depression and drinking

[pelagia]

Thanks, everyone, for the well wishes. I am so very grateful for the support. And, yes, Pelagia, I find great peace in my garden. (We need a flower icon.)

Here it is - and this one is just for you Anna

[okarol]

Karol, I have thought a great deal about moving on. But he is such a good-hearted man and he and I have truly become the greatest of friends during all this. Yes, he's very selfish. But sometimes that's okay. 

You need to do what works for you. I support your decision to stay. My reason for mentioning alanon is because there are spouses who stay and spouses who leave. In alanon meetings you can find someone with a similar experience who will be helpful to you. No one can truly appreciate what you're going through except someone who has been in your shoes. I wish you all the best. The flower I added is for you.
 

[annabanana]

 

Thank you!

Karen, I agree so much with everything you said...and I wish Randy felt that way.

[annabanana]

this flower icon even looks like my avatar flower a bit.

[RichardMEL]

Anna this is a horribly tough time for you and it's very hard to know what to suggest except, like the others, to offer as much support as possible.

There's a guy who I reckon is like Randy in my unit. He eats whatever, he drinks whatever (though I don't think he touches alcohol)... he's a diabetic and thanks to his overweight situation and his CONSCIOUS DECISION to basically ignore his diet and fluid restrictions... well you know what? I look at this guy, he's only a few years older than me.. and I feel sorry for him. All he's doing is shortening his OWN life and making it worse in the long run. Oh yeah, I can understand his (and Randy's and the diabetic guy) point of view - I've got to deal with all this crap so I want to enjoy as much as I can. However it's short sighted in the extreme. This guy is going blind from his diabetes, and I am sure his labs are shocking (but I don't know) and well.. I hate to say it, but I can't see this person living a long life.. and of course he won't get anywhere near the transplant list the way he is treating his body.... Now you can tell him all this (and the staff do).. but he just ignores it.

In the end everyone is responsible for their own lives and how they lead them. I can certainly understand the "I want to enjoy things" idea... so many times I feel like "lashing out" and just drinking stuff all night etc... but I know that will make me happy for a few hours.. but could cause untold harm longer term (specially if it's something I did on a regular basis). I live with the goal to get a successful transplant and hopefully be able to return to a more normal life.

As for Randy... it's so hard because he probably can see the hurt and distress he's causing you and others around him, but he's probably fearful of making the changes he is being told he needs to make for his own good.

You have amazing strength and courage - bourne of love... and it is a beautiful thing to see.

I hope he can turn it around.. for both your sakes.

[annabanana]

RichardMEL, Thank you for the support.  I am always hoping that Randy can turn things around. A sad part about all this is that he was sober for 8 months after his surgery last August. He claims he was miserable, but I didn't see it. I was so shocked when he told me a few months ago that he wanted to start drinking again. It didn't make sense. The only thing I can think of that made him give up is the fact that there was little chance that the HCV medicines would work, because of his failing kidney. The other thing is that he knew he would never be able to drink again, having HCV. Even with these things being true, I still can't understand why he is choosing this path. I would fight to the death, like you and everyone else here.

I wish so much that he had a goal like yours. I think that's the most important thing. It doesn't even have to be a "big" goal...just a goal to wake up happy and healthy every morning is beautiful.

   

[RichardMEL]

Anna,

I feel everyone is different... For some it's easier than others to focus on the positives in one's life and try to make the most of the negatives. As I said before I'm really not sure what to suggest to you. It must be so difficult for you both. I am sure deep inside Randy knows his choice is doing him no good, and he probably feels embarrassed by that as well. Sometimes admitting that kind of thing is the hardest part... and perhaps talking to his sister was a very positive step.

I just wanted to add that it's not always easy sailing for me (and I bet others too!)... just because I talk about having goals and not wanting dialysis to run/ruin my life etc... there are days I find it very hard indeed and I wonder what's the point and get down and so on. I think that's normal. Well it better be normal anyway!!!

I was diagnosed over 15 years ago so I had plenty of time to come to terms with the fact of my kidney failure and impending dialysis. Randy hasn't had that sort of lead time (I think you wrote he was diagnosed just last year?)... Either way it's a horrible shock to be told something like this. I know before I was diagnosed I didn't give my kidneys a second thought... and a fluid limit for me was because I didn't have any money to buy another drink

Everyone deals in different ways.

Just know we all support you Anna.

[pelagia]

Anna, I don't have any advice to offer, but I do want you to know that I am thinking about you and came to find out how things are going. 

[annabanana]

RichardMEL, I think you have pointed out something very important: that Randy hasn't had time to process all this. So very, very true! I believe both Randy and I are still in a sort of shock about this. And because the research, when we find any at all, says that his options aren't good, we see "the end". So he gives up.

You have helped me to see things differently...to give Randy (and myself) more time to process this without assuming it's the end for him. I will somehow communicate this to him in the hope that it will ease his mind. I know he is, like you said, embarassed and feels weak, etc., because of his decision, so he fights even harder about his choice. What a horrible way to live.

You have changed my perspective on all this, RichardMEL, and I am deeply grateful.

Pelagia, thanks for thinking of me. 

[paris]

Anna, RichardMEL is so very right.  It took me over a year, maybe two before I got over the "I'm going to die" feeling.  This site is really what changed my attitude and helped me be in control of my life again.   Randy may feel like his whole world is spinning, he's received a bad diagnoses and why bother with anything.   RichardMEL,  your observation was excellent. It does take time to process all that is being thrown at you.     Anna, we are all here for you and Randy.  You are loved and admired by many

[lola]

Anna, as much as we the caregiver wants to make everything better we can't. One of the hardest things for me to do is sit back and give Otto time to process everything. He said once he would NEVER do Dialysis again and when he was told the time had come, he at first was saying NO. I as his wife and the mother of his 3 kids was heartbroken, how was I going to live with out him, how were my kids as they got older ever going to know just how much there dad loved them. Otto needed time, and thankfully I had my IHD family supporting me while I gave that to him and he changed his mind, and did what the Dr's said needed to be done. Randy will hopefully come around and until he does we are here, and if not please know your IHD family is here for you

[RichardMEL]

Thank you guys(& gals!) - I'm glad my observations are of some help (See, I do more on here than just flirt!!!  )

I have spoken to some people who had acute kidney failure and basically had NO warning.. One minute they're feeling and aparently fine.. next minute they're in the hospital getting a catheter stuck in and told it's Dialysis or bust. I simply can't grasp how that would feel. I can only take from my own situation where, after a routine checkup when starting a new job, they told me I had protein in my urine and I needed to go see a specialist. Well that meant nothing to me and I was thinking "so what? There's some crap in my waste. who cares?" Well.. yeah.. so I went to this neph who was recommended. We (my mum and I) went in and the very first thing he said was "You've got 2 years" (!) no preamble.. no nothing. And I never did find out if he meant that was 2 years till dialysis or 2 years full stop. Basically this guy was a class A JERK and we gave him the flick and managed to get in with a top doc who my mum had worked with previously (and I am still seeing him some 15 years later). Now that "you have 2 years" thing was a REAL shock to my system (I showed him though! It was 13 years after that pronouncement that I eventually started dialysis). So during that time I had the ability to try and do as much as I could.. travel etc... while I could because I had a fair idea how restricted life would be once D day arrived.

But for those others who were basically told overnight BANG! Your whole life is changing.... that can be a massive, massive shock to the system and adjustment can take a long time.

I know everyone here is behind Randy and you Anna to get things on the right track! I am sending all my vibes over to Randy that he can somehow see what he is doing is only worse for him in the longrun, and that will affect Anna and the rest of the family and friends. Hoping the corner is turned soon!!!

Keep us informed Anna. I know it's a struggle but we're out here thinking of you. 

[twirl]

anna
just thinking about you

[petey]

Anna,
We're thinking about you and Randy, too!   

[annabanana]

RichardMEL,
Yesterday I told Randy about you and your posts. He really listened to me. We both realized that we've been in shock since he was diagnosed with cancer last summer. Thought all would be well after the surgery, but found out about HCV the day after the kidney was removed. It's only been since January that we've known about his kidney failing. And then some time after that since we've known about the HCV medicines having negative effects on the kidneys.

Then the doctors, unlike your experience, didn't say much at all (until recently.) They really gave us nothing to go on. I think that's probably way better than what you went through, though. 

So I told him, rather than focusing on the "crisis" aspects of his illnesses, we need to give ourselves time to get over the shock. Not deny, but try to focus on life rather than impending death. He really responded to this conversation. I hope it helps him like it's helped me. 

RichardMEL, again a VERY grateful thank you!

Paris, yes, he is thinking "I am going to die soon" all the time. When he gets frustrated he says, "I don't have much longer." But just this morning he said, "In the fall I'm going to re-do the irrigation system in the garden."  YAY! So maybe yesterday's conversation did some good.

Lola, yes yes yes, it's so very difficult to sit back. I actually said this to Randy yesterday, too, about how I am always taking care of him and telling him he needs to do this or that. I told him I was going to ease up on that because it just brings the situation closer, doesn't give us time to just relax. This weekend we are going to our friend's place out in the country to fish and relax. He's the sober friend I mentioned in an above post. I'm hoping this will be good for R. to relax and also see the example of a happy sober man who is full of life.

Twirl and Petey, thank you for the kind thoughts. (Twirl, I really like the way you write my name!)

I feel so good about this change of perspective. I think it will help a lot.

Anna                         p.s. RichardMEL, you can flirt with me anytime!



   

[flip]

I think the road trip will do you both some good. I've been down basically the same road he has and I'm familiar with the feelings he is experiencing. It just takes some people a little longer to get over it. I accepted my fate and decided that I was make the best of it and I'm sure that, in time, Randy will too.

[monrein]

Thinking of you and Randy too Anna.  Hope you have a nice relaxing weekend.  You really are inspirational in how open and understanding you are, especially for me who grew up with an alcoholic Dad and struggled for many years to come to terms with his choices and to reach a deeper understanding of his motivations.  It is much easier to judge than to find compassion, but not nearly so useful.

[paris]

Anna,  the fishing and getting away sounds great.  One thing I notice with me, as soon as we leave town, I feel like I have left the disease behind.  Now, my husband and I plan little day trips to things like the Botanical Gardens, over to the beach for the day--anything to change the scenery.  It has really helped me.  I knew I was doing better mentally when I started making plans, like Randy and the irrigation system.  You both haven't had much time to process all that has been thrown at you.  You are doing a great job at helping Randy accept what is happening.  We are here for you!   

[annabanana]

Flip, I, too, think R. will come to terms with this eventually. He's never been sick in his life and he's a real "tough-guy" type of man so I thnk it might be harder for him than for someone like me. The road trip will hopefully allow him to relax a bit, which he's not used to doing.

Monrein, it is much easier to judge, and I certainly did that for a while. Almost left, actually, many times. I still don't have a true understanding of Randy's need to drink...and it still hurts me sometimes that I'm "not enough"...but the key now is that I don't own his issues. That makes it easier for me to feel compassion for him.

Paris, I hope he feels like you do, leaving the disease behind. If so, I will plan many trips! (I actually asked him to go to Chicago IHD but we a broke...)

Thank you all for your support and hugs.

[flip]

I know exactly how he feels because I was the same way. I was never sick until everything hit me at once and I spent months feeling sorry for myself. I wish you all could make it to the Chicago meeting. I would enjoy meeting you and Randy both.

[annabanana]

I wish we could make it, too. My niece lives in Chicago, and I thought if we could drive up (from Nashville) and stay with her it would be so great!
I would so love to meet everyone! And how awesome it would be for Randy to meet you, too. Just knowing he's not alone would be so good for him.

[pelagia]

This is such an insightful discussion.  One thing I always forget, because I tend to be really open with my feelings, is that others do a lot more internal processing.  Do wish you could get Randy together with some of the fellows here at IHD!
 

[flip]

Maybe we could get together sometime. I'm in Nashville quite a bit.

[kitkatz]

Tell your hubby I need an irrigation system ripped out and one installed next fall, too. Can you send him my way?

[Ohio Buckeye]

Thinking and praying for you and Randy Anna.