Mean people on the internet

[MooseMom]

(This post will mention kidney transplant, so if a mod wants to move it, feel free.)

I don't blog, and I don't post comments as a general rule online.  I post here at IHD because I am comfortable here (we're family), and I often post on several renal blogs, usually in an outraged tone about crap dialysis vs extra cheese dialysis or some such thing.  

YLGuy and Okarol posted about how Tom Brady's personal QB coach of many years, Mr. Martinez, needed a transplant, and Brady did some press to encourage organ donation.  It seems that Mr. Martinez had been looking for a donor "for some time" (whatever that means).

Unfortunately, Mr. Martinez had a heart attack during a treatment, and he died.  This story's ending was posted here and all over the web, including on one particular political/social site that I visit regularly.

This story upset me because while there were so many people who praised this man, none had stepped up for him to see about donating.  He had worked with student athletes for decades, and all of the stories about him centered around the fact that he had touched so many lives.  All talk, no action.

I posted my general disappointment, and one poster replied that perhaps compatibility was an issue.  I in turn replied that certainly, compatibility is ALWAYS an "issue".  Another poster replied that incompatibility isn't too much of an issue anymore with ABO incompatible transplants, and there's also paired exchange.  I replied that yes, I agreed.

Then, some moron replied to me TWICE, saying that I had made an "asinine comment" and that there had to be a perfect match and that I had "no understanding of this" and that kidneys "don't grow on trees" and that I "obviously don't know anything about organ donation" and that "the donor has to be at death's door" and that the transplant "has to be a perfect match and done at that exact moment" and that even if there is an organ available, the recipient is "usually too sick to make it through surgery."  He then told me that I should save my "false outrage as it just isn't sincere."

WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I had me some fun.

I threw in just about all of the medical/renal jargon I could muster and then demanded a public apology.  hahaha!

But what I wanted to ask ...is it just me, or are people really, really mean and nasty online?  Have any of you ever entered into an online spat with some anonymous bozo who, out of the blue, decided to unload on you for no discernable reason?  This guy just looked really ignorant.  Still, it made me realize that there's a lot of educating we all can be doing!  But it also will make me think twice about ever expressing an opinion online again!

(I got to use "plasmapheresis"!)

[YLGuy]

A 14 letter word! Wow. I think twice about posting many times.  Sometimes I really wonder if some people are just really uninformed.  Sometimes I know that they are just trying to upset others. Some comments I have read are so ridiculous it makes me feel bad that those trains of thought are out there. 
As for the public apology... 
I have proved people wrong without any doubt and yet I still wait here for an apology. 
To answer your question: People can be meaner online as they feel safe behind their computer spouting a bunch of crap they may or may not believe.  The fact is that there are many mean people out there that care only for themselves.  Some of them are even going through kidney failure.  It is a sad fact. 

[MooseMom]

I mean, why risk making yourself look like a fool by saying "you don't know anything about organ transplants" to someone who just may INDEED know something about organ transplants!

[okarol]

  I love you throwin around plasmapheresis!

People can be much bolder and obnoxious when they are online, it's virtually anonymous.

You go girl! 

[Jean]

Agreed, people can be so obnoxious online. I know they are supposed to be sooo successful in these dating sites, but I dont think I could ever trust any one I met that way. The internet is lots of fun and lots of knowledge and has made our lives easier in some ways, but the people in chat rooms and such are usually ( not on this site ) a little off balance.

[natnnnat]

"plasmapheresis".
Wow MM, you don't pull any punches.  Whatever "plasmapheresis" is, I'm half inclined to apologise to you for something (anything) just, off the cuff, just in case, right now.
 

[willowtreewren]

MM, in my experience, even if the poster is not anonymous, a great deal more meanness can be evident in on-line posts. I know a man who is quite personable in the flesh, but most of my circle of friends filter his on-line posts as a matter of course. He is just so sarcastic and unkind in his on-line persona that they don't want to even KNOW that he posted.

It is a sorry indictment of our society that we lose our normal inhibitions when not facing those to whom we are "speaking."

Aleta

[cassandra]

Yes MM I must aggree with all the previous posters. Sometimes it makes people more personal, sometimes it can work as a screen to hide behind, and than scream and shout whatever you want. I had to look up your plasmapheris thing. brilliant. Keep strong, the world keeps going on. Love Cas

[cariad]

But what I wanted to ask ...is it just me, or are people really, really mean and nasty online? 

Need you even ask? Some people most definitely are. The anthropology and evolution of compassion have always fascinated me. There is something so powerful about being in the presence of someone else, actually seeing them. It can physically change you, and in many instances it serves to tamp down aggression. (It can have the opposite effect, especially with males, and across many different species.)

I have noticed that I do not feel as annoyed or angry or whatever with a person when they post their photo as an avatar. It so humanizes a person and I have found with me that it gives me a moment's pause and I tend to think more carefully about whether I would actually say this to them in person. This is an evolutionary reaction. Pretty cool.

Have any of you ever entered into an online spat with some anonymous bozo who, out of the blue, decided to unload on you for no discernable reason? 

Why, yes. Right here on this forum. Quite recently in fact (you remember the load of fun we had New Years Eve?) It doesn't happen often, but it has happened to me several times here and I do not post comments anywhere else and do not participate in any other forum. With most news stories, I find it's best to just skip the comments. I cannot think of any time anyone has ever said 'I felt one way about this, then I read an anonymous comment, and now my opinion has made an about-face.' Forums with regular members and a moderator to keep people in line are usually better, but I still have never been goaded into participating. Waste of time in my estimation.

(I got to use "plasmapheresis"!)

Bloody show-off.
(Well done! )

[Deanne]

I think some people use the internet just to be nasty. They can't be nasty in person, so the let loose online. I used to respond to them, but eventually, I just moved on. Responding to them really is just feeding a troll. If the opinions they're expressing are their honest opinions/things they really believe, then I think this holds true: "Those who are convinced against their will are of the same opinion still." So I'm not going to waste my time/energy on telling them they're wrong. Why should they believe a total stranger anyway?

If they're only trying to rile people up, then I'm not going to give them the satisfaction of doing so to me. I visit a couple of message boards regularly, but rarely post. I don't do facebook or other social media sites. On the boards I visit, I see the same people over and over trying to cause drama. I wonder sometimes if they're the same way in person. It would be fun to find out.

[Willis]

I've been using online forums since the mid-90s and BBS systems before that. (If you know what a BBS is then you are both old and a geek.) I also administer my own online forum so I've seen everything.

Besides intentional "trolls" who set out to be disruptive, I think the topics themselves drive the level of "meanness" when people post. Some topics seem to be innocuous and rarely generate animosity. For those so inclined, "prayer request" topics usually seem to be respected as a no-controversy zone even by the trolls. And forums dedicated to specific topics like IHD or a forum about RVs or motorcycles for example seem to create fewer antagonistic posts. But some topics, especially involving politics and religion, are just inviting controversy that can turn into wild ranting and ad hominem attacks.

From my experience some people seem to feel the anonymity of the web gives them free-rein and releases them from all of the normal social interaction "filters" developed by civilized people of all cultures. In the real world, if these same people said the same things they do online they would be shunned or worse...punched in the nose! On the internet there's no real feedback mechanism that can control inappropriate behavior other than being banned from a site. Then theses clods just move on to another site until they get banned again.

Unfortunately, I've had to ban people who then come back with new identities who I have to ban again and again resorting to internet techie tricks to do so. But even then I had one troll who wouldn't give up and started using what are called "anonymizer" sites from foreign countries that always generate a different source IP (that's the numeric address of the domain). He then proceeded to create dozens of accounts and carried on conversations with himself. My only resource was to stop direct public registration so I could approve registrations before the user could post.

Now it seems most forums have to do that if only due to the automated "bots" that register and post spam. The Q&A or CAPTCHA methods help some but now the spammers can usually get through those so a real person needs to review and approve every registration. That's a real pain in the behind.

To all trolls and spammers: 

 

[Chris]

Well with me, what you see is what you get. Just slower at coming up with a good smart   comment is the only difference.


No matter where you go either online or real life, your just gonna find someone that irritates the heck outta you.

[MooseMom]

I love you throwin around plasmapheresis!

I tossed in "egfr" for good measure.

You know how when you learn a new word, you start seeing it everywhere?  Well, ever since I found out how bad my kidneys are, there is mention of kidneys or dialysis or transplants all over the place.  Even my husband notices it, and it drives him nuts.  Well, there always seems to be some story about kidneys in the popular press, and I'd like to tell y'all these two stories about what can happen if you're just nice to people on the internet....

I don't remember all of the specifics, but sometime last year, there was a link posted on RenalWeb to some blog site where a panel of chosen philosophers or smart people (lol!) would discuss various topic.  One topic was altruistic kidney donation, and the panel weighed in with their thoughts and opinions and considerations.  After reading their comments, I was taken aback by how truly ignorant in the subject these obviously intelligent, well educated and thoughtful people were, so I decided to drag out my cyberlecturn and teach them a few fundamentals about renal disease, dialysis and transplantation.  I am no expert, but these were just the fundamentals that I discussed with them.  It was a very nice and interesting discussion, and the end result was that one panelist said that he would indicate on his license that he wanted to be an organ donor.

Back to the political/social site that I frequent, there was some other thread about transplant, and it being a more popular site, there were all sorts of trolls lolling about.  There was one guy, though, whose wife was about to have a transplant, and he was freaking out and was upset by the cavalier attitude of some of these said trolls.  I don't remember what I said to him, but he gave me his email address and was shocked when I emailed him and asked more about his wife.  He's been corresponding with me ever since, giving me the occasional update.  I thought that was nice.

So here we have the internet, this wonderful tool where we can learn about other people and communicate with folks all around the world, yet there are some like the guy that Willis referred to who have nothing better to do than go online and chase people with their relentless nasty comments.

I can certainly see where the anonymity of the web can encourage people to behave in ways that they'd never dare behave in real life, but then again, I have to wonder if this online behavior at some point begins to bleed into "the real world."

I know nothing about computers, so when I got my laptop, a guy from the Geek Squad came out and did whatever it was that needed to be done to get it going and get it "talking" with my new printer.  He was a young kid and yes, he was a true Geek right out of Central Casting, and he proceeded to talk to me about security.  I made some remark about not understanding why people would intentionally try to hack into computers or infect them with viruses, and he started mumbling something about the "freedom" of the Internet.  Uh huh.  I bet he's a secret troll, and I bet he doesn't know anything about organ transplants!!!!!!!   

I guess I'm too old and sensitive for the Modern World.

[Poppylicious]

I can certainly see where the anonymity of the web can encourage people to behave in ways that they'd never dare behave in real life, but then again, I have to wonder if this online behavior at some point begins to bleed into "the real world."

Anybody who is mean in the Virtual World MUST be mean (to some extent) in the Real World.  Or they would have to have some serious mental health problems involving split personalities.  I think that in most cases, what you see online is what you'd expect to see in reality, to a lesser/greater degree.  It's the people who blow their own trumpets by telling you how lovely and nice and quiet they are who you need to watch out for ...

(I am lovely and nice and quiet ...)

 

I (try to) stay away from mean people and heated discussions arguments online.  I just can't deal with them here anymore than I can offline.  Dsicussions of any sort are difficult online: you really need to be able to gauge body language, facial expressions and tone of voice and without these people can misconstrue everybody else's intentions (whether good or bad, intentional or not).

[MooseMom]

I know what you mean, Poppy, and that's why this altercation was so bizarre.  I was having a reasonable, interesting conversation with a couple of people about transplantation, and then all of a sudden, this person comes on and starts telling me that I had no understanding of the subject.  It just didn't make any sense!  It wasn't a heated discussion in the first place, and then this bozo starts yelling at me!  LOL!

BTW, he hasn't apologized yet.  How disappointing...LOL!

[fearless]

MM, you are one smart cookie.  Go girl.

[Bajanne]

I am so proud of you, girl!!!!!