Im a Racist

[MooseMom]

Gettin back to the topic of racism accusations, listen to the rhetoric of a vocal black congressman and what he has to say to Obama. Can't call that statement racially motivated, but somehow someone will.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8YDnd1Yoyk&feature=player_embedded

I suspect that Obama is underestimating the anger that his disrespect of this nation has caused. False accusations of racism only add fuel to that underlying anger at Obama. We will see election day with or without a strong GOP candidate. That is not the issue in the end. The issue will be whether people believe that Obama is taking America in the right direction. At the end of the day, that is all that will matter.

I don't see anything racist about Mr. West's speech.  It was the usual partisan stuff you'd hear from either party in an election year.  Just because he is a black man doesn't mean that what he has to say is racist.  I don't agree with him, but then again I don't really respond to hyper-rhetoric about "destroying" America, no matter the color of the person yelling.

I agree that America is angry, but Americans approve of Mr. Obama more than they approve of Congress, so let's just see how that pans out.  Most Americans are angry that Congress seems to be completely inert.  So, yes, Americans will have to decide who will more likely take this nation in the "right direction", President Obama, Manslut Newt Gingrich (yes, disrespectful, and he deserves it) or Corporate Shill Mitt Romney?

[Hemodoc]

Jean, I have mad typing skills!  LOL!  And I have no doubt that should I ever get to meet Hemodoc, we'd have a smashing great time.  I think I will add "Meet Hemodoc" on my bucket list.  And I don't see this as fighting, so please don't worry. 

Hemodoc,

1.  The Daily Telegraph is Britain's conservative mouthpiece and always has been.  I personally read The Independent as I try to get a more balanced view of things from the UK, but I do read the Telegraph on a more or less regular basis and have done on and off for almost 30 years now.  Toby Harden is their DC based reporter, and he regularly writes this kind of anti-American tripe as does much of the Telegraph's US staff.  The Brits have been banging on for decades about what they perceive to be American devaluation of the "Special Relationship".   I could bang on myself, but my years of living over there probably wouldn't serve to convince you of anything.

I am not sure I understand why Americans would care so much about Mr. Obama removing a statue of Churchill (who fervently wanted the US to enter WWII, and the fact that we did not until after Pearl Harbor STILL rankles with the English...OMG, did I hear about THAT a lot!) and replacing it with a true American hero, Abraham Lincoln.  If any other president had done the same, Americans would have lauded the move, celebrating the fact that our President wanted to celebrate our greatest US President.  But because it was Mr. OBAMA that did this, oh, well, Churchill is suddenly so important to us.  Hmmmm......

Please don't use the Telegraph to illustrate your arguments.  I'd have to repeat "They would say that, wouldn't they?"

Same goes for the WSJ, aka Fox News in Print.  Murdoch is a monster and his staff is unscrupulous, yet these are the organizations you use to support your arguments?  Perhaps you should think about a change.

Again, we could all find links to articles that support whatever viewpoint we want to put forward.  Just because they are in print doesn't mean they are fact.  When you read your Telegraph article, it is an essay of opinion, not journalistic reporting.  Look closely at the language used.  It's one man's opinion.

By the way, you referenced the Queen earlier.  Well, I have actually met the Queen, and she NEVER feels "disrespected".   How could she?  She's the Queen!!  THE QUEEN!"

2.  I am very, very interested in your comment re the civil rights movement.  You said, "THEY won."  And then you asked how Mr. Obama is doing for "his own people."  Oh, I am rather shocked as this pretty much sums it all up, doesn't it.  Who is "they"?  We ALL won when ALL Americans were granted their freedoms and the right to exercise their rights in peace.  And we ALL of us are Mr. Obama's people because we are ALL AMERICANS.  You have just demonstrated this idea that the President is "other", which is what is REALLY dividing this nation.  You may not see this as racist, but I do. 

3.  I also notice that you never call President Obama "president" or "Mr."   Just "Obama".  Disrespectful.  When you are upset about the uncivil discourse in this country, perhaps it would be nice if you could show a bit more respect for the President that was DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED BY THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

Sluff, be my guest to stand anywhere you like, but that doesn't make it true that the President doesn't care about this country.  That's one of those flippant comments that are constantly thrown around about which you have no proof.  You are welcome to disagree vehemently with any policy for any reason based in fact, but "he doesn't care about the country' is NOT based in fact.  You've just parroted some Fox News talking point.  Take this opportunity to shout if you want, too, but again, it doesn't make you right.  Who issued the order to assassinate OBL?  We have ourselves a bad-ass president!  Oh, but he doesn't care...

Riverwhispering, no, any one president can't make wholesale changes without the consent of Congress, and Congress has been bought by the lobbyists.  We are no longer a democracy although we like to think we are.  We are now an oligarchy, and it is Congress that has delivered us to the buyers of power.

Dear Moosemom, once again, on this thread decrying the false accusations of racism for disagreeing with Obama, you raise a veiled accusation one more time. I spend more time with people of black hair and brown skin than any of my whitey friends by far. I am not the least concerned of continued false accusations or racism. I just got a note from one of my best friends about a week ago and you reminded me right now I haven't called him back yet. Yup, my best friend is a black man and I need to call him today. Thank you for reminding me of that.

In any case, I won't bother answering your veiled allegation, I will let Bill Cosby do that.

Thank you for one more time opening up the reason for this thread:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5345290/ns/us_news-life/t/cosby-berates-blacks-abuse-failure-parents/#.TybfzRzU_qI

[Gerald Lively]

HemoDoc:

You are writing from the Tea Party talking points.  You get your news from FOX News.  Rather than answer questions, you expand the subject matter.  You even deny eye-witness accounts.  Hey, I watched the Tea Party attempts to deny people their right to free speech at tose healthcare town hall meetings.  I saw racist signs and I heard the words.

In debate I have heard the Tea Party claim that they aren’t responsible for individual misbehavior. When asked, “Who is in charge?” No one is in charge.  In a legal sense the people I saw are agents of the Tea Party and you may not deny that kind of association. 

Proof that the Tea Party does not know what they want or understand the effects of their actions, one only needs to view the congressional record for 2011. 

As for racism and other misbehaviors, see the below:
 
In March 2011 Ronald Schiller, a National Public Radio fundraising executive was secretly recorded during a lunch meeting with two men posing as potential donors.  Schiller said some highly-placed Republicans believed the Republican Party had been hijacked by this radical group, and characterized them as "Islamophobic" and "seriously racist, racist people".

The New York Times reported on August 8, 2009 that organizations opposed to the health insurance reform legislation were urging opponents to be disruptive. It noted that the Tea Party Patriots web site circulated a memo instructing them to "Pack the hall. Yell out and challenge the Rep’s statements early. Get him off his prepared script and agenda. Stand up and shout and sit right back down." The memo continued, "The Rep [representative] should be made to feel that a majority, and if not, a significant portion of at least the audience, opposes the socialist agenda of Washington."

Some Tea party organizers have stated that they look to leftist radical Saul Alinsky's Rules for Radicals for inspiration.

On March 16, 2010, at a Tea Party protest in front of the offices of Representative Mary Jo Kilroy, a counter-protester with Parkinson's disease was berated by Chris Reichert of Victorian Village, Ohio and had dollar bills thrown at him with additional protesters also mocking the individual. Reichert initially denied the incident, but later apologized for his "shameful" actions.

On March 20, 2010, before the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Bill was voted on in Washington D.C., it was reported that protesters against the bill used racial and anti-gay slurs. Several African-American lawmakers said that demonstrators shouted "the N-word" at them.

Representative André Carson said that as he walked from the Cannon House Office Building with Representative John Lewis, amid chants of "Kill the bill" he heard the "n-word" coming from several places in the crowd. One man "just rattled it off several times," adding "You know, this reminds me of a different time," referring to the 1960s.

Gay Congressman Barney Frank, was also present during the rally and was called a "faggot".

A fourth Democrat, Rep. Heath Shuler of North Carolina, who is white, backed up his colleagues, telling the Hendersonville (N.C.) Times-News that he too heard the slurs. And Richard Trumka, president of the AFL-CIO who was also present during the protest, corroborated Lewis', Carson's, Cleaver's and Shuler's version of events during a later debate with Breitbart by saying, "I watched them spit at people, I watched them call John Lewis the n-word."  Politicians from both parties, black conservative activists, and columnists have argued that allegations of racism do not reflect the movement as a whole.

[jshabanian]

     Here!  Here!  Moosemom!   I heartily agree with your comments.  Very eloquently said, I might add.

[Hemodoc]

Sorry, Gerald, I write from my own perspective on what I believe. I have had these views for nearly 20 years which precedes the Tea Party by a few.

If you think that people like me oppose Obama because we are racist, you are dead wrong. In fact, I do need to call my friend who is a black man and get his perspective on this whole racist opposition to Obama thing. He by the way can't stand Obama. Is he a racist as well. LOL.

But keep reminding us why we can't be apathetic this year even if we are not entirely happy with our choices. Yup, you are right, they aren't the candidates we hoped for, but I would take anyone of them way before Obama again.

In any case, I really get kick out of people trying to call me a racist. My friend will have a good laugh over that later today.  Thank you for reminding me I need to call him.

Have a good day.

[Hemodoc]

Gettin back to the topic of racism accusations, listen to the rhetoric of a vocal black congressman and what he has to say to Obama. Can't call that statement racially motivated, but somehow someone will.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8YDnd1Yoyk&feature=player_embedded

I suspect that Obama is underestimating the anger that his disrespect of this nation has caused. False accusations of racism only add fuel to that underlying anger at Obama. We will see election day with or without a strong GOP candidate. That is not the issue in the end. The issue will be whether people believe that Obama is taking America in the right direction. At the end of the day, that is all that will matter.

I don't see anything racist about Mr. West's speech.  It was the usual partisan stuff you'd hear from either party in an election year.  Just because he is a black man doesn't mean that what he has to say is racist.  I don't agree with him, but then again I don't really respond to hyper-rhetoric about "destroying" America, no matter the color of the person yelling.

I agree that America is angry, but Americans approve of Mr. Obama more than they approve of Congress, so let's just see how that pans out.  Most Americans are angry that Congress seems to be completely inert.  So, yes, Americans will have to decide who will more likely take this nation in the "right direction", President Obama, Manslut Newt Gingrich (yes, disrespectful, and he deserves it) or Corporate Shill Mitt Romney?

Nice language Moosemom.  You don't win arguments on respectability by showing lack of respect. But that is the heart of the issue.

I will gladly line up with these folks anyday. You folks can keep your occupy folks, good luck. Who is going to take out the trash?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WO40DMZWHQ&feature=related

[Hemodoc]

HemoDoc:

You are writing from the Tea Party talking points.  You get your news from FOX News.  Rather than answer questions, you expand the subject matter.  You even deny eye-witness accounts.  Hey, I watched the Tea Party attempts to deny people their right to free speech at tose healthcare town hall meetings.  I saw racist signs and I heard the words.

In debate I have heard the Tea Party claim that they aren’t responsible for individual misbehavior. When asked, “Who is in charge?” No one is in charge.  In a legal sense the people I saw are agents of the Tea Party and you may not deny that kind of association. 

Proof that the Tea Party does not know what they want or understand the effects of their actions, one only needs to view the congressional record for 2011. 

As for racism and other misbehaviors, see the below:
 
In March 2011 Ronald Schiller, a National Public Radio fundraising executive was secretly recorded during a lunch meeting with two men posing as potential donors.  Schiller said some highly-placed Republicans believed the Republican Party had been hijacked by this radical group, and characterized them as "Islamophobic" and "seriously racist, racist people".

The New York Times reported on August 8, 2009 that organizations opposed to the health insurance reform legislation were urging opponents to be disruptive. It noted that the Tea Party Patriots web site circulated a memo instructing them to "Pack the hall. Yell out and challenge the Rep’s statements early. Get him off his prepared script and agenda. Stand up and shout and sit right back down." The memo continued, "The Rep [representative] should be made to feel that a majority, and if not, a significant portion of at least the audience, opposes the socialist agenda of Washington."

Some Tea party organizers have stated that they look to leftist radical Saul Alinsky's Rules for Radicals for inspiration.

On March 16, 2010, at a Tea Party protest in front of the offices of Representative Mary Jo Kilroy, a counter-protester with Parkinson's disease was berated by Chris Reichert of Victorian Village, Ohio and had dollar bills thrown at him with additional protesters also mocking the individual. Reichert initially denied the incident, but later apologized for his "shameful" actions.

On March 20, 2010, before the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Bill was voted on in Washington D.C., it was reported that protesters against the bill used racial and anti-gay slurs. Several African-American lawmakers said that demonstrators shouted "the N-word" at them.

Representative André Carson said that as he walked from the Cannon House Office Building with Representative John Lewis, amid chants of "Kill the bill" he heard the "n-word" coming from several places in the crowd. One man "just rattled it off several times," adding "You know, this reminds me of a different time," referring to the 1960s.

Gay Congressman Barney Frank, was also present during the rally and was called a "faggot".

A fourth Democrat, Rep. Heath Shuler of North Carolina, who is white, backed up his colleagues, telling the Hendersonville (N.C.) Times-News that he too heard the slurs. And Richard Trumka, president of the AFL-CIO who was also present during the protest, corroborated Lewis', Carson's, Cleaver's and Shuler's version of events during a later debate with Breitbart by saying, "I watched them spit at people, I watched them call John Lewis the n-word."  Politicians from both parties, black conservative activists, and columnists have argued that allegations of racism do not reflect the movement as a whole.

Take a look at what the rank and file has to say about your false accusations of racism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1CLPhz0DHM&feature=fvwrel

[Gerald Lively]

I am not calling you a racist even though you fantasize that everyone is calling you one.  In your victimology, you deny what we all know to be true, the Tea Party is no better in their public behavior than any other group.  It is obvious to all that you dislike the Occupy Movement because they have an agenda you do not favor. 

You are an ideologue.  You are inflexible.  You see it “your way or the hiway”. 

George W. Bush stuck with the ideology of “trickle down” economics.  Trickle-down economics has never ever worked anywhere.  And it didn’t work in the US.  On September 19, 2008, we saw the consequences of inflexibility.  (DJI lost 777) Then GWB handed to problem to Obama and the GOP blames Obama for our economic problems.  And the Tea Party in Congress did not help.

Now we have the Tea Party membership in the House of Representatives.  They failed to perform, they couldn’t perform and they brought this government to a near halt.  It was that notion of , “My way or the hiway”.

How can you hang your hat on the Tea Party ideology when every indicator available says it is doomed to failure?

And where is that compassion.  Yep, Tea Party guy Ryan wanted to abolish Medicare and Social Security.

gl

[cariad]

Sorry, Gerald, I write from my own perspective on what I believe. I have had these views for nearly 20 years which precedes the Tea Party by a few.

Then you're not going to believe this, but JUST THIS WEEK Fox news pundits have suddenly started wittering on about Saul Alinsky. That is so amazing that you and Fox News have independently zeroed in on a rather obscure historical figure whose most famous work was written in the mid-70s and whom most of us outside of the world of community organizing had never heard of until recently. Wow, I'd worry that my house was bugged after such a spectacular coincidence.

[Hemodoc]

I am not calling you a racist even though you fantasize that everyone is calling you one.  In your victimology, you deny what we all know to be true, the Tea Party is no better in their public behavior than any other group.  It is obvious to all that you dislike the Occupy Movement because they have an agenda you do not favor. 

You are an ideologue.  You are inflexible.  You see it “your way or the hiway”. 

George W. Bush stuck with the ideology of “trickle down” economics.  Trickle-down economics has never ever worked anywhere.  And it didn’t work in the US.  On September 19, 2008, we saw the consequences of inflexibility.  (DJI lost 777) Then GWB handed to problem to Obama and the GOP blames Obama for our economic problems.  And the Tea Party in Congress did not help.

Now we have the Tea Party membership in the House of Representatives.  They failed to perform, they couldn’t perform and they brought this government to a near halt.  It was that notion of , “My way or the hiway”.

How can you hang your hat on the Tea Party ideology when every indicator available says it is doomed to failure?

And where is that compassion.  Yep, Tea Party guy Ryan wanted to abolish Medicare and Social Security.

gl

Gerald, you really crack me up. In fact, I am much more of a pragmatist which I why I have been accepted and worked in the dialysis advocacy circles well despite our complete 180 degree politial ideology differences. Oh my, it is entertaining to read your assessment of me. Let me state categorically, if you are accusing the Tea Party of being racist, then that is me since I am part of the "movement."

Instead, I have tried to show you what is the motivation behind the many people I also know in the Tea Party movement and it is NOT racism.

In any case, the racism false accusations will be useful to motivate people that would otherwise just stay on the sidelines. Please, don't stop, these false allegations will fuel the fire needed to remove your man from office.

Truly amazing how well you know a person you have never met. Geez louise. LOL.  Let me go get my dark skinned wife. She is swinging in the trees to get back to her roots for a while. LOL.

[cariad]

In any case, I really get kick out of people trying to call me a racist.

You seem quite bothered by it, actually. So much so that you are seeing accusations of racism everywhere. But I guess if you enjoy convincing yourself that people believe you are a racist, that explains a whole lot.

[Hemodoc]

Sorry, Gerald, I write from my own perspective on what I believe. I have had these views for nearly 20 years which precedes the Tea Party by a few.

Then you're not going to believe this, but JUST THIS WEEK Fox news pundits have suddenly started wittering on about Saul Alinsky. That is so amazing that you and Fox News have independently zeroed in on a rather obscure historical figure whose most famous work was written in the mid-70s and whom most of us outside of the world of community organizing had never heard of until recently. Wow, I'd worry that my house was bugged after such a spectacular coincidence.

Cariad, you are truly amazing. Please send me the link because I honestly missed that. I don't have TV here so I haven't watched Fox since early December. But please keep the laughs rolling.  LOL I actually have discussions with my liberal friends about Saul Alinski.  Geez Louise, you folks are digging deep.  My oh my. LOL. Please keep it up, I haven't laughed this hard in a while.

[Hemodoc]

In any case, I really get kick out of people trying to call me a racist.

You seem quite bothered by it, actually. So much so that you are seeing accusations of racism everywhere. But I guess if you enjoy convincing yourself that people believe you are a racist, that explains a whole lot.

You don't get it do you. I am laughing not at the serious allegations of racism, but instead in how untrue that is in my life but your politics is so devoid of any substance that you are left with no other things to discuss.  Heck, I better go get some watermelon and fried chicken for my wife for lunch. You know how those brown folks like fied chicken.  LOL

[Sluff]

Just adding my 2 Cents..... Do you all really believe that the President (Any President) really has the power to change things?   

You know he's just a puppet for the real government underground power

100% right. Same goes for any President. My beef with Obama is that I don't think his agenda has our Nation in his best interests. I think he came to Washington with his own agenda. I'm sure many Presidents can be accused of this but Obama's have been much more profound. Just my opinion. I served this country so that gives all of us the right to our opinion.

No personal attacks on the forum please. Debates can be very constructive or destructive. Please be careful in your wording.

Sluff/Admin

[Hemodoc]

Just adding my 2 Cents..... Do you all really believe that the President (Any President) really has the power to change things?   

You know he's just a puppet for the real government underground power

100% right. Same goes for any President. My beef with Obama is that I don't think his agenda has our Nation in his best interests. I think he came to Washington with his own agenda. I'm sure many Presidents can be accused of this but Obama's have been much more profound. Just my opinion. I served this country so that gives all of us the right to our opinion.

No personal attacks on the forum please. Debates can be very constructive or destructive. Please be careful in your wording.

Sluff/Admin

Dear Sluff,

Thank you for your service. I spent nine years in uniform and in many ways they were the most interesting of my life. I am proud to have been able to take care of thousands of active duty folks who voluntarily place their lives in harms way so that folks at home can call protest against them. Go figure.  Having served these folks and seen their hopes and their fears, it is an honor that I was able to have that as a part of my life.

God bless,

Peter

[cariad]

Cariad, you are truly amazing.

Oh, that’s really sweet of you, Hemodoc. Thanks!

[MooseMom]

  Heck, I better go get some watermelon and fried chicken for my wife for lunch. You know how those brown folks like fied chicken.  LOL

I'm glad you mentioned this because it should remind us that "racist" is a serious charge, and "racist" can be defined differently by different people.

Do y'all remember when Tiger Woods won his first Masters?  I believe it was his friend, Mark O'Meara, (I may be wrong, but I can't be bothered to look it up right now) who made a comment about how Tiger would be ordering fried chicken and watermelon for the customary awards dinner.  Now, I was living in the UK at the time, and I thought to myself how I would kill for good southern fried chicken and then some juicy watermelon.  I was brought up with this sort of food, and all that seemed to be missing was the black-eyed peas.  So, imagine my confusion when I read that many in the US were upset about this comment.  I had to have it explained to me by the British press that these foods were considered "black foods".  Boy, did I laugh!  That had never occurred to me!

And remember the picture that was photoshopped of the lawn of the White House being turned into a watermelon patch?  When I first saw that, I thought that it was supposed to be some sort of advertisement for the First Lady's push to eat healthier and to perhaps grow some of your own food.  I thought "What a clever photo!  Wouldn't that be cool, to turn a bit of the White House lawn into a garden with a watermelon patch!"  I grow my own herbs and berries, you see, so that's why I though it was be rather fun.  It didn't occur to me that the photo was supposed to be a racist jab, but it seems like that was indeed the intention.

Anyway, I just thought I'd inject a bit of humor...

And I promise that if Newt Gingrich is fairly elected as President of the United States, I will cease calling him "manslut."  However, it does seem that the female population of Florida agree with this assessment.  LOL!

God, I wish I had some watermelon.  Isn't it high in K? 

[Riverwhispering]

I guess I'm confused. 

Were you called a racist because you don't like Obama's politics or because he is half black and you commented on his color skin? 

I don't understand what the issue is.  What did you say about him that made someone even think you might be a racist?  Color skin and politics is like comparing apples and oranges.

[Sluff]

Just adding my 2 Cents..... Do you all really believe that the President (Any President) really has the power to change things?   

You know he's just a puppet for the real government underground power

100% right. Same goes for any President. My beef with Obama is that I don't think his agenda has our Nation in his best interests. I think he came to Washington with his own agenda. I'm sure many Presidents can be accused of this but Obama's have been much more profound. Just my opinion. I served this country so that gives all of us the right to our opinion.

No personal attacks on the forum please. Debates can be very constructive or destructive. Please be careful in your wording.

Sluff/Admin

Dear Sluff,

Thank you for your service. I spent nine years in uniform and in many ways they were the most interesting of my life. I am proud to have been able to take care of thousands of active duty folks who voluntarily place their lives in harms way so that folks at home can call protest against them. Go figure.  Having served these folks and seen their hopes and their fears, it is an honor that I was able to have that as a part of my life.

God bless,

Peter

And a big Thank you to you for your service both in the field and off Peter.

Sluff

[Willis]

Wow...I wonder if I can get a word in edgewise here! 

I'll say up front that I didn't vote for President Obama and will not vote for him in Nov regardless of who the Republicans put up against him. A lot of rhetoric against the president is based on personal political leanings and preferences and thus he could never satisfy most of his opposition even if he wanted to.

So I'll concern myself with some more recent actions in which President Obama has seemed to just thumb his nose at the Constitution. I'll briefly mention three as bullet points or this post could grow way too long.

1. Operation Fast & Furious. Weapons were sold to Mexican cartels through intermediaries hoping to track the weapons and use that to break up the cartels. It didn't work (surprise, surprise). But legitimate officials in Mexico might have every reason to consider that to be an act of war.

2. Speaking of war...the President authorized military action in Libya without following any of the provisions of the War Powers Act. Now it is possible to argue that the WPA is actually unconstitutional itself but the President never tried to make that case. Rather, when called on it he just said he didn't think the WPA applied. To send our military forces into war with no legislative approval or oversight of any kind certainly seems unconstitutional to me.

3. Recently President Obama made three "recess" appointments to the NLRB. These are positions subject to Senatorial "Advice and Consent" and for whatever reason approval for the individuals nominated was not forthcoming. So the President unilaterally made these appointments using the established and normally accepted procedure of "recess appointments." Recess appointments are used to fill vacant positions when the Senate is in recess and thus unable to vote on a nominee. Those appointed in this way may serve until the next election cycle. Unfortunately though, in this case the Senate WAS NOT in recess which is a very official and specific act.

So it seems to me that President Obama either doesn't care at all about the Constitution or at best will do whatever he can to find a loophole (even if it's his own idea of a loophole) to get done what he can't get done in traditional fashion. A President of the United States does not "rule" or "reign" over us and is subject to sharing power with the other two branches of our government...even if he doesn't like it. Barack Obama is our President--not our King.

A final comment. I know, I know...other Presidents have done things that were unconstitutional. But none of them are still in office. President Obama is the President now and must be held responsible for the actions of his administration.

 

[Hemodoc]

I guess I'm confused. 

Were you called a racist because you don't like Obama's politics or because he is half black and you commented on his color skin? 

I don't understand what the issue is.  What did you say about him that made someone even think you might be a racist?  Color skin and politics is like comparing apples and oranges.

Not hard to understand why. I joined another thread after becoming irritated over the accusations of Tea Party and the birther movement being racially motivated. Since I have grave unanswered questions about Obama's past including the alleged birth certificate which has problems folks, and since I support the concepts of the Tea Party, I joined in to give logical reasons why people like support conservatism, the Tea Party and wonder why we have no access to Obama's records that all other presidents have opened to review. Legitimate questions.

in any case, despite the fact they continually deny calling me a racist while at the same time using veiled references to racism in their answers. Some of the jibes have been rather open and not veiled. Makes me laugh and really makes my wife laugh at those suggestions as well when she asked me why I was laughing earlier today

So, there is absolutely no reason to call me a racist nor is that the motivation of people like me in the Tea Party who oppose Obama.

It is interesting to understand that I have been the object of racism on more than one occasion. My first wife of Vietnamese origin, born in Saigon, and I were essentially ready to elope because her family didn't want her to marry a white boy. They finally acquiesced and agreed to the marriage but were anything but happy about a white boy in their family. The first time I met my future sister in law a couple of days before the wedding, in Vietnamese, she told my bride to be I looked like a monkey. I found out later why she had caused the commotion she caused when she entered the house. I don't speak anything but one or two words of Vietnamese. That is how the marriage started, it never got better the short time we were married. That was how I was treated by my in-laws. To say the least, I got a bunch of lessons the hard way in that family for sure. I am sure my ex-sister in law still thinks I look like a monkey, but my current wife disagrees and that is all that matters.

The second time I was subjected to racism was when I brought my second wife, Filipino in descent, with our three black haired, brown eyed children to Cape Cod. We stopped at a restaurant where we waited to be seated for over an hour. I became a bit exasperated and went back to see what was going on. There were several open tables at that point. When the hostess noticed I had seen the empty tables, she said, oh, your table is ready hoping that we would have just got tired and left. After traveling 3000 miles, we weren't in our Sunday's best. I wanted to firebomb the restaurant but my wife preferred a bunch of cock roaches.  Instead, we stayed, ordered a full meal with terrible service and smiled the whole time not letting them know how angry that they had made us. Yes, racism sucks but it ain't just whitey that is doing it folks. Nevertheless, wherever it exists, it is plain and simply wrong and I have not minced my words to go against it when I have encountered it.

Prejudice is not just a white vs black issue folks, so you all really need to calm down about this whole racism issue. It will not do your campaign a bit of good to keep making this false accusation over and over again. Take a look, the opening post on this issue was in 2009 and you folks are still at it. You have provoked me and I am quite tempted to get truly politically active for the first time in my life. So, yes, just keep the false accusations coming my way and the Tea Party's way. One by one, your false accusations will fuel the fire needed to rid us of your president.

[MooseMom]

1. Operation Fast & Furious. Weapons were sold to Mexican cartels through intermediaries hoping to track the weapons and use that to break up the cartels. It didn't work (surprise, surprise). But legitimate officials in Mexico might have every reason to consider that to be an act of war.

I agree that this action was very ill advised and poorly executed.  I understand the thinking behind it and the hoped for results, and I'm sure that had it worked, our opinion would be different.  But yes, I agree with you here.

2. Speaking of war...the President authorized military action in Libya without following any of the provisions of the War Powers Act. Now it is possible to argue that the WPA is actually unconstitutional itself but the President never tried to make that case. Rather, when called on it he just said he didn't think the WPA applied. To send our military forces into war with no legislative approval or oversight of any kind certainly seems unconstitutional to me.

I don't think the President can win here.  There are those who criticize him for "leading from behind" after they had previously argued that Europe should do more in the realm of policing the world, so I get confused as to what the criticism actually is.  I have no doubt that Mr. Obama had the benefit of much legal counsel on this matter.  I feel that the debate is underpinned by the definition of "war"; as there was no formal declaration of war, is sending in air power under circumstances such as those in Libya at the time really "war"?  I don't know the answer to that, but Mr. Obama made a judgment call.  I don't envy his position.

3. Recently President Obama made three "recess" appointments to the NLRB. These are positions subject to Senatorial "Advice and Consent" and for whatever reason approval for the individuals nominated was not forthcoming. So the President unilaterally made these appointments using the established and normally accepted procedure of "recess appointments." Recess appointments are used to fill vacant positions when the Senate is in recess and thus unable to vote on a nominee. Those appointed in this way may serve until the next election cycle. Unfortunately though, in this case the Senate WAS NOT in recess which is a very official and specific act.

Did you know that one of the recess appointments is a Republican?  I can see your concern on this issue, but Congress has stalled the appointments of so many people, and I suspect that since the NLRB cannot legally function without a quorum, House Republicans recognized that fact and sought to keep the NLRB from being able to rule on cases in their purview.  It is very possible that the courts may overturn these appointments, and if they do, so be it, but I personally applaud the President in doing what he can to break the partisan deadlock and get things going.  This is the type of obstructionism that Americans are fed up with.

One last thing as a general comment.  I am grateful to anyone who serves in our military, but I can't help but get this odd vibe that resonates with an implied message that if you have served in uniform, your opinion is somehow more valuable and your service trumps everything.  I am also grateful to everyone who works to improve the lives of their neighbors and of there communities in ways that go unrecognized and don't usually come with medal ceremonies.  I am grateful to, say, cariad who risked her life and bullied her way into a clinical study so that future transplant recipients might not have to be subjected to harsh post-tx drugs.  I am grateful to rsudock who, using her experiences with lifelong kidney disease, works in a hospital and counsels young renal patients.  I am grateful to Okarol who is such a staunch advocate for people with renal disease.  I myself would like to think that I've helped people in my community from the time that I was 17 and lied about my age so that I could donate blood (I was a regular donor until I was 34), or when I was in my early 20s and volunteered as a translator at the Texas Heart Institute, or when I was in my 30s and volunteers as a support network for parents whose children had just been diagnosed with autism, or just a few years ago when I began volunteering at our local hospital.  So, please don't fall into this mindset where only military service is the most ultimate and worthy way in which to serve our nation and our communities.  This is not mean to be an attack of any kind, rather, it is meant to expand the definition of "honorable service."

Thanks for listening.

Hemodoc, those must have been painful experiences for you.  I am so sorry that your first wife's family did not give you a chance.  I sorta know what that feels like (not a race issue, though), and it's not fun.  I don't think you look like a monkey, but I do wish you'd learn to pick up your socks!  LOL! 

[cariad]

Wow...I wonder if I can get a word in edgewise here! 

I'll say up front that I didn't vote for President Obama and will not vote for him in Nov regardless of who the Republicans put up against him. A lot of rhetoric against the president is based on personal political leanings and preferences and thus he could never satisfy most of his opposition even if he wanted to.

So I'll concern myself with some more recent actions in which President Obama has seemed to just thumb his nose at the Constitution. I'll briefly mention three as bullet points or this post could grow way too long.

1. Operation Fast & Furious. Weapons were sold to Mexican cartels through intermediaries hoping to track the weapons and use that to break up the cartels. It didn't work (surprise, surprise). But legitimate officials in Mexico might have every reason to consider that to be an act of war.

2. Speaking of war...the President authorized military action in Libya without following any of the provisions of the War Powers Act. Now it is possible to argue that the WPA is actually unconstitutional itself but the President never tried to make that case. Rather, when called on it he just said he didn't think the WPA applied. To send our military forces into war with no legislative approval or oversight of any kind certainly seems unconstitutional to me.

3. Recently President Obama made three "recess" appointments to the NLRB. These are positions subject to Senatorial "Advice and Consent" and for whatever reason approval for the individuals nominated was not forthcoming. So the President unilaterally made these appointments using the established and normally accepted procedure of "recess appointments." Recess appointments are used to fill vacant positions when the Senate is in recess and thus unable to vote on a nominee. Those appointed in this way may serve until the next election cycle. Unfortunately though, in this case the Senate WAS NOT in recess which is a very official and specific act.

So it seems to me that President Obama either doesn't care at all about the Constitution or at best will do whatever he can to find a loophole (even if it's his own idea of a loophole) to get done what he can't get done in traditional fashion. A President of the United States does not "rule" or "reign" over us and is subject to sharing power with the other two branches of our government...even if he doesn't like it. Barack Obama is our President--not our King.

A final comment. I know, I know...other Presidents have done things that were unconstitutional. But none of them are still in office. President Obama is the President now and must be held responsible for the actions of his administration.

 

Wow, where have the conservatives been hiding you, Willis? This is actually a reasonable reply focusing on serious issues. I have this confusing feeling that I am tempted to call "genuine interest in what you have to say".

Just one question, if I may. You say that "President Obama is the President now and must be held responsible for the actions of his administration" do you also believe that he should receive credit for the great things that have happened during his presidency, like taking out Somali pirates and Osama bin Laden? (If you answer in a certain way, I might just faint, so please be careful!)

 (About the recess appointments, do you think that it would appear that calling a session for all of 30 seconds in order to say that they were not in recess was a deliberate and rather underhanded move to attempt to thwart the President?)

[Hemodoc]

  Heck, I better go get some watermelon and fried chicken for my wife for lunch. You know how those brown folks like fied chicken.  LOL

I'm glad you mentioned this because it should remind us that "racist" is a serious charge, and "racist" can be defined differently by different people.

Do y'all remember when Tiger Woods won his first Masters?  I believe it was his friend, Mark O'Meara, (I may be wrong, but I can't be bothered to look it up right now) who made a comment about how Tiger would be ordering fried chicken and watermelon for the customary awards dinner.  Now, I was living in the UK at the time, and I thought to myself how I would kill for good southern fried chicken and then some juicy watermelon.  I was brought up with this sort of food, and all that seemed to be missing was the black-eyed peas.  So, imagine my confusion when I read that many in the US were upset about this comment.  I had to have it explained to me by the British press that these foods were considered "black foods".  Boy, did I laugh!  That had never occurred to me!

And remember the picture that was photoshopped of the lawn of the White House being turned into a watermelon patch?  When I first saw that, I thought that it was supposed to be some sort of advertisement for the First Lady's push to eat healthier and to perhaps grow some of your own food.  I thought "What a clever photo!  Wouldn't that be cool, to turn a bit of the White House lawn into a garden with a watermelon patch!"  I grow my own herbs and berries, you see, so that's why I though it was be rather fun.  It didn't occur to me that the photo was supposed to be a racist jab, but it seems like that was indeed the intention.

Anyway, I just thought I'd inject a bit of humor...

And I promise that if Newt Gingrich is fairly elected as President of the United States, I will cease calling him "manslut."  However, it does seem that the female population of Florida agree with this assessment.  LOL!

God, I wish I had some watermelon.  Isn't it high in K?

I don't know where you get the idea that watermelon is a black food. My grandmother had a 1 acre patch of watermelon that she pretty much devoured most of it herself. She simply waited for the kids to go to bed and went out and got a fresh one right out of her garden near Fontana CA. That points out how WRONG false perceptions of other people are starting first of all with Tea Party people who I know a couple hundred at least. None of them that I know are motivated by racism. So yes, good point Moosemom, you must be careful about false impressions.

Using those derogatory terms speaks more of the people that use the terms than the people it is applied to. We have lost decorum in this nation, something that doesn't come to mind very often. My maternal grandmother lived next door to the same neighbor for 80 years and always addressed her as "Mrs. *******. Never by her first name yet they were actually rather good friends. Yes, in two short generations we have lost civility in all aspects of our society. Since man is made in the image of God, the insults we place on other men is actually a reflection of the image of God. We should remember that the next time we are tempted to speak ill of someone. We all do it, but it is not right.

James 3:8     But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.
9     Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.
10    Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.

[MooseMom]

Take a look, the opening post on this issue was in 2009 and you folks are still at it.

Respectfully, I believe it was you who dragged this topic back to the four.  It had been inactive since 2009.  Why did you add a post of your own?

You have provoked me and I am quite tempted to get truly politically active for the first time in my life. So, yes, just keep the false accusations coming my way and the Tea Party's way. One by one, your false accusations will fuel the fire needed to rid us of your president.

You SHOULD be politically active!  That's great!  But may I call your attention to the "...rid US of YOUR president" sentiment?  I'm afraid that it is this us vs them mindset that is so unfortunate.  He is your President, too, just like George W Bush was my president.

Oh, and I never got the impression that watermelon was "black food"...that's my point!  But other people (maybe those not raised in the south?) seemed to think so.  Maybe someone else could enlighten me.