beverage rant

[George Jung]

BigSky, why are you talking about patients refusing to follow rules?

[DavitastaffRN]

George, I consider myself a good, hard working, and confident RN who has a lot of years experience in dialysis.  But just listening to your rants makes me  glad that your not in my unit.  I would do my best to take care of you, but you sound like you want it your way or no way, regardless of what is the correct thing to do.

[BigSky]

BigSky, why are you talking about patients refusing to follow rules?

I'm  just telling you what can happen if one doesnt follow unit rules.

[George Jung]

I'm just telling you what can happen if one doesnt follow unit rules.

Oh thank you, thank you!  I don't know what I would have done if you hadn't told me that.  I mean that is exactly what I was doing and you Sir, may have saved me, I am only 5 years old btw. 

[George Jung]

George, I consider myself a good, hard working, and confident RN who has a lot of years experience in dialysis.  But just listening to your rants makes me  glad that your not in my unit.  I would do my best to take care of you, but you sound like you want it your way or no way, regardless of what is the correct thing to do.

I don't know what you have read but you are right for the most part, MY way or not at all, and I am grateful beyond comprehension and articulation that you are not a part of my unit also.  I question everything I don't understand or agree with.  If you think for a second that I am going to lay down and let things happen around me without voicing my thoughts and opinions you are a joke for sure.  I'm not a half dead and helpless, I don't need you or anyone else telling me when and what I can or can't do.  That belongs where the sun doesn't shine! 

The correct thing to do?

[goofynina]

George, I consider myself a good, hard working, and confident RN who has a lot of years experience in dialysis.  But just listening to your rants makes me  glad that your not in my unit.  I would do my best to take care of you, but you sound like you want it your way or no way, regardless of what is the correct thing to do.

I don't know what you have read but you are right for the most part, MY way or not at all, and I am grateful beyond comprehension and articulation that you are not a part of my unit also.  I question everything I don't understand or agree with.  If you think for a second that I am going to lay down and let things happen around me without voicing my thoughts and opinions you are a joke for sure.  I'm not a half dead and helpless, I don't need you or anyone else telling me when and what I can or can't do.   That belongs where the sun doesn't shine! 

The correct thing to do?

Good for you George,    You Go Boy!!  I am glad you speak your mind, especially in the clinic, that is why half them damn nurses and techs are the way they are, cuz the patients let them.  They dont speak up often enough, i know there are some that cant but the ones that can should.  I give you mad props my friend, you have what we say, cajones grrrrandes...  Keep on keepin' on.... YOU ROCK 

[keefer51]

George, I'm with you man. I have always been a non-compliant patient. But after awhile i learned to go with the flow. As i mentioned our center used to have ice now it doesn't. For the people that have to eat they bring there own food in. I feel dialysis can change a person because the lack of control. I have to be in control of everything i do. The anger and frustration i feel when i am there doesn't do me any good because they have me by the short hairs. If i need water they bring me tap water. They have a water cooler down stairs for themselves. I do find it a bit impolite when i can smell the food they have for supper. They usually eat right in front of the patients washing it down with bottled water or a nice cold coke. I really enjoy the smell of the new pot of coffee they make every so many hours. I would hate to be in your situation. Once in a while on third shift i have made a comment on the aroma of their supper. Hey, they have to eat too. I just wish sometimes they could do it somewhere else.

[RichardMEL]

I am very tempted to take in one of those premix drinks like vodka and orange or perhaps ouzo and orange (for the greek guys in our unit) and drink it when I arrive (if I'm under on the fluids of course). I wonder what they'd say or do. I have a feeling my lot would just laugh and think it was pretty funny. This is the same lot who, well one of the nurses, told me once to go to the pub and have a vodka and red bull because the machine wasn't ready yet.... so I did!!! Can't be non compliant and disobey nurses orders... he didn't believe I did it till he saw my BP was like 150 on 90 hahah

good times

[thegrammalady]

a very interesting little sign showed up next to the scale the other day, telling patients to be sure to get any snacks or drinks from the machines before they start treatment because the techs are not allowed to handle any money or buy things for you. (if you visit a prisoner incarcerated in canon city, co, they aren't allowed to handle money either. the visitor must buy the snacks. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?) they will however bring you a cup of tap water (yuck) if asked.

[bdpoe]

As a dialysis patient you are the customer, the client but in clinics and in society today,
no longer is the customer always right. The Nurse is supposed to be the patient's primary advocate
but in reality they are the primary advocates of their employer, their mortgages and car payments.
I'm know there are good nurses and bad nurses just as in every line of work.

That being said, and as lame as it sounds, there is a reason why a nurse may not be able to take
your money and buy you a drink. Taking money from a patient could be misconstrued. There may be a
policy against it. But I am with you. On your side. It is a damn shame.

As for nurses and techs flaunting food and Cokes in view of patients, or annoying patients in any way,
well, I've seen way too much of that myself.

As for non compliance, yeah I feel like a prisoner myself.
Hang in there, it can always be worse.
...bd

[George Jung]

That being said, and as lame as it sounds, there is a reason why a nurse may not be able to take
your money and buy you a drink. Taking money from a patient could be misconstrued. There may be a
policy against it. But I am with you. On your side. It is a damn shame.

They took my money, put it in the machine, got the drink, and then was intercepted prior to reaching my hands and placed in the front office until I was supposed to be done and then I could have it.  All of that after I asked kindly if They would make an exception to the rule this one time.  The tech said they would get me the beverage.  If the tech screwed up they should have paid the price but they took my money (if that is an issue) and told me my drink would soon be mine and then placed it in the office for it to warm 10 degrees while I sit and think about it.  Screw that nonsense, who do they think I am?  WRONG!  TRY AGAIN. 

What did I learn?  Not to expect a thing from these people.  If you don't expect anything there can be no dissapointment, it is simply unfortunate that I have to reduce myself to such a low standard from the people whom my life is depending on 3 days a week.  Thanks for your support.

[jblamb]

In my unit we used to get coffee or ice water. One day I went in and was told no more liquids were to be given to the patients.  I had not brought anything to drink so I was pretty upset by this.  I made sure EVERYONE heard me (I didn't shout but was speaking loudly) when I said "Well, then, SOMEONE should have called me to tell me of this new policy! Give me a paper cup! " They did and I went into the ladies room, ran the water until it was decently cold, filled the cup and returned to be put on the machine.  A few patients laughed but I got my point across.  I will NOT be treated like a naughty child, nor will I be told whether I can get a drink while tied to a machine. Whether it be for 4 hours or 2 - it's the principal of the matter. It's bad enough to be tied to a machine . I was told the new policy was because a patient choked  and spilled hot coffee on herself.  Well - then why make everyone suffer?? Just don't bring her hot coffee anymore. That would have been a much better solution in my opinion.

[goofynina]

Good for you jblamb, i sure hope you got the point across not only for yourself but for others that dont have the courage to speak up as you did 

[ssticker]

Most clinics are now going to no food or drinks while on dialysis unless you have a medical reason for that.

Is this a companywide  policy?
I read somewhere that there is a Federal regulation regarding this, that staff are not supposed to give patients food or drink.
Do you know anything about this?
I can certainly understand your point of view regarding this.
You must often feel like you are "between a rock and a hard place."
If all patients are denied food and drink to protect those at risk, those who have no problem will feel that is unfair.
On the other hand, if some are allowed and some are not, those who are not will feel resentfull.
I have dialyzed at 5 different units(3 Davita, 2 not), and food and drink were allowed at all.
I was in the hospital last fall for surgery on a large aneurysm in my AV fistula, and I was served breakfast while I was dializing,but that situation was different because there were two staff members, one tech and one nurse for two patients.
At free standing units the staff/patient ratio is very different. So the capacity to provide individualized care is greatly reduced.
I occasionally take crackers and peanut butter or even chocolate to eat and I have no problem because I also take binders and know how much to take.
Once a Doctor asked me(jokingly) if other patients threw things at me when they saw me do that.
Recently I had a "Greeter", the wife of a patient, approach me and with a stern look on her face and with an even sterner voice say "You are not supposed th eat that!!!!"
I just held up my binders and smiled.
What I was really thinking was "You are not a Nurse or Dietitian or Tech. Why are you on the floor harassing a patient? It's none of your business." But I didn't say anything.
I just try to be somewhat discrete and keep my "TREATS" under my blanket.
What I would like to do is say to other patients is "You MAY be able to eat a little more liberal diet if you put a little time and effort into learning some FOOD VALUES." There are books and online resources for that information.
I am more proactive in my treatments than most and realizing that the Nephrologist that sees me wrote an order in my chart that I am allowed to adjust my own dry weight and set my own goal for fluid removal and that is printed on the run sheet for each TX. I usually drink several ounces of fluid during my TX. I just add that to my goal.
I am glad to see that you are posting on this site. It's good to get opinions from all points of view on issues.

Dennis

an interesting article:  http://www.ajkd.org/article/PIIS0272638607011365/fulltext

PS: I am new to this forum so am still learning the nuances of posts, attachments, links etc. so pleases bear w/me.

[ssticker]

PS: I am new to this forum so am still learning the nuances of posts, attachments, links etc. so pleases bear w/me.

Re:PS: HEY-LOOKS LIKE I GOT IT RIGHT. So if I may quote ROSEANN ROSEANNA DANNA-"NEVER MIND."javascript:void(0);

[brenda]

Yes George your right, it is in within your right to do whatever the hell you want to you body while at dialysis. Well here in Canada anyway. They tried that on me too when I had to run at the unit for a while a few years ago when my basement flooded. I eat and drink at home on my machine all the time so why try and tell me what's good for me. They treat everybody like sheep sometimes. The fact is we are all different and can handle different things.  Now at the unit they give water, ice and cookies. I understand diabetics need their lunch on time and were allowed to eat during dialysis while any other hungry sole sat and watched. I'd like to see one of them sit for 4 hours and not have their snack at coffee break, wouldn't happen. The advantage to being in Canada is there are no private clinics so they cant kick you out they have no choice but to treat you no matter what you do. Sometimes no private clinics is a disadvantage too. And I HATE that word noncompliant, most of the time it's just all about sticking up for yourself and your rights.

[paddbear0000]

And I HATE that word noncompliant, most of the time it's just all about sticking up for yourself and your rights.

Urrgghhh! I hate that word too! It sounds like I purposely don't do things I'm supposed to. I finally got my HUGE stack of medical records from my last doctor and that word is on practically every page. I was POOR! I couldn't afford to do the things they told me to do. Sometimes I just feel like screaming at doctors and nurses and tell them if they want me to be compliant, then they should pay for my treatments!   

[NurseNae]

I know this is an old post but I'm kinda' pissed off about this.  I wonder if the RNs wont let the techs get drinks because they aren't keeping tabs on intake.....or they don't want to calculate the intake?!  This is crazy!  I'm going to get my patients whatever they want unless the MD says I can't!  I can do the math - no problem!  I know off the top of my head that most water bottles are 500cc...and I would just add it in to be taken off!  Why can't you have a soda - its going to come off anyway....if not today, tomorrow or the next day! 

OK- now I know if you got off 25 min. early I would have to fill out an APO.  However, in my centers that is an internal document so unless you had a major problem it wouldn't even be known!

*passes you a sierra mist*

Nae

[George Jung]

I know this is an old post but I'm kinda' pissed off about this.  I wonder if the RNs wont let the techs get drinks because they aren't keeping tabs on intake.....or they don't want to calculate the intake?!  This is crazy!  I'm going to get my patients whatever they want unless the MD says I can't!  I can do the math - no problem!  I know off the top of my head that most water bottles are 500cc...and I would just add it in to be taken off!  Why can't you have a soda - its going to come off anyway....if not today, tomorrow or the next day! 

OK- now I know if you got off 25 min. early I would have to fill out an APO.  However, in my centers that is an internal document so unless you had a major problem it wouldn't even be known!

*passes you a sierra mist*

Nae

Nae,

The issue here was not about intake, nor was it even about me as a patient, it was an employee productivity concern.  Apparently if a tech is allowed to get one patient a drink then all of the patients will want a drink and then the techs become "servers" (if you will) and therefore they are not working as techs (something like that I guess).  To this day I still see the techs sitting on their buts watching t.v., talking on their phones, and other non-medical  activities (socializing).  I believe they are there to serve the patients (maybe not tray service like you get at your favorite restaurant) within reason.  It is like the "time to lean, time to clean" (must be work related) thought process and getting me something to drink was more distracting than anything else when in reality taking care of me is what it is all about.

[NurseNae]

I see.  For me....you cramping/crashing/or complaining is not a plus....being able to joke with you, talk about your life, and make you happy is. So, for me....I will gladly get you a soda....because it will make your experience better and mine too!

Nae

[kitkatz]

God help the center when they tell me I cannot have my ice cup with me.

[qwerty]

I agree with a small snack during treatment but have seen clients order out pizza and sit there totally devouring the entire large pizza all on thier own during treatment. We arent permitted to take them water for exactly what a previous poster mentioned - if I or a PCT gets a glass of ice or water for them then everyone else expects it then we become personal servants to many of the clients who simply hate to see another one getting any more attention then they are. I am currently the only RN when I work and have 2-3 pcts during that time with 14 chairs. I open the clinic at 5am and finally get a 15 min break about 8:30 am then not another break until well after 2pm for 30 min only. I also start sending staff home as the client load diminishes daily as we run 3 shifts. I dont get out of there any earlier than 7-8pm.  How anyone as staff finds time or is even permitted to watch tv or sit on thier duffs would be unknown to me. We dont get to yap on our cellphones or even sit to do our documentation in Duck or Snappy. I have been asked to do this and my LMS at home on my own time now!!!!! Yep waste more money for that "academy" which is nothing more than a 2 day drunk fest but cut staffing to the bone. They even count the syringes to ensure we arent wasting any lol. Keep in mind many of my clients in chronic are from nursing homes on stretchers requiring alot of personal care during thier treatment. Of course the SWC Davita uses doesnt even consider acuity level when dictating how much staff is permitted.  In fact we were just told this week even more cutbacks are required handed down from corporate. My FA's hands are tied.  I have only been with this company for 8 months and I have over 25 years critical care experience. Worse of all is when I have a client that I know needs to go to the hospital (see I actually do my assessments rather than documenting them before or if they are even done). I am preparing to find work elsewhere before I end up putting my hard earned nursing license on the line.  The general mentality is like a conveyer belt - get them in, on, off and out! I dont like this approach and feel it is dangerous as many times I have found meds in the syringes laying behind machines yet signed off as given, or the wrong bath for the last 2 hours. I could go on and on about Davita!

[TynyOne]

I do find it a bit impolite when i can smell the food they have for supper. They usually eat right in front of the patients washing it down with bottled water or a nice cold coke. I really enjoy the smell of the new pot of coffee they make every so many hours. I would hate to be in your situation. Once in a while on third shift i have made a comment on the aroma of their supper. Hey, they have to eat too. I just wish sometimes they could do it somewhere else.


I think that it is PLAIN OUT RUDE to eat front of patients they DO NOT do that at our clinic.  They have a breakroom they go too and eat in there and it is VERY SELDOM I have seen them even drink in front of us; however, I am one of the few who do take a drink with me and for the times I have forgotten too, I asked this one nice nurse to go to the lobby and get me a cup of cold water instead of water out of the tap and she did but of course, at the time, I was about to faint and was looking real, real, pale and they knew I felt HORRIBLE.   Also, for those who have talked about how they have taken the ice machines out and the fridges out where they use to keep the cold water and ours was even keeping kool-aid AND Gatorade too for people that felt like they were going to faint; they too, have had to get rid of the fridges in the treatment room AS WELL as keeping the kool-aid in their own fridge in their breakroom.  They said something about the health department told them they had to remove keeping water and kool-aid and the Gatorade out of BOTH fridges.  However, I normally take a drink with me or before I start my treatment, I will get a can of coke out of the coke machine there, before I start my treatment.   AT LEAST we still have that, ya know?   Oh well, that's just my 2 cents and I know this is sort of an old topic now, but it has been a while since I have been on this site as I am sure you can tell.  Thanks for letting me share.

Tammy

[highlite36]

I noticed that the snack machines were removed from the view of the patients...in fact, they're tucked into the back of the building where patients aren't allowed to enter.....  When I first started dialyzing about six years ago, they allowed people to order food as they wished.  I remember people use to order out CHINESE FOOD and eat it by the bucket....and then PIZZA and one time they decided to do BURGER KING!!!  I really couldn't believe it because I usually felt kinda whoozy when I dialyzed, so the concept of shoveling that much cooked carcass into my mouth and then swallowing it was nauseating.....  However, the new rules are that patients are allowed to have ice, water, or coffee throughout the treatment, but food to be consumed were limited.  I know that even now when I go back and do the volunteer work, I always tend to sneak sodas and snacks to the patients if they ask me to do it.  It's hard enough to sit still for MULTIPLE hours...and I'm a big girl, I like to eat so it only makes sense if they get to eat too!!!!  And what's the worse thing they can do if I get caught??  FIRE ME?  SHIT!  I ain't worried...........   

[George Jung]

And what's the worse thing they can do if I get caught??  FIRE ME?  SHIT!  I ain't worried...........   

    you rock