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Author Topic: Vitamin Supplements: The Dialysis Paradox  (Read 3057 times)
Hemodoc
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« on: March 29, 2011, 09:09:46 PM »

By Peter Laird, MD

Vitamin supplements are a favorite of health advocates who help generate the demand in this billion dollar industry, yet recent studies point to the paradox of adverse outcomes from these same supplements in high dosages.   The difficulty of defining the proper role that vitamin supplements play is especially unsettled in dialysis patients who suffer the opposite extreme of documented vitamin deficits as a result of washing out water soluble vitamins during dialysis. Unfortunately, in some instances, the data on supplementing these deficiencies comes at a risk as well.

Vitamin C levels are especially low in dialysis patients according to a recent study looking at dialysis patients undergoing usual in-center schedules compared to extended hours dialysis protocols. Despite the low vitamin C level which borders on the development of scurvy, supplementation of vitamin C also increases oxalate levels even at low dosages of vitamin C which can build up in dialysis patients causing severe effects:

Water-soluble vitamin levels in extended hours hemodialysis

The major finding of this study was the high prevalence of vitamin C deficiency in extended hours hemodialysis patients compared with conventional dialysis patients. This is not unexpected as ascorbic acid is the smallest molecule (MW 176 g/mol) of the vitamins we assayed, and is readily removed by dialysis.24 As the prevalence of more frequent and longer hours (quotidian) dialysis is increasing, the importance of the assessment and supplementation of vitamin C in this patient group is demonstrated.

Traditionally, vitamin C has been used sparingly in patients with end-stage renal failure, as its metabolism generates oxalate. Increased levels of oxalate can cause deposition of calcium oxalate crystals in tissues (oxalosis), with cardiac, renal, and bone manifestations reported historically.27 The appropriate dose of vitamin C for patients with renal failure, as well as the impact of vitamin C dose on oxalate levels has been the subject of much debate. The European Best Practice Guidelines recommends 75 to 90 mg/day;18 however, this dose may not be sufficient to correct vitamin C deficiency in either extended or CHD patients. For example, a study of 18 conventional patients on 100 mg vitamin C daily found 5 patients had ascorbate levels in the range of deficiency (<0.30 mg/dL).15 The dose was increased to 500 mg/day for 2 weeks, which corrected the deficiency, and increased the mean plasma ascorbate from 0.69 to 1.82 mg/dL (39–103.5 μmol/L). However, because of a median increase in oxalate levels of 17%, the authors advised against high-dose vitamin C.

The balance between vitamin C levels too high or too low in extended hours dialysis remains a subject of debate with few studies available to guide the individual patient on what is the optimal strategy, truly leading to a vitamin supplement paradox between deficiency or harm from producing excessive oxalate levels with enough supplement to correct the deficiency. This is one area of study that demands a quick resolution since both extremes can cause harm to the patient.  As of yet, there is no consensus on how to proceed.

Vitamin D likewise defies definition of optimal dosage at both ends of the spectrum as well. Low levels of vitamin D can precipitate rickets and is suspected to increase the risk of cancer as well as increasing the risk of death from cardiovascular disease, it brings on cognitive impairment, and may be an important factor in the prevention of diabetes and other health related conditions. Paradoxically, several studies in the female population at risk of osteoporosis showed a tendency to induce vascular calcification with vitamin D supplementation which is likewise demonstrated in dialysis patients as well.

Dialysis patients are especially at risk of vascular calcifications and mineral bone disorders due to the loss of enzymes that activate vitamin D synthesized in the skin by exposure to sunlight.   A recent study suggested that vitamin D supplementation increases vascular calcifications in dialysis patients when phosphorus levels run high:

The dualistic role of vitamin D in vascular calcifications

The current treatment approach of providing vitamin D analogs to patients with CKD often poses a dilemma, as studies linked vitamin D treatment to subsequent vascular calcification. Recent genetic studies, however, have shown that vascular calcification can be prevented by reducing serum phosphate levels, even in the presence of extremely high serum 1,25-dihydroxyvitamin D and calcium levels. This article will briefly summarize the dual effects of vitamin D in vascular calcification and will provide evidence of vitamin D-dependent and -independent vascular calcification.

Certainly dietary guidelines for dialysis patients include eating several servings of fruits and vegetables every day which contain many of these vitamins as well as taking a daily vitamin specifically designed for dialysis patients.  Data on the efficacy of this recommendation remains scant. Vitamin D is an important element in improving anemia as is Vitamin C, but at what cost. The balance between deficiency and too many vitamin supplements remains for future studies. In the mean time, for those taking vitamin D or its analogs, one key noted in the study above is keeping phosphorus levels in check.  Likewise, there is hope that extended dialysis schedules may be able to remove the excess oxalate from increased vitamin C supplements but this remains unproven to date.

Until we have the studies available, discuss the risks and benefits with your medical team of vitamin supplementation which in the case of dialysis patients is mandatory to avoid the known consequences of severe deficiencies, control your phosphorus, eat a diet complemented with fruits and vegetables, exercise regularly which is perhaps the best "vitamin" we have, and do all things in moderation including vitamin supplements. Sometimes too much of a good thing is actually harmful.

http://www.hemodoc.com/2011/03/vitamin-supplements-the-dialysis-paradox.html
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Peter Laird, MD
www.hemodoc.info
Diagnosed with IgA nephropathy 1998
Incenter Dialysis starting 2-1-2007
Self Care in Center from 4-15-2008 to 6-2-2009
Started  Home Care with NxStage 6-2-2009 (Qb 370, FF 45%, 40L)

All clinical and treatment related issues discussed on this forum are for informational purposes only.  You must always secure your own medical teams approval for all treatment options before applying any discussions on this site to your own circumstances.
MooseMom
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« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2011, 09:37:00 PM »

Ahhhhh...life is just grand.  Now we have to worry about scurvy and ricketts?  Really?
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"Eggs are so inadequate, don't you think?  I mean, they ought to be able to become anything, but instead you always get a chicken.  Or a duck.  Or whatever they're programmed to be.  You never get anything interesting, like regret, or the middle of last week."
greg10
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« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2011, 09:37:52 PM »

Thank you doc.  Oxalate metabolism was something we haven't paid much attention to.

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Newbie caretaker, so I may not know what I am talking about :)
Caretaker for my elderly father who has his first and current graft in March, 2010.
Previously in-center hemodialysis in national chain, now doing NxStage home dialysis training.
End of September 2010: after twelve days of training, we were asked to start dialyzing on our own at home, reluctantly, we agreed.
If you are on HD, did you know that Rapid fluid removal (UF = ultrafiltration) during dialysis is associated with cardiovascular morbidity?  http://ihatedialysis.com/forum/index.php?topic=20596
We follow a modified version: UF limit = (weight in kg)  *  10 ml/kg/hr * (130 - age)/100

How do you know you are getting sufficient hemodialysis?  Know your HDP!  Scribner, B. H. and D. G. Oreopoulos (2002). "The Hemodialysis Product (HDP): A Better Index of Dialysis Adequacy than Kt/V." Dialysis & Transplantation 31(1).   http://www.therenalnetwork.org/qi/resources/HDP.pdf
boswife
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us and fam easter 2013

« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2011, 06:23:22 AM »

So, do you have any personal recomindations on this from experience??  I battle with the thought of this often as hubby is takimg a large vit D monthly and it just seems very weard to bombard him like that, and,,, i didnt really know what to look for in his blood results to see what it's doing 'besides' giving him adiquite vit D.  I wish i was a brilliant 'sevant' in all this and that this particular 'stuff' was my fortee...  (i also wish i was a better speller at this time so you could  know what i was trying to say   ::)  )
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im a california wife and cargiver to my hubby
He started dialysis April 09
We thank God for every day we are blessed to have together.
november 2010, patiently (ha!) waiting our turn for NxStage training
January 14,2011 home with NxStage
Zach
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"Still crazy after all these years."

« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2011, 08:29:46 AM »

It's all about the "known and unknown" as Donald Rumsfeld would say.

8)
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Uninterrupted in-center (self-care) hemodialysis since 1982 -- 34 YEARS on March 3, 2016 !!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
No transplant.  Not yet, anyway.  Only decided to be listed on 11/9/06. Inactive at the moment.  ;)
I make films.

Just the facts: 70.0 kgs. (about 154 lbs.)
Treatment: Tue-Thur-Sat   5.5 hours, 2x/wk, 6 hours, 1x/wk
Dialysate flow (Qd)=600;  Blood pump speed(Qb)=315
Fresenius Optiflux-180 filter--without reuse
Fresenius 2008T dialysis machine
My KDOQI Nutrition (+/ -):  2,450 Calories, 84 grams Protein/day.

"Living a life, not an apology."
Hemodoc
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« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2011, 11:20:47 AM »

So, do you have any personal recomindations on this from experience??  I battle with the thought of this often as hubby is takimg a large vit D monthly and it just seems very weard to bombard him like that, and,,, i didnt really know what to look for in his blood results to see what it's doing 'besides' giving him adiquite vit D.  I wish i was a brilliant 'sevant' in all this and that this particular 'stuff' was my fortee...  (i also wish i was a better speller at this time so you could  know what i was trying to say   ::)  )

For those taking vitamin D, the issue noted in the article above revolves around phosphorus levels where low or normal levels do not appear to increase vascular calcifications but those with elevated phosphorus may be at risk. This is actually not new information on phosphorus levels, just taking a look from a different angle confirming what we knew from other studies. Unfortunately as in many dialysis related issues, there are no compelling studies to guide us with clarity. I am sure it will make for an interesting discussion with your dietician and medical team.
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Peter Laird, MD
www.hemodoc.info
Diagnosed with IgA nephropathy 1998
Incenter Dialysis starting 2-1-2007
Self Care in Center from 4-15-2008 to 6-2-2009
Started  Home Care with NxStage 6-2-2009 (Qb 370, FF 45%, 40L)

All clinical and treatment related issues discussed on this forum are for informational purposes only.  You must always secure your own medical teams approval for all treatment options before applying any discussions on this site to your own circumstances.
tyefly
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This will be me...... Next spring.... I earned it.

« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2011, 01:00:10 PM »

THC  Peter.... the information is greatly appreciated....  I think that we all need to pay close attention to our diets and try to eat foods where we can get good nutrients....  taking supplements to increase what we cant get in our foods should be done but with moderation...  Taking too many supplements may be risky with our disease.. but in moderation should be safe....  Some diets will call for extreme supplementation..... like Vit C where you take 2000 mg a day....   More in not always better and I think we should pay closer attention to any supplements that we take.... and pay more attention to the foods that could supply those vitamins...
  Its like ON Dr. Oz....  daily show on TV....they are always telling us that we should take this and that.... the health food stores have so many different things that may help this and that...  but I think  if we were just normal people ( people with out CKD ) then we wouldn't have to worry about this as much...but since we do have CKD we need to worry about build up and or the product being dialysized out.... 
   I guess my thought is .... EVERYTHING   IN    MODERATION....... 
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IgA Nephropathy   April 2009
CKD    May 2009
AV Fistula  June 2009
In-Center Dialysis   Sept 2009
Nxstage    Feb 2010
Extended Nxstage March 2011

Transplant Sept 2, 2011

  Hello from the Oregon Coast.....

I am learning to live close to the lives of my friends without ever seeing them. No miles of any measurement can separate your soul from mine.
- John Muir

The clearest way into the Universe is through a forest wilderness.
- John Muir
Sugarlump
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10 years on and off dialysis

« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2011, 03:41:31 PM »

So, do you have any personal recomindations on this from experience??  I battle with the thought of this often as hubby is takimg a large vit D monthly and it just seems very weard to bombard him like that, and,,, i didnt really know what to look for in his blood results to see what it's doing 'besides' giving him adiquite vit D.  I wish i was a brilliant 'sevant' in all this and that this particular 'stuff' was my fortee...  (i also wish i was a better speller at this time so you could  know what i was trying to say   ::)  )

For those taking vitamin D, the issue noted in the article above revolves around phosphorus levels where low or normal levels do not appear to increase vascular calcifications but those with elevated phosphorus may be at risk. This is actually not new information on phosphorus levels, just taking a look from a different angle confirming what we knew from other studies. Unfortunately as in many dialysis related issues, there are no compelling studies to guide us with clarity. I am sure it will make for an interesting discussion with your dietician and medical team.

Does that mean Vitamin D supplements then are safe for post tx patients with low phospate levels?
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10 years of half a life
3 years HD 1st transplant Feb 08 failed after 3 months
Back to HD 2nd transplant Dec 10 failed after 11 months
Difficult times with a femoral line and catching MSSA (Thank you Plymouth Hospital)
Back on HD (not easy to do that third time around)
Fighting hard (two years on) to do home HD ... watch this space!
Oh and I am am getting married 1/08/15 to my wonderful partner Drew!!!
The power of optimism over common sense :)
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