I Hate Dialysis Message Board
Dialysis Discussion => Dialysis: Spouses and Caregivers => Topic started by: ODAT on October 24, 2007, 05:22:51 AM
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Mom went to the hospital last night with chest pains, clamy - sweaty feeling, burning and shoting pains in both her arms. Her bp was 190/80. The EMT's gave her nitroglicerin and baby aspirin on the way to the hospital. They took xrays they said of her chest and lungs. Lots of blood work and the nurse blew a vein in the top of mom's hand. Boy did that swell fast - gave her warm packs to put on it.
Her blood sugar is critical high at 616! She said that morning it was 147. Could it jump that high so quickly? They gave her an insulin drip.
I made sure that everyone that came into the room knew of her kidney condition. The one nurse that blew her vein when I told her mom was at 14%, she said 'End stage?' My sister Cath said, 'well, we don't know all the terminology yet - her appt with the kidney doctor is 11/6. She's just got mapped so far.' We don't want mom to hear that right now even if it is true! So finally about 11:45 a PA comes in that I tell and she says she was wondering about that. I couldn't ask her more because she had to finish with mom and I don't think she felt she knew enough to talk about it. When I was getting water, the PA was there and I told her more about the kidneys and asked what the creatine level was. She said 3. I just looked up what the numbers range from and it showed that 10.0 was a high for adults (I'd look for the answer in here but I have to scoot out of here back to the hospital - mom had to stay in an emergency room bed because the hospital was at red, but the EMTs asked Cath (one was her neighbor) where to take mom and that there was only one hospital that wasn't red...but they asked where she preferred and took her there. When they were wheeling mom in they went by the room my dad always seemed to be put in and mom said to herself "please not there."
She got to the hospital about 8:20pm. I left at 12:10am and her sugar was still over 500, blood pressure was 168/84. I hope I find her in a better condition this morning. If you could tell me if 3 is really a number to be nervous about, I'd appreciate the insight. I'll post an update when I get home today.
take care everyone and thank you
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Sorry to hear about our Mom, I have diabetes also and my sugars have been that high before but they are dangerously high even at 500. Some people go into a coma at that level. You have your Mom in the right place and I hope she recovers quick. Just wondering what the term RED means when you talk about the hospitals. Does that mean they are full?
Here's a hug for Mom :grouphug;
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Oh my. I so hope her bp comes down quickly. That's scary, for both you and her! I will be praying for you and your mom, that all goes well. :grouphug;
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Sorry to hear of your mom, praying for you. Sounds like a 3 isn't too bad, mine is like a 13.
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I know you are scared and worried. If there are things you don't understand that the docs or nurses are telling you, ask people here. Usually someone has the answer. Remember we are all here for you and I will say some prayers for your Mom and the whole family :grouphug;
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Hoping things are better for your mom today :thumbup;
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So sorry about your Mom, I hope all her numbers come down and she feels better.
I would re-check her tester. If her sugar is that high she has an infection or she hasn't been taking her medicine to control it. 500-616 is dangerously high and as Sluff said, she could go into a coma.
Is she insulin-dependant diabetic or on pills? It's easier to bring down an ID diabetic with insulin, don't know much about the pills.
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Hi ODAT, How is your mom today? Hopefully she is doing better and they were able to bring her sugar down. Please keep us posted :cuddle; Godspeed
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They kept mom again tonight. She had to "sleep" in the ER last night. Red does mean the hospital is full. Her sugar is now at 200. BP is 168/84.
The PA this morning was doing her check and mom told her that she had her knee and hip replaced and was getting the other one done, and that she had a cortisone shot yesterday. The PA yells "BINGO!" that's why your sugar is so high. I asked her how come none of the other doctors or PAs made that connection. Of course, she didn't really have an answer. My sister Cathy took her for the cortisone shot and had a paper, which she read when she got back to the hospital after I told her what the PA said. It said that if you were diabetic, you could see a slight increase in your sugar from the cortisone shot. Well, I don't know. When I was walking into the hospital this morning, I ran into her PCP and he said it was the steak she ate for dinner. Mind you, this happened before the PA made her comment to me and my mom.
I got to the hospital at 9am and left at 8pm. I have to go to work tomorrow so won't see her till lunch - unless I need to go sooner. She was gone for stress test from 1 to 4 and talked to a cardiologist who was assigned to her. We haven't heard results yet. She is on oxygen and a heart monitor - I think it's the kind that goes to the nurses station because it is just a gray box with the leads.
She does use insulin and glucafage. Her doses have fluctuated from 10 to 16 to 12.
thanks for your thoughts, prayers, and suggestions! much appreciated. talk to you when I get an update.
Edit: I cannot believe I forgot to include this. The cardiologist came to mom's room and said that if my mother needed an angioplasty that the kidney doctor would have to be there to dialysize to remove the dye from the kidney. Some 'jerk' doctor who was there when she went for testing, told her that he didn't have to be there. It made mom upset - mom's name is Carole btw - and when she came back down I could tell she was crying and I asked her if it hurt and she said no, then told me about him. She said the nurses there said they have no idea why he would say that. The PA that saw my mom after the testing KNEW who she was talking about. Sad if this doc has a rep like that - motormouth.
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Hope it was just the cortisone shot, wouldn't that be a blessing!
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Cath just called and said that mom needs an angiogram that they found blockage at the bottom of her heart. They will either do a stent or by-pass depending on what they find. From the little I've read, it looks like they can put a stent in while they are doing the test. I was going to work all day, but I don't think I can. I have no time left to take off due to all the time I took off when my dad was in the hospital. With everything that has happened to my family though, I'm sure my boss will understand that I need to be there.
The complications of an angiogram scare me especially with someone who has kidney issues. What creatine level is considered serious enough to start dialysis? Mom's is at 3 and we haven't met with the kidney doctor to know when he thought she should start. I see that traci is at 13. Traci, is that your creatine level or creatine clearance number? I ask because of the info I found this morning:
Creatinine level relates to the kidneys' loss of nephrons like this:
Creatinine levels versus kidney damage
Creatinine level Kidney's approximate nephron loss
0.6 to 1.5 mg up to 50% nephron loss possible
1.6 to 4.6 mg over 50% nephron loss possible
4.7 to 9.9 mg up to 75% nephron loss possible
over 10 mg 90% nephron loss possible, end-stage kidney disease
Creatinine Clearance
This is not a routine test - A creatinine clearance test compares serum creatinine to the amount of creatinine eliminated in urine during a given time period, usually 24 hours. To start this test, you empty your bladder and flush it. Then you get to collect all your urine during the next 24 hours - nothing like carrying around a bucket full of pee to further your social life, huh? <g> During the test period, one blood sample will be taken to measure serum creatinine. Then they can compare the amount in your blood to the amount passed in your urine.
Standard values are:
Adult men: 85 to 135 ml/minute
Adult women: 80 to 120 ml/minute
Pregnant women: 150 to 200 ml/minute
Elderly: values go down about 10% per decade after age 50
If your creatinine clearance approaches 10 ml/minute, dialysis may be necessary
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My Father-in-law just had an angiogram done and they found alot of blockage in his stomach ??? He has a very bad ulcer on his leg (he is diabetic) and they said if they dont get this surgery done then he could lose his leg, now they await for the clearance of his cardiologist. I am so glad there are actually people who still know what they are doing, lol, :bow;
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ODAT, I so pray that the angioplasty will be successful AND uneventful. Your mom has gone through so much, darn it. All I can do for you is offer a virtual ear for you to talk and vent. My prayers and best wishes go out to you and your mother. :grouphug;
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I am so thankful all of you are here for me and everyone. Mom will have the angiogram done tomorrow afternoon. The doctor said if they have to put a stent in they will do it right then. If she needs bypass surgery, she will have to go to another hospital. If things are good and she has to go for surgery, they will send her home and schedule it. If they run into complications, they will ambulance her over. The doctor said he knows they will find something based on her abnormal stress test.
Because of her kidney condition she will get extra types of fluid prior to the procedure. One of the risks is damaging the kidney with the dye. If that happens, she will need temporary dialysis. It's further complicated. Mom's blood levels dip below 30 and she has to get shots (she must have said the name five times today - can't remember) to bring it back to 35. The doctor said it was low, didn't say how low but I will be sure and ask tomorrow. If it's low, why can't they give her the shot? Mom was always told that she had bleeding internally but never where or how come. I'm beginning to, actually have been, think that her pcp should be changed.
Mom is nervous, scared, anxious, but says "git er done." She is so not a red-neck lol. I walked in tonight and she was having dinner. I asked if she left the meatloaf for last or didn't she like it. She said she didn't like it - "I don't even like my own!" she's a pip.
I'll talk to you tomorrow and let you know how things went. I'll also tell her that you all give her your best!
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My Father-in-law just had an angiogram done and they found alot of blockage in his stomach ??? He has a very bad ulcer on his leg (he is diabetic) and they said if they dont get this surgery done then he could lose his leg, now they await for the clearance of his cardiologist. I am so glad there are actually people who still know what they are doing, lol, :bow;
Amen to that! I am almost thankful that she got to the hospital when she did before things were much worse. We are staying strong in the belief that she is 'just in for repairs and will be good as new - even better.'
Hope you're doing well. Glad you all had a grand ole time in Vegas. That's a place I'll never see - I'd go broke - no willpower!
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Wow, what a day. I was working away on an actually fun project, planning to leave at 11:30 to go to the hospital since the doctor said it would be in the afternoon and that mom wouldn't be going before then. My sister texted me at 10:30 and it read "They did it in the am!" I cried out "Unbelievable!" A coworker looked at me and I told her what was going on. They took her at 8am. She told us she was scared &^$#less. Anyway, I left right away and they were just bringing her back to her room.
They put a stent in. The artery was 95% blocked. The other one is 40 to 50% blocked but they have to wait till it's 75%. The doctor said he may put a stent in her kidney. I was so tired I wasn't paying attention by then I was ready to leave because my sister got there and I 'tagged' out. He walked in just as I was walking out. Anyway, I thought I heard sis and doc discussing that she may not then need dialysis?! I haven't had time to research.
We got in there, mom told the nurse her chest felt tight. The nurse took her bp it was 172/77. I said, "that's pretty high" She said "Oh it's probably because we were moving her around so much." I just looked at her. She came back about 2 min later with nitro pills! Mom ended up getting two and the bp went to 126/74. About 2 hours later it was 147/78. Mom sure perked up after those pills. She will be getting them when she goes home - not sure when she goes home.
They are giving her a special drink to help flush the kidneys - sounds like musenix. Smells like rotten eggs the nurse said, but it is mixed with ginger ale.
got to go eat dinner. talk to you later
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Oh ODAT, that is great, glad to hear mom is doing better, i am glad they caught that blocked artery and they are going to keep an eye on the other one also ;) Thanks for keeping us posted, hopefully now you can rest a little easier :2thumbsup;
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Glad your Mom is doing better.
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oh man! I am so glad they caught that, just in time, too! she'll feel better when she goes home, I'm sure!
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Hi everyone, thanks for your support~ Mom will get a stent in the artery going to her kidney on Monday. she is feeling much better. I'll let you know how she does on Monday. The pcp thought it would improve her kidney function. We'd like to talk to the kidney doc too.
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Glad to hear a little good news. :thumbup;
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ODAT, you need a rest,...pause..and you will soon find out that everything is well with prayers. All my love and prayers too. Sometimes we all have to go through this for a reason.
love,
cris
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yay-glad to hear good news.
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Glad to hear about your mom, sounds like God has more work for her here! btw, my 13 is high, even on home hemo... that is why they uped my time on to 2.5 hours and increased my dial. to 17. That was last month's labs, and I heard this month is better, but I have to wait for Tue. when I see mt neph to get my new #. I don't have much function left though, already knew that.
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:2thumbsup; whew, really hope your Mom is on her way to recovery.
cris
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Hope she is all better soon.
:cuddle;
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Not even sure where to start... Mom is having an allergic reaction and the doctors are freakin stumped. Duh! She had a cypher stent put in around 8am Friday morning. Talking to my sister-in-law tonight - (she didn't know until tonight) She tells me there is a class action suit against this drug-coated (meant to prevent infection and reclogging) stent. When we were told she would need a stent, ok, we didn't ask what kind, just took for granted it would be safe.
So yesterday I was there from 10 to noon. I noticed actually when I was leaving - mom was sitting up and her gown open in the back - that her back was pink. I thought 'great her color is coming back.' My sister got there a few hours later and she by that time was bright red! Her chest, scalp, wrists, between her fingers, feet, round spots on her stomach and one on her thigh, swollen hands and feet. complained of itching -they gave her benadryl. I come in to day - first one there at 9:30 and she is getting worse! I ask the nurse what is it? She doesn't know. Says she'll send the PA in as soon as she is available.
I get the books out and read them over again and see that allergic reaction is in the cypher book. When the nurse comes back in I tell her that it says in the book it could be from the stent. She says Oh. PA comes in and kind of gets smart with me. I ask her what is this from, she says I don't know I haven't looked at her yet. I feel like saying you don't have to look at her to know what it's from!!! They ask her if she bumped her left inside heel because to me it looks ulcerated. It's hard to describe, but it is not black and blue !! That is what happens when you bump something. It looks like blood is pooling under the skin. Just looks bad. I show the PA that mom also has the same discoloration on her wrists. Ok, did she bump that too!!?!?
It's very hard not to be with her tonight. They don't know what is causing it. They say it could be Plavix, but she HAS to take that to prevent clotting. They are considering switching her to one that is less effective. Ok, so I tell the PA, 'they're not doing the second stent until this is cleared.' she said 'oh, no.' If they clear this up, she has the second stent put in, reaction happens again, oh good now we know it's the stent. BULLSHIT! sorry. I don't want them to put another one in that will cause such issues.
I was reading some of the stories from people who had a hard time with cypher and a lot of it is that they experience arthritis symptoms, chest pain, arm pain, and itchiness. I feel so helpless. I just pray that she clears up. They started her on pill form benadryl, but the PA switched it to iv form. Also added steroids iv form. (mom isn't on any iv's but has a line they put it in through).
Another thing is she was on oxygen the whole time she's been there. They took it off Friday night and by 4pm today, the nurse checking her oxygen said she would talk to mom's nurse and see if they should put it on again. It was 89%. So mom says, I did just come back from the bathroom. Nurse says oh that's probably why. I said 'Mom, you went 20 minutes ago!' WTF first the nitro issue when I said 'her bp seems high (179/84) and the nurse told me 'oh, it's because we moved her around from bed to bed.' Then she comes back 4 min later with nitro pills!
I feel like the only good doctor I have is DR. freakin GOOGLE! Her pcp came in, I asked him a lot of questions. A nurses' aid came in to check her blood sugar which went up to 400 due to the steriods - and she said that even her pcp didn't have a clue what the redness was from. Oh...they are going to have a dermotologist look at her tomorrow and the cardio doc that did the stent. What the heck is a derm gonna figure out?!
I am really frustrated. Time to try and sleep. I will let keep you posted on how things are going. take care everyone - seems like we have to and really do know more than the docs sometimes. I asked pcp creatine level and he read the chart and said it was 3. I should have asked him when was the last time it was checked. I was there all day, then my sis, then my brother, no one drew any blood or took urine samples.
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Wow, what a nightmare. Is anyone staying with your mom during the night? We kept a log when my mom was in the hospital, sisters and I tag teamed and wrote down every single thing - it was the only way we could prove what was going on. Your DR.GOOGLE comment did make me laugh though. Isn't it amazing that you come in with info and questions and they just want to shrug off your concerns?? ODAT - don't forget what ODAT means - try to take care of yourself so you will be useful to help your mom. Wish I had some answers. Seems like that allergy should get straightened out right away. Good luck to your mom and family.
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Dr Google is the best doctor. I had to fight for them to do an angiogram on my father as well as an echo cardiogram-all the while his chest pain was an 8 out of 10
and the lazy cardiologist just says-There isnt much I can do. I had the nurse call him and I told him I as the patients daughter do not want to hear I can't do much I want to hear you will do all possible and necessary.
Crossing my fingers!!!!!
Keep bugging them about the stent-Take care and HUGS
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Wow, what a nightmare. Is anyone staying with your mom during the night? We kept a log when my mom was in the hospital, sisters and I tag teamed and wrote down every single thing - it was the only way we could prove what was going on. Your DR.GOOGLE comment did make me laugh though. Isn't it amazing that you come in with info and questions and they just want to shrug off your concerns?? ODAT - don't forget what ODAT means - try to take care of yourself so you will be useful to help your mom. Wish I had some answers. Seems like that allergy should get straightened out right away. Good luck to your mom and family.
Believe me I wanted to. It's going to be hard enough going to work this morning. Have to let the 'tag team' work though (lol) Cathy is going this morning and if she thinks I should be there she'll let me know. I will post later today. thanks for all the support, it really helps!
Kim
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Mom still is very red and swollen. She is not in any pain or itching. Still on steroids and benadryl if she asks for it. On fluid iv and oxygen. No one is saying what the cause is yet or what exactly is happening in her body. I don't know what happens with an allergic reaction. I research and all's it says is that you can have one - doesn't describe it.
The hospital's kidney doctor came in when Cathy was there. Told them that mom's creatine level went from 3.3 to 3.8 after the stent. If she has the stent for the kidney artery (70% blocked), there will be more damage to the kidney from the dye. I wasn't there or would have asked 'any idea of how much more?' So, doc said it would be 'elective' surgery because my mother has to make the decision (ultimately anyway or so we thought).
Got to go back to the hospital. She'll be there a few more days.
Anyone had any adverse reactions to Plavix?
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Thinking of you and your Mom, ODAT, Sending good thoughts and prayers your way :waving;
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My mom is still in the hospital. The severe allergic reaction they still don't know! It could be the dye (which has damaged her kidney further and put dialysis closer - within a few months), new med Plavix (which they can't switch because it's the best one to prevent clotting), or the drugs that are on the stent (which they can't take out). They are treating the allergic reaction with steroids (which raise her blood sugar to over 500) but they are monitoring her very closely. Trying to get everything under control.
I got to the hospital at noon and mom was upset. She told me a kidney doctor (one associated with the office she goes to) basically told her she would be going to surgery tomorrow to get a fistula for dialysis. Mom said he had just left so I went right out and saw the PA told her I wanted him to come back. He did and even though he still talked in circles, said that she was not going down for surgery and that the vascular surgeon would come in and see her. I don't think they know what's really going to happen.
In my naivety I was focusing on the creatine level. She is now at 4.9. The doc told me her GRF was on the low side of 15 - 20%. I asked him if when it would stabilize or get better and he didn't have an answer. Mom has those big boots on her feet so she doesn't irritate them more. The redness is still as much as the first day and the swelling has only gone down a bit. She has her left ankle wrapped because it is now broken open. They put a red circle on her door, which when my dad had it meant DNR. We called the nurse in and she said it meant 'skin condition.' Cath asked her if a derm would be called in. Of course, didn't know.
I am so sick of them not knowing. I've done enough research to see that the cypher stent has had hypersensitivity reactions to it where it could be from the drugs or the polymer coating. Are they just afraid to admit it? I asked the nurse, if it is the Plavix that caused this, when she goes home she will still be on it. She said that's why they won't let her go home until this is cleared up. So I said ' you're saying that this could only be an initial reaction to Plavix and she'll be okay staying on it without this recurring?' She said yes. I don't believe this.
I'm not sure if I mentioned that the stent for the kidney was put on the back burner. Especially after I read that article that okarol posted. The kidney doc said that the dye would definitely damage the kidney too much.
I've got to go to bed. I am a basketcase. I can't imagine how my mom feels. It seems like everything has escalated. There was no way around needing a stent, just wish we were told this may happen and had a choice of stents, though I doubt they will admit it is that. Don't want to miss around with any lawsuits or the FDA...
(edited to spell check... lol - thought I spelt 'naivety' wrong and found everything else but!)
We are trying to maintain sanity with humor. Cathy told me not to tell anyone, but I can't help it. She was calling me on her cell from the hospital bathroom (nurse told me to not to use cell today - when I first got there I was so pissed that mom was upset I went to call Cath) so she says 'ok you're gonna hear a flush.' then she says real excitedly (I don't think she thought she flushed it...) "where's my cell?! where's my cell?! oh...I'm talking on it." I laughed so hard. Today I went to the mailroom to buy a stamp to mail those lovely bills, halfway there I realized I had the money but not the bill! Sleep is good.
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Ugh-the doctors won't admit to the stent being the issue. I am praying for your mom! She will get through this-hugs to you and your mom you guys are in my prayers!
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Ugh-the doctors won't admit to the stent being the issue. I am praying for your mom! She will get through this-hugs to you and your mom you guys are in my prayers!
You got that right! I tried to research allergic reactions, plavix reactions, even cypher stent info. I just get that you can have one it doesn't describe what happens. I don't know who in the IHD community have had this type of stent placed, but if there's anyone out there that can let me know if you or your loved one dealt with adverse reactions that would be helpful. I just don't see how they can be plowing her with steriods when her kidneys are not filtering it. That's got to have some impact right?
thank you all for your prayers
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You need to get another opinion if you think it is the stent causing the problems usually the patient is right. I know it's your Mom and not you but if your instincts tell you it's the stent then it probably is. Ask for another opinion, it is your right. It is your Moms life they are messing with Get to the bottom of it by any means possible. Good Luck I know this is hard on you too.
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You need to get another opinion if you think it is the stent causing the problems usually the patient is right. I know it's your Mom and not you but if your instincts tell you it's the stent then it probably is. Ask for another opinion, it is your right. It is your Moms life they are messing with Get to the bottom of it by any means possible. Good Luck I know this is hard on you too.
I will talk to my sister today about this, but when I first read it I thought 'how do you get another opinion from the same hospital?' I don't understand why they can't explain what they've seen in the past. Exactly what is the reaction most known to happen if it's the 1. dye, 2. stent (drugs or polymer), 3. plavix. All's we hear is 'it's not an exact science - all's we can do is to clear this up. She isn't in any pain, not itching, and it's not anaplaletic.' I can't even go up until almost 5pm today. I think Cathy will be up around 9:30am and she sent a fax to mom's primary and told him all the issues and that we are not happy with the answers.
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You need to get another opinion if you think it is the stent causing the problems usually the patient is right. I know it's your Mom and not you but if your instincts tell you it's the stent then it probably is. Ask for another opinion, it is your right. It is your Moms life they are messing with Get to the bottom of it by any means possible. Good Luck I know this is hard on you too.
I will talk to my sister today about this, but when I first read it I thought 'how do you get another opinion from the same hospital?' I don't understand why they can't explain what they've seen in the past. Exactly what is the reaction most known to happen if it's the 1. dye, 2. stent (drugs or polymer), 3. plavix. All's we hear is 'it's not an exact science - all's we can do is to clear this up. She isn't in any pain, not itching, and it's not anaplaletic.' I can't even go up until almost 5pm today. I think Cathy will be up around 9:30am and she sent a fax to mom's primary and told him all the issues and that we are not happy with the answers.
Good job keep on them Odat. It's ok if we are wrong we are not Doctors, but the one thing that the Doctors don't think about while they are guessing, is the emotional impact on the patient and the family.
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Hi ODAT-
The scientific method to narrowing down the possible causes of the problem would be to change one thing at a time and see if it makes a difference. If that change didn't improve her symptom, change another thing, and wait for results. The hardest thing to change sounds like the stent. But if you can rule out the other 2 things then a reasonable doctor may agree that the stent must be dealt with. If it were me I would ask what she can be given instead of Plavix (I think aspirin is sometimes used.) - a rash and increased creatinine are POSSIBLE side affects of Plavix - also read about drug interactions http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/clopidog_ad.htm - that might be happening as well. If it doesn't change any symptom, then try something else. I get nervous when they start adding more meds and really don't approach the situation methodically. I hope things improve!
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Sorry to hear your mom is still having so much trouble, hope they figure it out soon :grouphug;