using mid August.
Aug 5, 08, trained NxStage and Home on 9/3/2008.
Fistulagram 09/2008. In hospital 10/30/08, Bowel Obstruction.
Back to RAI-Latrobe In Center. No home hemo at this time.
GOD IS GOOD
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