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Author Topic: New vegan cheese with low phosph  (Read 4270 times)
kickingandscreaming
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« on: June 10, 2016, 04:41:23 PM »

I bought some vegan "cheese" at Whole Foods yesterday.  I made a grilled "cheese" sandwich with it.  It melted beautifully.  Just like the real thing.  It clearly can't be a protein replacement as it has no protein in it. But it is a good occasional stand in for a cheese craving.

It's called "Follow Your Heart" provolone slices.  It also comes in Cheddar, Mozarella, Nacho and Herb/Garlic, but I don't know the numbers for all of them (although I bet they are the same).  I emailed the company and asked about phosphorus and potassium content and they told me that for each 100g of "Cheese" it contains 100mg phosphorus and 400mg potassium.  Each slice weighs 20grams, so there are 20mg phosphorus/slice and 80mg potassium. There is 180mg sodium/slice.

Non-GMO. Vegan. Lactose-free. Casein free. Soy free. 
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hatedialysis2
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« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2016, 06:43:29 AM »

i've used their cream cheese and sour cream for years.  They are delicious!   Some of their products do contain carrageenan which has been a controversial subject.   Carrageenan is used in many foods such as yogurts, puddings, milks, ice cream and other ready made products.       I use it occasionally to make plant based mozzarella cheese.  I use soy milk and it tastes super close to real mozzeralla and melts beautifully.   
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kickingandscreaming
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« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2016, 09:43:27 AM »

I won't touch soy anymore--unless it's fermented--and then hardly then. 

The slices (and blocks) that I mention are a new product for them.  I have had their old version of mozarella and although it was a tasty substance in itself, it didn't fool me for one second that it was "cheese."  These slices are a very good stand in for those who miss cheese and don't want the phosphorus payload.  I had 2 slices on my breakfast omelette this morning and it was delicious and melted perfectly.  They're not a nutrition powerhouse, but they do satisfy a cheese yearning.

The only unfortunate piece is that the good quasi (non-soy) cheese isn't organic and the organic versions are based on soy.

http://followyourheart.com/vegan-cheese/

All the slices list the same ingredients and carageenan isn't among them:
Filtered Water, Coconut Oil, Modified Food Starch, Potato Starch, Sea Salt, Natural Flavor (Plant Sources), Olive Extract, Beta Carotene for Color.
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hatedialysis2
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« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2016, 10:29:01 AM »

I use non-gmo organic soybeans and make my own soy milk.   The key is to pre-soak the beans overnight to remove any enzyme prohibitors.
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PrimeTimer
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« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2016, 03:59:10 PM »

Other than going the distance to find it, this cheese may be worth trying. What's bad about Soy tho?
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kickingandscreaming
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« Reply #5 on: June 11, 2016, 04:50:15 PM »

Take your pick. http://www.westonaprice.org/soy-alert/
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PrimeTimer
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« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2016, 06:33:56 PM »

Take your pick. http://www.westonaprice.org/soy-alert/

Wow. Some hate it because of it's taste but according to your link, there's other reasons to not like it. Once in a great while I've treated myself to a glass of chocolate flavored soy milk. Not anymore. 
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Husband has ESRD with Type I Diabetes -Insulin Dependent.
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hatedialysis2
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« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2016, 07:09:11 AM »

With all due respect to Sally Fallon and Weston Price, I truly believe they are not giving you the whole picture on your link.   First of all non-GMOs organic soy is rich in protein, omega 3 6 9, b vitamins, iron , zinc.........1 cup of properly prepared soy has up to 12g of protein ( complete protein), low in saturated fat, 150 mg phosphorus, 460 mg potassium, 410 mg calcium.  The world health organization recognizes it as a Heath food.  The key to removing the physic acid is in the preparation which is soaking overnight.  That goes for all beans and foods that have physic acid.     The problem with soy products on the market is that some contain isolated soy,, they are not prepared properly, and the use of chemicals such as hexane for extraction.   Those are the culprits that creat havoc when ingested.  Asian countries like Japan, Korea, and China have been consuming soy (fermented and non fermented)for centuries.   

Eden foods is one of the companies that prepares soy properly. 
http://www.edenfoods.com/articles/view.php?articles_id=80
   
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kickingandscreaming
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« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2016, 08:57:48 AM »

I'm not interested in getting into an argument about soy.  All I said is that I don't touch the stuff and then was asked to say more.

But it is misleading to say that Asians eat a lot of soy. They eat more than we do, but not a lot. And most of it is fermented: miso, natto and tempeh.

Quote
The Japanese, on the other hand, consume an average 8.7 g of soy protein per day; Koreans, 6.29.6 g; Indonesians, 7.4 g; and the Chinese, 3.4 g.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1480510/

The jury is still out about whether soy is a good or bad food. Until the jury comes back, I choose not to eat it.  https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/2014/02/12/straight-talk-about-soy/

I am no longer a vegetarian (was for 35 years and I credit it with leading to my diabetes by eating so many grains and legumes to avoid animal protein).  So I now see no reason in particular to eat a food that I have doubts about.  I am in no way advising anyone else to eat it or not.
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Charlie B53
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« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2016, 09:38:34 AM »


K&S,  As tempting as it is to attempt to lay blame on contracting diabetes, I do not believe your responsible lifelong diet had any contribution to it.   I lay the blame purely on DNA.   Outside of exercise I doubt if anything could have changed karma.

Beans are a whole different story and I have to ask about this soaking thing as I was always understood that while it is far better to soak any given bean overnight prior to cooking that this was only to shorten cooking time, that beans could be immediately put in the pan of water and heated but doing so would take far far longer before being done.

So I am interested in this soaking as I imagine it 'leaches' out some measurable % of elements.   Is this good, bad, or indifferent?
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hatedialysis2
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« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2016, 10:19:18 AM »

I'm not interested in getting into an argument about soy.  All I said is that I don't touch the stuff and then was asked to say more.

But it is misleading to say that Asians eat a lot of soy. They eat more than we do, but not a lot. And most of it is fermented: miso, natto and tempeh.

Quote
The Japanese, on the other hand, consume an average 8.7 g of soy protein per day; Koreans, 6.29.6 g; Indonesians, 7.4 g; and the Chinese, 3.4 g.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1480510/

The jury is still out about whether soy is a good or bad food. Until the jury comes back, I choose not to eat it.  https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/2014/02/12/straight-talk-about-soy/

I am no longer a vegetarian (was for 35 years and I credit it with leading to my diabetes by eating so many grains and legumes to avoid animal protein).  So I now see no reason in particular to eat a food that I have doubts about.  I am in no way advising anyone else to eat it or not.

Who's arguing?  This forum is for having intelligent discussions (I hope).  Offering a different point of view should not be viewed as arguing. 

 I am not trying to convince anyone  on whether or not to consume soy either.  I am merely responding to what I felt (in my opinion) the misleading information on the link from WestonPrice.  I have provided a link from Eden Soy that discusses all the concerns in detail backed up by facts and research.  For the record, I am a huge fan of  Weston Price.  I just don't subscribe to their focus on eating meats and saturated fats as the only road to health and putting down vegetarianism or veganism.      I have seen Sally Fallon in interviews and she does not reflect the image of health at all.  Again, much gratitude to her work and her book "Nourishing Traditions"  a must read in my opinon.     

As far as high intake of grains causing diabetes, I guess it depends on the grains, how much and how they were prepared.   

I have tried just about every diet out there and for me a plant based diet diet works best for me. It gives me more energy and does not bog me down like animal proteins.  I try to limit the grains and only consume complex whole grains if I do. Ok, I cheat if I see a warm crispy baguette.      I will eat animal protein in minute quantities if I am out and have no choice.  Again, not trying to sell anything here and everyone has different constitutions and needs.  Some people claim wonders with paeleo diets, the GAPS diet.  Heck there is a  natropath that has a huge following that claims we should only consume fruits and nothing else. I have listened to him extensivly and he sounds so convincing.    Now the fad is gluten is bad, before that it was fats,....and on and on.        I just eat the foods that make me feel good.   
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Zach
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« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2016, 10:50:57 AM »


K&S,  As tempting as it is to attempt to lay blame on contracting diabetes, I do not believe your responsible lifelong diet had any contribution to it.   I lay the blame purely on DNA.   Outside of exercise I doubt if anything could have changed karma.

Beans are a whole different story and I have to ask about this soaking thing as I was always understood that while it is far better to soak any given bean overnight prior to cooking that this was only to shorten cooking time, that beans could be immediately put in the pan of water and heated but doing so would take far far longer before being done.

So I am interested in this soaking as I imagine it 'leaches' out some measurable % of elements.   Is this good, bad, or indifferent?

Hi Charlie B53,
Here is some information you might find interesting:

Bad Bug Book
Foodborne Pathogenic Microorganisms and Natural Toxins Handbook

http://www.fda.gov/Food/FoodborneIllnessContaminants/CausesOfIllnessBadBugBook/ucm071092.htm
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Uninterrupted in-center (self-care) hemodialysis since 1982 -- 34 YEARS on March 3, 2016 !!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
No transplant.  Not yet, anyway.  Only decided to be listed on 11/9/06. Inactive at the moment.  ;)
I make films.

Just the facts: 70.0 kgs. (about 154 lbs.)
Treatment: Tue-Thur-Sat   5.5 hours, 2x/wk, 6 hours, 1x/wk
Dialysate flow (Qd)=600;  Blood pump speed(Qb)=315
Fresenius Optiflux-180 filter--without reuse
Fresenius 2008T dialysis machine
My KDOQI Nutrition (+/ -):  2,450 Calories, 84 grams Protein/day.

"Living a life, not an apology."
Charlie B53
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« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2016, 12:21:13 PM »


It wasn't very long ago I learned raw or under cooked kidney beans cold be sickening but I didn't know the details.

So this bad element may be present to some degree in most ALL beans and proper cooking is highly recommended for all.

I regularly eat many different types of beans as I am of  the  opinion that our diet should include as wide a variety of plants as possible.   That old 'All things in moderation' thing.
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