I Hate Dialysis Message Board
Off-Topic => Political Debates - Thick Skin Required for Entry => Topic started by: Bill Peckham on January 28, 2017, 01:28:02 PM
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I think this is really good. http://text-patterns.thenewatlantis.com/2017/01/recency-illusions.html (http://text-patterns.thenewatlantis.com/2017/01/recency-illusions.html) The last paragraph says what I have felt but have not found the words to say:
I have come to believe that it is impossible for anyone who is regularly on social media to have a balanced and accurate understanding of what is happening in the world. To follow a minute-by-minute cycle of news is to be constantly threatened by illusion. So I’m not just staying off Twitter, I’m cutting back on the news sites in my RSS feed, and deleting browser bookmarks to newspapers. Instead, I am turning more of my attention to monthly magazines, quarterly journals, and books. I’m trying to get a somewhat longer view of things — trying to start thinking about issues one when some of the basic facts about them have been sorted out. Taking the short view has burned me far too many times; I’m going to try to prevent that from happening ever again (even if I will sometimes fail). And if once in a while I end up fighting a battle in a war that has already ended ... I can live with that.
I think pointing out, earlier in the article, what a crazy year 1972 was, is really helpfull. I was 9 years old in 1972, I'm grateful we didn't have the internet when I was growing up. You hear the rhetoric on both sides about how these are unprecedented times. They are not.
Thinking about the election one thought comes to mind - one does not get to decide if you are being a jerk - judging you is entirely up to others. I think a lot of people voted for Trump and/or Republicans generally because they believed Democrats had been governing like jerks. I would say that much, but not all, of this impression was, as discussed in the article, artifacts of this Twitter/Facebook/News bubble world where judgements are made and impressions formed minute to minute. I don't know if anyone has figured out how to llive as the focus of social media, the Democrats certainly haven't. Now it is Trump and the Republicans who are in the eye of the minute to minute storm. As for me I don't want to be in the minute. I think on some issues I can be in the hour - the provision of dialysis and CKD research - but for the rest I think in the month will be about right.
Right now there are important things happening regarding things I care very much about, the provision of dialysis and CKD research certainly, but more so the health of the nation and Americans generally. I believe I will be better prepared and more effective advocating for my positions if I am not in the minute. In regard to my life and my future I'm optimistic. It would be foolish to spend my minute to minute attention on anything except what I am seeing and experiencing in meat space. Maybe I am just getting old but I don't see the upside of living online in the moment. In meat space being in the moment is great. I recommend it.
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In meat space being in the moment is great.
Where/what exactly is "meat space?" I've never heard that term.
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I was 21 in 1972 and while the country was in upheaval it was also a time of change and of things that really neede to be done that was the year if I Remember correctly that the company I worked for signed a EEOC agreement so women were allowed to apply for any job. When I started working in 1969 the work force in many areas was male and white. I don't think this year is as bad or as good as 1972. If you look at all the polls they all have trump at a 36 point approval rating, almost 50 points lower then Obamas in 2009. I think the approval rating explains how trump got elected. A lot of unhappy voters assumed Clinton was going to win and voted for trump to express their displeasure. If every one who voted for trump wanted him to win I firmly believe his numbers would be better.
Simply put trump is a practical joke America played on itself. Modified to fix spelling errors.
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kickingandscreaming, I'd not heard the term "meat space", either, but it is brilliant!! :rofl; I hope I am correctly assuming it means "real life".
Bill, thank you for posting this as a reminder to look at things in the long term. I won't go near twitter, I don't have any news feeds but I DO admit to bookmarking certain news sites, particularly foreign ones. I'm going to stop doing that. I do read certain weekly and monthly journals, and I have found that they tend to be more introspective while also being more forward looking.
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Meat space is the equivalent of the current term "IRL" (in real life) ;D
In meat space being in the moment is great.
Where/what exactly is "meat space?" I've never heard that term.
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I find your comments regarding 1972 very interesting. I was born in 1970 so it was quite before my time. But I recently started reading a book called January 1973 about that month in American history and how so many events all came crashing together in that one month during Nixon's presidency. I would like to finish it sometime but the way it is written makes it a tough slog.
I admit that it is fairly slow at work right now so I find myself getting sucked into things like Washington Post and Twitter more than I probably should be. But I admit that Twitter can have some great uses, I've gotten way more accomplished with certain business entities on Twitter than I could have in any other fashion. But yes, everything is knee-jerk. I'm reminded of CNN and the days of the Columbine shooting and 9/11. I was home for both of those days and just watching CNN and how the story twists from one minute to another even before social media was unbelievable.
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My mother when she was alive became addicted to Catastrophe News Network as my sister and I began to refer a CNN as.
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I don't see Trump winning to be any more of a joke on America than when Ronald Reagan won. I mean an ACTOR, as President? And he turned out to be a very good President. Either way, Trump is in the Oval Office, it is our Duty as Citizens to support him and give him a chance to do good.
All the Snowflakes continued whining will not change the person in the Oval Office. Stop the whining and act like productive citizens instead of whining crybabies just because you didn't get your way. How many of them even bothered to vote?
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First national election I didnt vote in 46 years because I was in the hospital in a cardiac Care unit. And I dont remember the greatness Of the regan years I remember them as the prelude to the economics disasters during the Bush administration. Plus the suffering of the people caused by his illegally with holding treatment for stroke victims by denying Medicare the ability to pay for rehab for stroke victims, then when it would lose in court not appealing the decision forcing every victim to go to court to get approval. Majority of victims won however it took a year and the first 6 months are the time when rehab will help them recover function. What the result of this policy was thousands of stoke victims condemned for the rest of their lives was a life limited by unrepaired stroke damage. The Carnage in the poor was well documented during the Reagan administration as it illegally stopped paying Social Security benefits to any child of a parent that died, the law required them to receive help during college, again when they lost in court they didn't appeal forcing every one to wat several years for a court judgement. Those years while good for the haves were a living hell for the have nots. Plus the great economy was based on massive tax cuts that fueled a apparent econmic boom, what wasn't noticed was the huge deficits was causing interest rates to sky rocket eventually leading to the economic collapse during the first bush administration. And don't blame the democrats for the spending, every year in office regans budget request was larger than democratic proposed budget. Basically the good times were paid for by turning the budget into a huge credit card machine that when it finally collapsed wrecked the economy. The boom of the Clinton years was caused by balanced budgets allowing interest rates to normalize.
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EVERY President has had flaws. But that is part of being Human. We get through it and Hopefully pass Legislation to amend those errors.
Never before have the Public Rioted in the streets over an American Presidential Election. I wish I could go through the hoards of rioters asking "Did you Vote?" If not, GO HOME, you failed to exercise your Right and Responsibility to Vote, you should have no Right to Protest.
No matter what Trump does during his term, we as a Nation will survive. The Country will continue.
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Very well said Charlie, I couldn't agree more with you. The massive collective hysteria that now exists over every word or deed by the new President Trump is beyond any measure of rational or sane. So far, he is working very hard to deliver on the promises he has made & he is working very hard towards this.
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EVERY President has had flaws. But that is part of being Human. We get through it and Hopefully pass Legislation to amend those errors.
But some have more "flaws" than others.
Never before have the Public Rioted in the streets over an American Presidential Election. I wish I could go through the hoards of rioters asking "Did you Vote?" If not, GO HOME, you failed to exercise your Right and Responsibility to Vote, you should have no Right to Protest.
"Riots" are not the same as First Amendment protected "protests". Where have there been "hoards of rioters"? While I agree that it is hypocritical to protest when you haven't voted, it is not illegal, nor does such inaction take away one's right to free speech and protest
No matter what Trump does during his term, we as a Nation will survive. The Country will continue.
But in what form? Only one week into Trump's presidency, and you are already talking about how every president has flaws and musing about the survival of the nation and the country's continuation. That's very telling.
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Very well said Charlie, I couldn't agree more with you. The massive collective hysteria that now exists over every word or deed by the new President Trump is beyond any measure of rational or sane. So far, he is working very hard to deliver on the promises he has made & he is working very hard towards this.
Does a King rule your little mystery country? Methinks you do not remembereth the protestations wrought by Congress over the Obama Presidential Executive Orders. Why doth Congress not protest now? Dost thou not know, oh fair maiden of a far and distant land?
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So much for "slowing down online".
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No matter what Trump does during his term, we as a Nation will survive. The Country will continue.
There are always "the Good Germans" who think that the authority can do no wrong and who wait until it's too late.
From this first disastrous week it is clear how easy it is to derail an entire nation.
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
Martin Niemöller (1892–1984) was a prominent Protestant pastor who emerged as an outspoken public foe of Adolf Hitler and spent the last seven years of Nazi rule in concentration camps.
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I don't see Trump winning to be any more of a joke on America than when Ronald Reagan won. I mean an ACTOR, as President? And he turned out to be a very good President. Either way, Trump is in the Oval Office, it is our Duty as Citizens to support him and give him a chance to do good.
All the Snowflakes continued whining will not change the person in the Oval Office. Stop the whining and act like productive citizens instead of whining crybabies just because you didn't get your way. How many of them even bothered to vote?
Many would disagree that Reagan was a good president.
We've given Trump a chance to do good, but look what he has done just in one week. Do you really want Steve Bannon sitting in on the highest national security discussions. because allowing him access is only one of several dreadful decisions Trump has made already.
He's already had to backtrack on his "muslim ban"; several Federal judges have had to step in and mitigate the damage.
The "snowflakes" are the ones who whimper that Trump should be given a "chance" and who choose to slip away when he issues orders that are clearly illegal. The 'snowflakes" are the ones who accept the "alternate facts" rammed down our throats. It is our duty to protect our country from enemies both foreign and DOMESTIC. You snowflakes can faff about online, defending this man who wants to make a businessman's profit instead of actually govern (with the help of buffoons like Bannon and DeVos, for God's sake), but the rest of us are going to be very watchful and will make every ludicrous decision he makes the impetus for his eventual humiliation and downfall.
He cares nothing about you. He cares nothing about me.
Don't forget that he has not done one single thing with the support of Congress. Then again, right now Congress resembles a blizzard. Look at the Republican silence on the muslim ban just enacted by Trump. Blizzard!
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hSGjyWJZIQJpGz4V2ftX_qioCgBtL59oJkkhx146nFE/htmlview?usp=sharing&sle=true
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The "snowflakes" are the ones who whimper that Trump should be given a "chance"
This is not a comment on Trump, but vocabulary and terminology.
"Snowflake" is a term used for people who will melt if their sensitivities are offended. It was created to describe people who need a "trigger warning" before reading Huck Finn in class because the text uses the word "nigger"; those who need a safe space with puppies and teddie bears if their favored candidate does not win an election; who so fear disagreeing opinion that they demand speakers be disinvited or threaten violence is speakers they disagree with are allowed to speak on campus; who need a participation trophy even if they do not do well; etc.
So, I suppose a Trump supporter would rightfully be called a snowflake of (s)he needed a "trigger warning" before progressive dogma could be discussed in his/her presence, or if (s)he demanded a liberal thinker be banned from a public forum.
But, "snowflake" does not apply to any of the behavior you cited by Trumpians.
Now, does anyone know if the Cabot Arms Trump 45 (http://www.range365.com/trump-45-from-cabot-guns) is real or a photoshop job, and if the finish is really gold or if it's high polish physical vapor deposition Titanium Nitride?
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No matter what Trump does during his term, we as a Nation will survive. The Country will continue.
There are always "the Good Germans" who think that the authority can do no wrong and who wait until it's too late.
From this first disastrous week it is clear how easy it is to derail an entire nation.
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
Martin Niemöller (1892–1984) was a prominent Protestant pastor who emerged as an outspoken public foe of Adolf Hitler and spent the last seven years of Nazi rule in concentration camps.
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No matter what Trump does during his term, we as a Nation will survive. The Country will continue.
There are always "the Good Germans" who think that the authority can do no wrong and who wait until it's too late.
From this first disastrous week it is clear how easy it is to derail an entire nation.
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
Martin Niemöller (1892–1984) was a prominent Protestant pastor who emerged as an outspoken public foe of Adolf Hitler and spent the last seven years of Nazi rule in concentration camps.
Many thanks kickingandscreaming for remembering Martin Niemöller's quotation:
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist,
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
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Here are all of President Obama's Executive orders from 2009: https://www.archives.gov/federal-register/executive-orders/2009-obama.html (https://www.archives.gov/federal-register/executive-orders/2009-obama.html)
Here are links (all links PDFs) to the four Executive orders signed by President Trump:
- Border Security and Immigration Enforcement Improvements (http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2017/images/01/28/border.security.and.immigration.enforcement.improvements.pdf) -- January 25
- Enhancing Public Safety in the Interior of the United States (http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2017/images/01/28/enhancing.public.safety.in.the.interior.of.the.united.states.pdf) -- January 25
- Expediting Environmental Reviews and Approvals for High Priority Infrastructure Projects (http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2017/images/01/28/expediting.environmental.reviews.and.approvals.for.high.priority.infrastructure.projects.pdf) -- January 24
- Minimizing the Economic Burden of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act Pending Repeal (http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2017/images/01/28/minimizing.the.economic.burden.of.the.patient.protection.and.affordable.care.act.pending.repeal.pdf) -- January 20
Compare any of Obama's Executive orders with any of Trump's, the contrast is stark. For instance Obama's Executive order on Ensuring Lawful Interrogation didn't immediately close CIA black sites leaving dazed and disheveled detainees wandering countrysides across the world. Nor did Obam's Review and Disposition of Individuals Detained at the Guantanamo Bay Naval Base and Close of Detention Facilities suddenly result in hundreds of the worst of worst left to wander a beach in Cuba. Obama's Executive Orders signaled a direction and started a process. As opposed to Trump's Border Security and Immigration Enforcement Improvements Executive Order which has caused confusion throughout the US departments tasked with boarder security and it has stranded thousands of people across the world that have planted their roots in the US. Trump's order is causing chaos in the lives of US permanent residents. What is a permanent resident? This post from National Review the Corner (http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/444372/trumps-executive-order-covers-green-cards-why) explains it well:
Green card holders are not citizens — depending on the card and how it was obtained, that honor comes three or five years later. But they’re not bog-standard visa-holders either. Unlike, say, H1B-carriers, permanent residents are expected to live in America by default, and are in fact penalized if they don’t. By law and by expectation, this country is their home; their base; the ground in which their roots are planted. Because of this, permanent residents are able to purchase, own, and carry firearms; they are required to register with the selective service; and they are treated for tax and welfare purposes as are U.S. citizens. They can’t vote or serve on a jury, but, other than, they effectively enjoy all the liberties that natural born Americans enjoy. When they re-enter the country, the agent says “Welcome Home,” which is a big change from their visa days. They are not Americans, and they mustn’t pretend to be. But they are as close as one can get without being one.
Why are there protests right now? As opposed to the "honeymoon" every other President's received in their first week (or month(s))? The protests are a response to the Imperious orders of the Trump administration that has left friends and neighbors, Colleagues and Classmates stranded across the world. There are protests right now because people legally in the US, people who have made a decision to make their lives here in the US have had their freedom to travel taken away from them capriciously and without, it seems, any regard for the consequences. It is the difference between demanding an immediate outcome (Trump) and beginning a deliberative process that will chart a new direction (every other President).
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^^^^^^this^^^^^^^
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The "snowflakes" are the ones who whimper that Trump should be given a "chance"
This is not a comment on Trump, but vocabulary and terminology.
"Snowflake" is a term used for people who will melt if their sensitivities are offended. It was created to describe people who need a "trigger warning" before reading Huck Finn in class because the text uses the word "nigger"; those who need a safe space with puppies and teddie bears if their favored candidate does not win an election; who so fear disagreeing opinion that they demand speakers be disinvited or threaten violence is speakers they disagree with are allowed to speak on campus; who need a participation trophy even if they do not do well; etc.
So, I suppose a Trump supporter would rightfully be called a snowflake of (s)he needed a "trigger warning" before progressive dogma could be discussed in his/her presence, or if (s)he demanded a liberal thinker be banned from a public forum.
But, "snowflake" does not apply to any of the behavior you cited by Trumpians.
Now, does anyone know if the Cabot Arms Trump 45 (http://www.range365.com/trump-45-from-cabot-guns) is real or a photoshop job, and if the finish is really gold or if it's high polish physical vapor deposition Titanium Nitride?
"Snowflake" now is used for Trumpians who melt away when their hero causes world condemnation and chaos.
That said, I know what "snowflake" means. I'm just using the same "melting" analogy to mean something different. :thumbup;
Why are we so afraid of Syrian refugees? They are fleeing the very same terrorists that we fear so much. We are banning people from countries whose citizens have NOT ONCE killed an American on US soil. But letting in Saudis is OK. Why do you think THAT is? They're responsible for 9/11, for goodness sake.
We're just all frightened little snowflakes, so tender, so delicate, so vewy vewy afwaid.
That's what happens when Steve Bannon and Reince Priebus are put on the NSC to the exclusion of two other experienced people. That's just incredible. Just absolutely incredible.
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"Snowflake" now is used for Trumpians who melt away when their hero causes world condemnation and chaos.
That said, I know what "snowflake" means. I'm just using the same "melting" analogy to mean something different. :thumbup;
The term was coined due to the need for "trigger warnings", "safe spaces", etc. Do Trumpians require any of those things to protect them from melting?
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Do Trumpians require any of those things to protect them from melting?
I don't know about "melting," but Trumpian snowflakes seem to be a lot better at dishing out insults and attacks than they are at receiving them with grace. Such delicate flowers :sarcasm; er snowflakes.
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Simon Dog, I readily admit that the whole "trigger warnings" and "safe place" phenomenon (I've heard of these concepts but never actually witnessed them) are daft. I have heard of instances where university students demanded the withdrawal of a speaker with whom they did not agree. Universities are for learning and for being exposed to new ideas. So, I grant you that.
But now I am wondering who new snowflakes are.
I have to tell you that when I heard that Trump is banning the entry of Syrian refugees, my heart broke. Those people have been through things that you and I could never imagine. Trump is all for bombing the hell out of that country but doesn't have one ounce of Christian compassion for the victims of terror. Instead, he is succeeding in scaring too many Americans; his fear mongering is working, so who are the snowflakes now?
Why are we no longer the "home of the brave". It disgusts me, it truly does. We think of our nation as being exceptional. Trump PROMISED us that he alone would and could restore the respect of nations. But there have been WORLDWIDE protests against him. He has made this country look like the Land of Tyrants, and I am deeply ashamed. Banning terrified refugees does NOT "MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN", and it certainly does not make "AMERICA FIRST".
Trump thinks we are all "snowflakes", running around trying to find "safe places" to hide from war-shocked and victimized refugee famiies from Syria.
But Trump is wrong. We are NOT all snowflakes.
http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2017/01/27/511795672/syria-supper-club-reaching-out-to-refugees-one-dinner-at-a-time
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This is a "Temporary" ban on those 7 countries because they were already approved by Congress under Obama. I think Saudi Arabia is on the next list. the order targets people from countries originally listed by the Obama administration as terrorist hotbeds -- Iraq, Syria, Iran, Sudan, Libya, Somalia and Yemen.
325,000 in a 24 hour period were let in our country. 109 were detained? What is wrong with that? How do these people who are protesting even know to go to the airports to protest and have time to make all these signs? They are paid and this was planned long before.
This is going to be a long 8 years.
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This whole refugee ban thing seems to have been poorly thought out with no analysis of unintended consequences, with a lot of people already cleared getting shafted.
On the other hand, I suggest a mathematical exercise:
Using historical data:
Estimate p(m) - Probability a Muslim male in the US between ages of 20 and 40 will commit a terrorist act
Estimate p(n) - Probablity a non-Muslim make in the US between ages of 20 and 40 will commit a terrorist act
Calculate R=p(m)/p(n). Observe if it is significantly > 1.
Apply a student-T test to both datasets to determine the statistical significance of any difference between p(m) and p(n).
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It only takes 1.
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It may not last 8 years, the tariff trump is calling for would effect Americans more than Mexicans those tariff will raise prices in the US until the manufacturing is returned to the Us. Plus if the Mexicans do what most often happens in this case they will put a dollar for dollar tariff on American products being sold in Mexico. currently 40 % of Mexicans imports come from the USThis would shift Mexican imports to come from non taiffed places like Europe or china. Economists estimate 6 million jobs are involved in the trade with Mexico. Finally if you price Mexico out of the market the jobs will return to America but most of them will go to manufacturing robots. There is reason to panic, if this moronic action continues the out come may be worse then the last Great Recession.
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It only takes 1.
Did anyone else see the picture of the little girl in handcuffs at an airport? She looked to be about 5 years old. She must've been the one, right?
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Many dialysis products (solutions, line sets, etc. ) are made in Mexico. Definitely room for an unintended consequence here.
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I believe we can all agree to the fact that 'War is Hell'. No doubt about that.
Religious War, even worse.
When you have two or more factions each declaring 'My God is Greater than Your God'. It gets downright ugly, FAST.
Add to that the mid-set that there is no greater glory than to die for your God, and the violence escalates extremely rapidly. With no Fear of Death, some of these people are willing, eager even, to sacrifice themselves in attempt to kill whom ever they perceive as the enemy.
Granted again that only a percentage of any Religion is so Radicalized as to be willing to commit suicide.
The question is, "How do you determine exactly WHO those persons are?"
Faced with mass migration, how do you vet with 100% accuracy all of these people?
This is going to take much serious study, planning, before implementation.
Are YOU willing to adopt some of these people, have them live in YOUR home, prior to this Vetting?
If not you, then Who?
I have to admit that I do not have the answers, but I believe I do have a handle on the question. I just wish I had an answer.
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People get misled by numbers, citing "we have home grown terrorists too" (think McVeigh). Think of it by example:
Pneumonia kills far more people than Ebola, so one could call that the "more dangerous disease". That being said, consider which would pose a greater threat - a plane load of persons suffering from pneumonia arriving at a busy airport or a plane load of Ebola carriers.
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Ebola... :waiting;
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Ebola... :waiting;
Ricoloa.....
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During WW II on the west coast the US government confiscated all of the assets of Japanese Americans and locked them up in Concetration camps. This was done to protect real Americans from those Jap spy's and Saboteurs. Funny though in Hawaii with a larger Japanese American population during the war there was no sabotage and after the war it was discovered that the only espionage in Hawaii was done by the Japanese diplomats assigned to the Councilate.
This is one of the most shameful acts in American History. What Trump is doing against Moslems is the same thing. The American Moslem Community is the best defense we have against terrorism., alienate them and we become much less safe.
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, Trump should not make it to the summer at this rate !! When are the Washington Congressmen going to stand up to him ?? Oh, that's right , they don't want to get "fired " by Trump. They are so scared of that bully its pathetic .
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The question is, "How do you determine exactly WHO those persons are?"
Faced with mass migration, how do you vet with 100% accuracy all of these people?
This is going to take much serious study, planning, before implementation.
Are YOU willing to adopt some of these people, have them live in YOUR home, prior to this Vetting?
If not you, then Who?
I have to admit that I do not have the answers, but I believe I do have a handle on the question. I just wish I had an answer.
There is no "mass migration" of Muslims into the US.
Anyone can google "vetting process for Syrian refugees" and can read how onerous it already is. "Extreme vetting" is already here. This administration has not outlined what their new turbo-extreme measures will be. No one knows what the hell is going on.
No, I would not be willing to let in ANY refugee into my home without some vetting, but if a refugee family from Syria is already here, that means they've not only already been extremely vetted but that actually will continue to be vetted, at least for the first year that they are here, so yes, I would certainly allow that family into my home. It would be the American thing to do!
I'm not sure what the "question" is. Is it "what do we do to combat terrorism on our own soil?" The answer to that question is NOT to ban all Syrian refugee families for an undetermined period of time.
THIS is not the answer:
http://www.theindianalawyer.com/syrian-family-denied-entry-sues-trump-administration/PARAMS/article/42659
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What Trump is doing against Moslems is the same thing. The American Moslem Community is the best defense we have against terrorism., alienate them and we become much less safe.
While the merits of the Trump action are debatable (I think it was not well thought out and should have been more limited in scope), it is NOT the same thing. In the case of the Japanese interment, US Citizens were deprived of their freedom and property. Nothing in Trumps orders restricts the ability of US Citizens, naturalized or natural born, of any religion, to travel freely or live wherever they want.
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Simon Dog, you are correct. It's NOT the same thing.
However, saying that it was not well thought out is a pretty vast understatement, don't ya think? I mean, no one in security or immigration were notified, and airline/airport officials overseas were caught completely off guard. No one knew whether or not to allow this person or that family on to an airplane bound for the US. Even Republican leaders were not notified; some of their staff secretly helped draft the EO but had to sign a confidentiality clause so that their bosses wouldn't know.
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/trump-immigration-congress-order-234392
I kept hearing both here on IHD and in the media that liberals were taking Trump literally but not seriously and that his supporters were taking him seriously but not literally. Perhaps we should all have taking him both literally AND seriously.
I keep coming back to my original question that I have asked on three different discussion threads, and that is, "What can you all tell me that will ease my fears about having a Trump administration?". No one has answered, which is in and of itself a very pointed and illustrative reply.
Trump supporters were often quoted as wanting Trump to 'blow up everything so that we can start over". Many claimed they were excited by the entertainment value of chaos. Chaos is what we have now. There is no discussion about economic policy. All of this noise about banning people from countries that have never killed anyone here on US soil hasn't yet brought any new jobs.
Is there anyone here who thinks that having Steve Bannon in the White House is a good thing for our nation? If yes, why? What does he add?
Before the election, I said that I was not fearful only of Trump but also of who he will put in positions of power. Witness Steve Bannon. Remember, he's a big Goldman Sachs guy. Great for "the forgotten people".
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It only takes 1.
As in only one Canadian Trump supporter?
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I do think that constantly being online and watching TV is not healthy. I'm not a TV watcher but from twitter I followed the protests on Saturday and Sunday. Unfortunately I don't think we can ignore the major upheaval happening in our country. If we ignore it we run the risk of being complicit in something bad.
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Very well said Charlie, I couldn't agree more with you. The massive collective hysteria that now exists over every word or deed by the new President Trump is beyond any measure of rational or sane. So far, he is working very hard to deliver on the promises he has made & he is working very hard towards this.
Does a King rule your little mystery country? Methinks you do not remembereth the protestations wrought by Congress over the Obama Presidential Executive Orders. Why doth Congress not protest now? Dost thou not know, oh fair maiden of a far and distant land?
My apologies, Athena, for this snarky post of mine. I'd delete it, but I don't think that's allowed on IHD, so I'll publically apologize, instead.
I'm just really worried. When Bush was elected, I was living in the UK, and the Brits were furious. You would be astonished to know how often I was stopped and either quizzed or admonished by people when they heard my American accent. The anti-American sentiment at that time was very unsettling for me. I'd never lived in the US under a Bush administration, and I was dealing with CKD and an autistic child, so many of his deeds went relatively unnoticed by me.
Trump is just so different from anything we've ever seen before, and many people are worried, afraid or just simply confused. I'm one of those. I can't find anyone, not one single person, who offers me any reassurance, and I am just scared. I know that might sound stupid to you, but living here in the US at this moment in time is sorta creepy.
So, I apologize for taking my fears out on you. I've gone back and looked at your posts from when you first joined, and it made me remember that we renal patients are all in this together. I'm sure my country will survive, but I'm just not sure in what kind of shape it will be in.
:cuddle;
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Whiners are going to Whine no matter what Trump says or does. spoiled brats that didn't get their way and expect to fit a fit until they do. It isn't going to work. They may have gotten away with type of behavior with their Parents that didn't bother to teach these Children to Respect others, to learn to be a part of a Team, to get off their collective Butts and get out and Vote. Parading in the street is not the way to promote change anywhere except to disrupt society enough to get the attention of the Police to come in and restore Law and Order. Idiots.
No matter what the Trump Administration does, the Sun will still come up tomorrow. There may be clouds blocking the light, like in Seattle, but People will still get up and go to whatever jobs they have, do an honest day's work, and go home to their Families. Because that is what Honest People do.
We don't have the time to Parade in the street protesting, leaving a huge mess for the sanitation department to come clean up afterwards, as spoiled children do.
We Work. We pay our Bills. We save what we can. We Plan ahead. When Election Day comes we get to the Polls and VOTE. And when the Polls close we live with our choices and go on. We do NOT protest and complain that the results 'should have been' anything else other than what they are.
Stop bitching, get over it, get on with your life. Start planing on what YOU can do to better yourself. What can YOU do to better you community? Your Country?
How can you even begin to think all those Career Politicians that have drug this Country down will actually do anything to improve the Country? All they care about is how much taxes they can funnel into their Bank accounts. They do not care one bit about the People.
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However, saying that it was not well thought out is a pretty vast understatement, don't ya think?
Smooth understatement is part of my suave style.
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Parading in the street is not the way to promote change anywhere except to disrupt society enough to get the attention of the Police to come in and restore Law and Order. Idiots.
People who paraded in the street to promote the right of women to vote or who paraded during the Civil Rights movement would disagree vehemently with this statement.
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I don't think it's whining to point out that Drumph the Idiot is as crazy as a loon. Every 8 years a wave of moronic voters vote in a republican president who precedes to destroy the economy. Each of thes administrations leave the economy in a smoldering ruin. It happened in 90-92, and 2007-2008. This time it appears to be worse. In 2003 when bush the lesser invaded Iraq I stated the invasion was going to be a unmitigated disaster I as loudly accused of whining and of being unpatriotic by my coworkers. Turned out I was not whining but merely right. One more time the right is in charge and the economy and our allies are in danger so are American beliefs.
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Whiners are going to Whine no matter what Trump says or does. spoiled brats that didn't get their way and expect to fit a fit until they do.
I hope you will at least admit that many people spent 8 years winning about Obama. If so I will admit that I found everyone's fears of Obama unfounded.
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Parading in the street is not the way to promote change anywhere except to disrupt society enough to get the attention of the Police to come in and restore Law and Order. Idiots.
People who paraded in the street to promote the right of women to vote or who paraded during the Civil Rights movement would disagree vehemently with this statement.
That I recall, these People did NOT physically attack and harm anyone. Nor did they leave a trail of trash and destruction in their wake.
They held Peaceful, Orderly Protest to garner News reports, exposure to promote their cause.
HUGE difference.
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That I recall, these People did NOT physically attack and harm anyone. Nor did they leave a trail of trash and destruction in their wake.
They held Peaceful, Orderly Protest to garner News reports, exposure to promote their cause.
HUGE difference.
As you "recall"??? What, were you there?
Where have you seen wholescale violence at any current rally? Yes, there were people at first who were breaking windows, etc, but people who do that are not interested in any real cause. They organize, mask up and then create chaos. There's always someone like that. So, I'm not sure what you mean.
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Violence do you mean like the moron who believed Hilary was involved in a child prostitution ring in Washington. This moron brought a AR-15 Ns shot up a pizzeria, it was a miracle that no one was shot or injured.
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It is amazing how 5 minutes after the Supreme Court announcement there were Professional Signs out protesting. How did thousands of protesters appear at the airport with pre-made signs? Is it that liberals have some sort of Amber Alert system. Are they paid? How do they get word. I have to give them that. These idiots are organized. Where do they poop? Diapers!!!
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It is amazing how 5 minutes after the Supreme Court announcement there were Professional Signs out protesting. How did thousands of protesters appear at the airport with pre-made signs? Is it that liberals have some sort of Amber Alert system. Are they paid? How do they get word. I have to give them that. These idiots are organized. Where do they poop? Diapers!!!
For days it was reported exactly when the announcement would be made. There was a countdown on CNN and MSNBC all day yesterday, for goodness sake! Not only that, but since last year there was a list of possible nominees, and Trump PROMISED that his pick would be one of these 21 people. Then two days ago, we learned that the list would be whittled down to the two that the media reported on.
So, protesters had plenty of notice where and when the announcement would be made AND who the nominee would probably be.
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Whiners are going to Whine no matter what Trump says or does. spoiled brats that didn't get their way and expect to fit a fit until they do.
I hope you will at least admit that many people spent 8 years winning about Obama. If so I will admit that I found everyone's fears of Obama unfounded.
Mitch McConnell was the ultimate whiner. Eight years of whining.
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It is amazing how 5 minutes after the Supreme Court announcement there were Professional Signs out protesting. How did thousands of protesters appear at the airport with pre-made signs? Is it that liberals have some sort of Amber Alert system. Are they paid? How do they get word. I have to give them that. These idiots are organized. Where do they poop? Diapers!!!
And they are not environmentally friendly. They leave a lot trash and human waster. The language on their protest signs isn't clean either.
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Hopefully all of those posters were recycled.
I'm not sure what the issue is with "human waste". Was there some problem in this regard?
It's true that there were posters that had not very nice language on them. But one could say the same about the posters held by many Tea Party advocates when they protested. This isn't really the issue.
After what happened with Merrick Garland (or, rather, didn't happen), no wonder there are protests. Part of me just wants to get on with it and do a proper vetting of the new SCOTUS nominee, but part of me wants revenge on Mitch McConnell and make the SCOTUS remain with only 8 members for as long as possible. It was truly shameful what he did, and it provokes plenty of bad language! LOL!
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Yep the right is nonviolent well except for blowing up planned parenthood clinics and occasionally shooting doctors. Violence by either side is wrong. Condemning one side when the side you favor engages in equal or worse violence is the height of hypocrisy.
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Yep the right is nonviolent well except for blowing up planned parenthood clinics and occasionally shooting doctors. Violence by either side is wrong. Condemning one side when the side you favor engages in equal or worse violence is the height of hypocrisy.
It is a question of statistics.
The right has a few who have done extreme things.
The left has many who have done uncool things, but not as extreme as the few on the right.
This is sort of like comparing the propensity for terrorism between Muslims and Non-Muslims. Citing Timmothy McVeah as an example of a non-Muslim who was a terrorist is not sufficient to prove that non-Muslims are as likely to be terrorists that Muslims.
After what happened with Merrick Garland (or, rather, didn't happen), no wonder there are protests
Politics is about power, and winning. Both sides play the game to win and there is no reason to think the D's would have approved a pick who went against their core values if the roles were reversed. Can you name a time either party voted against the best interest of maintaining and increasing its power? I can't.
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And that's why people hate politicians because they perceive it's all about power and winning instead of it being all about the good of the nation. I'm not sure how Merrick Garland would have necessarily maintained and increased the power of the Democrats. The protests are not about Trump's nominee, rather, they are about the fact that McConnell refused to act on the nomination of a sitting and twice duly elected President.
It would be nice if it all really WAS about statistics, but it is really about "feelings". How often have we heard that people "felt" forgotten or "felt" like they weren't being heard? Trump made Americans "feel" terrified of a cohort of people (Syrian refugees) who have never killed an American on US soil. Statistics are out there, but statistics don't matter. It's only "feelings" and "perceptions" and "fears" and "concerns" that matter.
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Wow, you are so close in age to me. I was 9 then too.
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And now the Aussies hate us.
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It is amazing how 5 minutes after the Supreme Court announcement there were Professional Signs out protesting. How did thousands of protesters appear at the airport with pre-made signs? Is it that liberals have some sort of Amber Alert system. Are they paid? How do they get word. I have to give them that. These idiots are organized.
Social media. Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, ... Information travels at the click of a mouse. There's no payment. A few more marches are planned, and I suppose impromptu marches as needed. I went to the Women's March and plan to attend another's when I can.
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I'm not sure how Merrick Garland would have necessarily maintained and increased the power of the Democrats.
Not the "power of the democrats", but shaping law in the mold of progressive liberal interpretation of the constitution rather than the original intent (literalist) form preferred by the Rs.
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And now the Aussies hate us.
Because they want to give us the Refugees that don't pass their Mustard....... Sure, you don't want them ... Obama will take them and save them from the Muslims that hate them from the country they come from. Trump put an end to that BS.
Keep America Safe Again.
How will Starbuck's handle it when they have 10,000 employees that have to stop and pray 3 times a day?
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Your right the progressive justices brought civil rights, Miranda rights, voter rights, integration, just to name a few. You may wish for a life lived with blacks at the back of the bus police with absolute power, and other relics of the bad old days. Personally I think a open and free civilization is better not neater but better.
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And now the Aussies hate us.
Because they want to give us the Refugees that don't pass their Mustard....... Sure, you don't want them ... Obama will take them and save them from the Muslims that hate them from the country they come from. Trump put an end to that BS.
Keep America Safe Again.
How will Starbuck's handle it when they have 10,000 employees that have to stop and pray 3 times a day?
Donald Trump was sane, rational and absolutely correct to tell the Aussies where they can go with their dangerous illegal immigrants who are not fit to set foot on Australian soil! Not just because it keeps America safe but it will also keep Australia safe (which they need to be reminded of). Once word gets out that anyone can get on a boat to Australia to eventually end up in the US, guess what's going to happen next? They're coming.
The problem is that this deal is still being negotiated. This dirty swap deal was made between the present devious Australian PM and Obama. Trump is under immense pressure right now and I very much hope this deal doesn't get off the ground. I pray for the intestinal fortitude of the Orange One.
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Agree with Alta. :thumbup;
Progressive is not a good thing. You hold it up like the Savoir. Progressives say Trump is going back 50 years and they want to go forward not back.... What the hell more forward can you go?
Same sex marriage is the law of the land. Abortion including late term Abortion is the law of the land... What the hell is forward from this.... Pedophiles can marry children? After all they are born that way and can't help it? You can marry your dog because you love her? Your horse likes a good ride? You are so evil you are blinded about what is moral and what is because it is just your right and you want it. Maybe have it that you can kill your baby up to 1 year of age just in case you don't want a girl? WHAT is "going forward". Open borders so people can just wander the Earth and pilferage?
What is going forward for a Progressive..... No organized religion?
:rant;
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Same sex marriage was not a expansion of the law it is inherent in the 14 Admendment to the constitution that requires the law to grant equal rights and privileges to all Americans. This is known as the equal protection clause. Gays are required to have the same rights as any other American. The Right confuses the concept of legal marriage with the religious concept of marriage, a church is allowed to say man and women for a marriage, but the state must treat all the same. This is not expanding the law but applying the 14th admendment as it was created just after the CivilWar. Most of the rights complaint are based on the courts applying the 14th admendment protection to actions of the state.
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Most of the rights complaint are based on the courts applying the 14th admendment protection to actions of the state.
The term is "incorporation".
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Finally religious reasons for legal arguments lead to a theocracy. The basic problem is what if my beliefs don't happen to suit you, or if yours don't suit me. Besides being a religious action marriage is also a legal action. Allowing churches to establish the rules for all to follow is as bad as allowing the government to set policy and laws for a religion.
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Hope everyone that voted for Trump is now happy. ,🤴He is now King 👑 of the USA!
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Finally religious reasons for legal arguments lead to a theocracy. The basic problem is what if my beliefs don't happen to suit you, or if yours don't suit me. Besides being a religious action marriage is also a legal action. Allowing churches to establish the rules for all to follow is as bad as allowing the government to set policy and laws for a religion.
So if no one's beliefs, in particular the common collective beliefs ingrained in the Judeo-Christian beliefs that underpins our political-legal system and social system is right then whose minority group's views do we adopt for the entire country? I nominate the transgender community as having the best beliefs! It's wrong to regard one's gender as anything but being as fluid as water - they've hit the bulls eye! They're right - we're all wrong. :sarcasm;
So let's rip everything apart to make it fit for all the morally smug minority groups around. If most of us start feeling alienated and weird, as if we don't belong in our own country, then it MUST be because we are racists, Islamaphobes, misogynistic, & any one of a string of other phobic or ism terms doing the rounds.
I'm truly sick of this dysfunctional 'post-truth' great leftist propaganda war that's being waged on us. You only have to go online or read a newspaper to be immediately sucked into this.
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"Snowflake" now is used for Trumpians who melt away when their hero causes world condemnation and chaos.
That said, I know what "snowflake" means. I'm just using the same "melting" analogy to mean something different. :thumbup;
The term was coined due to the need for "trigger warnings", "safe spaces", etc. Do Trumpians require any of those things to protect them from melting?
Simon, you are correct to describe the Liberal Progressives (often young people) as SnowFlakes. For many years now, the Snowflake movement has been gathering strength and wrecking havoc at all universities, colleges and schools. To just be a normal person with traditional conservative views that one's parents and grandparents held, is to be immediately placed in a reviled bigot category. I feel for all the young people who are forced to survive and adapt to the new Snowflake world of endless emotional reactivity, inane childish prattle and temper tantrums. I'm truly scared for the intelligent young people who are needing to survive in Snowflake dominated environments and just want to finish their degrees with their sanity intact.
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Every group has its wacko fringe, the Republicans have thier tea party and the democrats have their PC fanatics. The difference is the democrats generally nominate a centrist bot one of their wacko members. I don't think durumph the Idiot speaks the truth, he speaks the alternate facts (trump speak for lies). The proof is his abysmal poll numbers he has historically low polls, at this point in his first term Obama had a 86 % approval. Trump in multiple polls is at 36%.
You may try to blame every thing on the democrats. But when the economy collapsed in 90-92 from the bizarre econmic policy of the Reagan-Bush years it was a Democrat who rebuilt it from 92-00. We then had a republican bush who after 8 years had created a economic mess again and Obama rebuilt the economy again now trump is follow the regan-bush economic playbook and every one of his supporters believe it will be great. Insanity is doing the same over and over and always thinking the results will work out this time.
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Trump is clearly the most divisive President in modern US history. He has done nothing to show his intentions to reunite this nation as he promised he'd do. There are widespread protests around the country and the world for a reason. Trump has managed to divide even the Vatican/Catholic leadership!
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/05/us-cardinal-raymond-burke-stokes-papal-tensions-by-meeting-nationalist-in-rome
Every day there is news of continued chaos. It's all due to Steve Bannon. He's the master manipulator and the villain of the piece. Too many people are focused on Trump when we should all be looking at Steve Bannon as the true malignancy in the White House.
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Trump is clearly the most divisive President in modern US history. He has done nothing to show his intentions to reunite this nation as he promised he'd do. There are widespread protests around the country and the world for a reason. Trump has managed to divide even the Vatican/Catholic leadership!
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/05/us-cardinal-raymond-burke-stokes-papal-tensions-by-meeting-nationalist-in-rome
Every day there is news of continued chaos. It's all due to Steve Bannon. He's the master manipulator and the villain of the piece. Too many people are focused on Trump when we should all be looking at Steve Bannon as the true malignancy in the White House.
Well spotted MooseMom : It looks like as if we have here The Showman and the Master Manipulator... I wish we could know what is on their mind?
sp mod Cas
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Trump is such a narcissist that if he begins to think that Bannon is getting more attention as the puppet master, Bannon will be "fired."
:rofl;
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A Facebook posting really ticked me off. Fearmongering about how Trump is going to be the cause of America going Bankrupt as have many of his business ventures.
This Country is Bankrupt already with TRILLIONS of debt. And Trump didn't have a thing to do with it. This was caused by CONGRESS constantly over-spending for the last 30+ years. Put the blame where it belongs, Congress. Career Politicians spending more time and money on getting re-elected and staying in that seat, bleeding the taxpayers for every dime possible. And becoming Multi-Millionaires in the process. Most of them never had much until elected. But check their accounts now.
Get rid of all the Career Politicians.
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The MA politburo just voted itself a 40% raise. Because of our largely one party system, it is assured that no Democratic incumbent will lost re-election over this.
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Washington State Judge.....
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
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The MA politburo just voted itself a 40% raise. Because of our largely one party system, it is assured that no Democratic incumbent will lost re-election over this.
Yep, this is a problem not only in MA but in all of the red states that are gerrymandered. Something really has to change here, but none of the politicians seem to have the will to do anything.
Since you are a one issue voter, what do you think about this development?
http://www.npr.org/2017/02/02/513126985/house-votes-to-overturn-obama-rule-restricting-gun-sales-to-mentally-ill
Do you think this is what most gun owners want to see?
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A Facebook posting really ticked me off. Fearmongering about how Trump is going to be the cause of America going Bankrupt as have many of his business ventures.
This Country is Bankrupt already with TRILLIONS of debt. And Trump didn't have a thing to do with it. This was caused by CONGRESS constantly over-spending for the last 30+ years. Put the blame where it belongs, Congress. Career Politicians spending more time and money on getting re-elected and staying in that seat, bleeding the taxpayers for every dime possible. And becoming Multi-Millionaires in the process. Most of them never had much until elected. But check their accounts now.
Get rid of all the Career Politicians.
I can't really disagree, but at what point does a politician become a "career politician"? People VOTE for these guys. The blame is with the people who vote for them.
ALL politicians spend more time and money on getting re-elected because that's what their party leaders demand of them. I've heard MANY congresspeople complain about this very thing. They have to show their party leaders how much time they spend on the phone trawling for funds. It's a disgrace, but I don't know how we get money out of politics.
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Washington State Judge.....
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not my Judge
Not Your Constitution
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So Trump is not your President when elected fair and square. You better take a look at the Constitution.
Now people are scrambling to get to America and no time to screen. Nice job Judge.
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Now people are scrambling to get to America and no time to screen.
This is an alternative fact.
Does Donald Trump make you feel proud to be American? He is THE President, but no, he is NOT my president. Since I did not vote for him, he has to earn my trust and my respect. He has not done anything to make me feel either trustful or respectful. He lies and shows disrespect for anyone he perceived has criticized him. Why should I consider him to be MY president when more people voted for someone else?
Why do you think he has been the butt of so many jokes and the object of so much criticism and protest around the world? Why do you think that the speaker of the UK parliament has stated publically that he will do what he can to avoid him being given the honor of speaking to that body? Why do you think Angela Merkel thinks he behaves like a child? Why do our NATO allies distrust him? Why do you think he has historically low approval ratings for a "new" president? What is it that you see that everyone else is missing?
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The judge, a republican, is doing his job. Contrary to the Donald's assumption that he was elected King, he is the President in a system of checks and balances. Trump has been checked and seems to have lost his balance.
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We only have ONE President. Duly Elected, and Sworn into the Office.
He is OUR President. Unless you are an illegal in this Country, Trump IS Your President also.
Like it or not, Trump is President. And as decent Citizens we need to give him a chance to run the Country. Keeping in mind we have an established system to deal with complaints. Processes long established through the Courts.
Parading in the streets like a bunch of spoiled brats doesn't accomplish much but disturb the rest of the public that is busy conducting business or whatever else they may be doing.
You Spoiled Brats do NOT have the Right to interrupt anyone else's day, impede traffic, litter the streets with your discarded banners and signs.
Go back to your jobs and families, leave everyone else alone.
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So Trump is not your President when elected fair and square.
You have an odd definition of "fair and square." How fair is it when Putin manipulates our election? How square is it when FBI Comey commits the Hatch Act and influences an election within 11 days of it. This election was NOT fair nor square nor credible. Furthermore, for all practical purposes our new "President" is really Steve Bannon, a self-described Leninist to likes to blow things up. He has just installed himself in the security council by not briefing Trump about what he was signing when he shuffled the members of this elite group in the executive order (that Bannon wrote). Trump is just a figurehead and frontman. Steve Bannon is for sure not my president.
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I intend to show Drumph the Idiot the same respect he showed our last president, that is none. Yes he is the president but he also is a tertiary sypholitic idiot.
I was not fond of Bush jr. But he was president and he showed respect to the president who he followed. From almost the day Obama took office Drumph questioned the legality of his election. So now it's his turn to take the abuse. Remember Drumph took office with a 36 percent approval rating.
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Why do you think he has been the butt of so many jokes and the object of so much criticism and protest around the world? Why do you think that the speaker of the UK parliament has stated publically that he will do what he can to avoid him being given the honor of speaking to that body?
John Bercow (The Speaker of the House of Commons UK has made me so proud. :thumbup;
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Cass, I saw him on the telly this morning. He was most adamant!
Can you imagine how the Queen is going to feel having to host a state dinner for him? Can you imagine what he is going to say in his speech to the Queen? He'll probably claim that the size of the crowd at his inauguration was bigger than the crowds of people who attended her Jubilee. LOL! I can't wait.
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e has just installed himself in the security council by not briefing Trump about what he was signing when he shuffled the members of this elite group in the executive order (that Bannon wrote).
Reminds me of the Hogans Heros episode where Hogan would slip a blank sheet of paper in the pile of stuff Klink had to sign.
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MM why don't you start HIGH and then go LOW? He has been in office 3 weeks. You hated him so you did not vote for him and keep having your tantrum like the new stepfather just moved in with your Mom or something.
Obama was voted in. He did not get my vote. But I gave him a chance. He blew it. But, was still my president...The reason he was NOT the butt of any jokes was because the person saying it would be called a Racist (Unless also black) If we called him the half black one. OMG. Yet The Orange one is hilarious. Really? If we on the right say anything about anything we are RACIST. It is thrown around so much I don't even considerate it an insult. I guess half the nation is raciest. Oh well. We have a different definition than the left on that word.
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The judge, a republican, is doing his job. Contrary to the Donald's assumption that he was elected King, he is the President in a system of checks and balances. Trump has been checked and seems to have lost his balance.
The Judge.... was appointed by Patty Murray (D)
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So Trump is not your President when elected fair and square.
You have an odd definition of "fair and square." How fair is it when Putin manipulates our election? How square is it when FBI Comey commits the Hatch Act and influences an election within 11 days of it. This election was NOT fair nor square nor credible. Furthermore, for all practical purposes our new "President" is really Steve Bannon, a self-described Leninist to likes to blow things up. He has just installed himself in the security council by not briefing Trump about what he was signing when he shuffled the members of this elite group in the executive order (that Bannon wrote). Trump is just a figurehead and frontman. Steve Bannon is for sure not my president.
Don't cry and scream and stomp your feet and carry your sign. VOTE next time.
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Judge Robart was appointed by George W. Bush by a vote of 99-1... He is a Republican. Patty Murray had nothing to do with it.
And what gives you the idea that I don't vote? I have been voting (in every election) since I turned 21 (some 54 years). So let's not make assumptions about other peoples' private behavior.
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MM why don't you start HIGH and then go LOW? He has been in office 3 weeks. You hated him so you did not vote for him and keep having your tantrum like the new stepfather just moved in with your Mom or something.
Obama was voted in. He did not get my vote. But I gave him a chance. He blew it. But, was still my president...The reason he was NOT the butt of any jokes was because the person saying it would be called a Racist (Unless also black) If we called him the half black one. OMG. Yet The Orange one is hilarious. Really? If we on the right say anything about anything we are RACIST. It is thrown around so much I don't even considerate it an insult. I guess half the nation is raciest. Oh well. We have a different definition than the left on that word.
I've hated Donald Trump from the beginning; I will freely admit that. He is the kind of alpha male that I detest. He is a manspreader extraordinaire. Not only have I always disliked his public persona, I've also never fundamentally believed that governing should follow the same rules as running a business. That's why I didn't vote for Mitt Romney.
That said, though, I DID post on this very board that I would give him a chance. You are free to spend your time looking for that post if you wish. But then he gave Steve Bannon power, and that was it for me. I didn't have to wait long for that chance that I gave him to be blown to smithereens.
I actually DID have a stepfather move in with my mother. I was grace personified. I had no reason not to be. He didn't act like a petulant child, nor did he diss our nation and our allies by kissing up to a killer like Putin.
Are you actually and seriously equating calling Trump "The Orange One" with ANY racial epithet aimed at Barack Obama? That's just bizarre.
But none of this really matters. What does matter is policy, and that's what we should be focused on. I am not sure how the confirmation of Betsy DeVos for Sec.of Education fulfills any promise made by Trump to destroy our public school system.
Rerun, do you really not have any concerns about anything that Trump has done over the past three weeks? Do his twitter outbursts not bother you? That he equates the US to Putin's regime? That he has a Goldman Sachs bod in the Treasury? That he has an Exxon guy as Secretary of State? Why do you not care about his ties with Russia?
What I find to be very telling is that the Trump supporters on this board have not been able to defend this man's policies and/or their implementation in any shape or form. While I think we all agree that we need to "Keep America Safe" and such, the way he is proposing to do that may very well be unconstitutional, but he didn't even stop to read The Constitution to find out. Instead, he just told his former lapdog Rudy to find a way to "make a Muslim ban" work.
Steve Bannon makes Cheney look like the Good Samaritan and Gandhi rolled into one.
I don't like being governed in such a chaotic manner, but this is how Bannon rolls. I think people are going to get tired of it sooner rather than later.
My tantrums are irrelevant. Trump's tantrums can start a war.
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KAS I'm glad you voted. You have a right to say something. Half of the protesters didn't.
Obama kept saying "don't boo Vote" Maybe next time. That is all I'm saying to the Lefty Snowflakes"
MM Yes, I trust him and everything he has done. That is why I voted for him. I did not vote for Hillary. That does not make me a sexist. I did not vote for Obama. I'm not a racist. I'm not a bully. Bullies make fun of people for the color of their skin and so I also call that racist. So, yes making fun of someone color of their skin is bad. I have tons of freckles. I've had all sorts of comments. But, you learn to ignore it.
Our public schools SUCK I use to volunteer in them. They are so Broken. We do need smaller charter schools run by the state not the national level. Our United States kids rank 23rd in the world. Just heard that. No wonder Google and Apple hire 60 percent from overseas. We are Dumb...
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Patty Murray is not the president federal judges are nominated by the president,G. W. Bush was the president.
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If we are snoflakes the conservatives are stone blocks that are persistent and ignorant.
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But that is not his natural skin color. That is no one's natural skin color. Same went for John Boehner. I suspect Boehner just drank too much. I think Trump has, at least in the past, used a sunbed or some sort of self tanning lotion or spray on tan. You can tell because the skin around his eyes is very white; that's indicative of the use of eye protectors. And that's the smart way to go.
Some sexists voted against Clinton because she was a woman. Some racists voted against Obama because of his color. But that does not mean that everyone who voted in that fashion is either sexist or racist.
If you voted for him because you truly believe he will bring back jobs that are probably gone forever, that's fair enough. I've always said that if he can help ALL Americans prosper economically, I'd be thrilled. I wish I had the confidence in him that you do, rerun. You know, I've asked at least three time for people to help me feel reassured, to give me some reason to believe that Trump is the man for the job and that he will work for ALL of us and won't piss off the world in the meantime.
I've stated many times that I am really worried, and I've asked for some soothing words and for someone to tell me why my fears are unfounded. But all I hear is blather and puffery and a good smattering of gloating. It worries me that even his supporters have nothing comforting to share with me.
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KAS I'm glad you voted. You have a right to say something. Half of the protesters didn't.
Who says that "half of the protesters didn't vote". Well, I guess perhaps that may be true if you count all of the people overseas that didn't voted because they couldn't, not being US citizens and all.
Our public schools SUCK I use to volunteer in them. They are so Broken. We do need smaller charter schools run by the state not the national level. Our United States kids rank 23rd in the world. Just heard that. No wonder Google and Apple hire 60 percent from overseas. We are Dumb...
And how is Betsy DeVos going to address this state of affairs? I mean, Trump DOES love "the poorly educated". He said so.
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You know, I've asked at least three time for people to help me feel reassured, to give me some reason to believe that Trump is the man for the job and that he will work for ALL of us and won't piss off the world in the meantime.
And in that time what has happened...?
i.e. Europe Must Defend Itself Against A Dangerous President
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/a-1133177-amp.html
It still would be interesting to know why people don't worry about his actions.
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Well, I guess perhaps that may be true if you count all of the people overseas that didn't voted because they couldn't, not being US citizens and all.
Overseas people not liking a US president that is going to treat US like a business trying to get the best deal for the US at the expense of other countries (which is how capitalism works, and what I expect them to do to us) does not bother me in the least.
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Oh man.... I had this long post and lost it because I didn't see ioLaire jumped in front.
Betsy got where she is today by not going to public school. Maybe she wants to help America down the Alternative road that leads to success and Americans Google and Apple can hire instead of just Uber... I like what I've seen in Charter Schools.
I like the way Donald is making deals already keeping jobs in America. Even if it is 800 at a time. I like that he wants to get the criminal undocumented (ILLEGAL) people back to their home. I like the way he wants to create a safe zone for Syrians to stay in there OWN country. I like that he calls these Islamic Extremists what they are. Obama could never do that. Again, this temporary travel ban is not on Muslims. Or Saudi Arabia and India would be on there.
His children are very grounded. At least the fist 3. The other 2 we can wait on.
He is not taking a paycheck for being President. He is giving this huge chunk of his life for us. To try and bring back jobs and some law and order and morals and value of life. He is 70 years and has learned a lot in his life and his views have changed as I'm sure happens as we grow older and see things.
I had more but am getting tired of typing.
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Trump is NOT a 'Career Politician'. He is NOT acting in the interest of any Political Party.
It is the Political Parties, BOTH, the Democrats and the Republicans, that have driven this Country so far in Debt. Congree spending money they do NOT have. Congress spending more time getting re-elected, than doing anything that may actually help the Country rather than help their Political Party.
We all need to vote out ALL of those Career Politicians. Replace them with anyone, businessman, farmer, laborer, anyone that has half a brain and sound common sense. Serve a term, make some improvements, balance the budget, and GET OUT. Set term limits.
SCREW Politics, copmpletely. Politics have done nothing good for our Country.
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We had a Democrat in MA who ran for Congress on a platform of "term limits" (Marty Meehan)
Once he reached the end of his term, he changed his mind about term limits, and since he is a Democrat in MA, easily won re-election.
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We had a Democrat in MA who ran for Congress on a platform of "term limits" (Marty Meehan)
Once he reached the end of his term, he changed his mind about term limits, and since he is a Democrat in MA, easily won re-election.
Oh man, that takes guts to be that dishonest. Go Figure~
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Most every Politician is that dishonest. Campaigning they will tell anything and everything they feel the Voters want simply in order to get those votes. Once elected they begin stalling, blaming the 'Other Political Party' for not allowing them to make any of those campaigned Promises.
They ALL Lie, that's what Politicians do. Why hasn't the voting public wised up to these frauds?
Because most simply don't bother to get out and vote, thinking it won't make any difference.
News flash, I would have to Google it to provide the quote, BUT... One 'Career Politician' in Congress was quoted as admitting "that if the vote made any difference we (meaning Congress) would make it illegal."
These people feel they are 'above' all of us mere taxpayers.
Like the Politburo, the Ruling Elite. They can do whatever they want.
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The United States of America is a democracy (at least, for now), and as such, the electorate must take responsibility for those we elect to represent us.
All congresspeople have to be elected and then re-elected if they choose to run again, and again it is the electorate that can vote as they please.
If a particular electorate likes their congressional representative enough to keep voting for that person for many years, then that is their right. If they no longer want that person to represent them, then they can vote him/her out.
We, the people, create "career politicians". It is pointless to rage against "career politicians" when it is their constituents that are to blame.
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Because most simply don't bother to get out and vote, thinking it won't make any difference.
Would you support a Constitutional amendment making it mandatory to vote?
Would you support making it easier to vote rather than making it harder as in what Texas tried to do with their voter ID law?
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Would you support making it easier to vote rather than making it harder as in what Texas tried to do with their voter ID law?
I would need to see a demographic analysis to see if it helped or hurt candidates representing my views. (there, I said what is really in the mind of every D and R when taking action on this issue). After all what matters in politics is winning, not playing fair. (as long as you don't get indicted)
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I would need to see a demographic analysis to see if it helped or hurt candidates representing my views. (there, I said what is really in the mind of every D and R when taking action on this issue). After all what matters in politics is winning, not playing fair. (as long as you don't get indicted)
It is this sentiment that creates a "politburo", "career politicians" and the "political elite". You reap what you sow.
It is also the "rules" that guide politics in third world countries.
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It is this sentiment that creates a "politburo", "career politicians" and the "political elite". You reap what you sow.
It is also the "rules" that guide politics in third world countries.
If you sow anything else, what you will reap is election losses and a lack of political power.
As to your second point - excellent observation, very true.
None of these Democrats would care about "expanding the voting base" if Republicans were having a hard time voting because they were too busy at work, nor would Republicans care about voter ID if the voters without government papers tended to vote Republican. Neither party is honest enough to be open about its moves.
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The United States of America is a democracy (at least, for now), and as such, the electorate must take responsibility for those we elect to represent us.
Frequently, politicians, and many ordinary Americans, refer to the United States as a democracy. Others find this aggravating because, unlike in a democracy where citizens vote directly on laws, in the United States, elected representatives do – and, therefore, the U.S. is a republic.
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You know, I've asked at least three time for people to help me feel reassured, to give me some reason to believe that Trump is the man for the job and that he will work for ALL of us and won't piss off the world in the meantime.
And in that time what has happened...?
i.e. Europe Must Defend Itself Against A Dangerous President
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/a-1133177-amp.html
It still would be interesting to know why people don't worry about his actions.
On the contrary Iolaire, there are a great number of European citizens who approve of Donald Trump and what he aims to do, eg the Brexit movement in the UK that has recently voted to leave the EU out of concerns for national sovereignty & unsustainable immigration levels. Nigel Farage is a notable spokesperson of this movement and is prominent Trump supporter. The EU, a great leftwing socialist bloc is in deep crisis and is facing revolt from many of its member countries. Many so called 'right wing' anti-immigration parties are forming within key prominent European countries, the bulk of which support Trump.
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Athena, believe it or not, I can understand why some Europeans agree with what Trump claims he is trying to do. But I have a terrible feeling that some of what Trump wants to do will be a detriment to Europeans as a whole.
Nigel Farage may the be the spokesperson for the populist movement in the UK, but he has no governmental power. He is accountable for nothing.
Donald Trump, however, is accountable for everything now. He will be held accountable for the security of much of the world. He will be held accountable for the economic prosperity of much of the world. Remember, it's "American First", so the rest of you don't really count in his world.
But he will not be able to concentrate long enough to get anything done because he spends far too much time and energy on criticizing the Judiciary Branch of our country or dissing Nordstrom for dropping his daughter's fashion line. He, as a businessman, should understand that you drop projects that don't make you enough profit. You seem to pay enough attention to the man to see for yourself that he takes responsibility for absolutely nothing.
And it is not just Trump. There are problems with the people who surround him. He can't fill the hundreds of government positions that are still unmanned.
Ultimately, the kind of human being who occupies the White House is of great importance. There are many people who now see that this man is unfit for the privilege of serving this nation as President. There is a reason that there have been worldwide protests against him.
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Remember, it's "American First", so the rest of you don't really count in his world.
Nope. We expect Russia, China, North Korea, etc. to be operating with their national interests as their top priority. It's called competition.
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"National interests" may be their top priority, but their national interests will amount to nothing if the world becomes engulfed in war. "Competition" for land and resources is always the foundation of war. There is a myriad of ways for a nation to achieve their top priority, one of which is called cooperation. You have to have cooperation if you want to engage in trade, and for trade to be successful and lucrative, you have to have peace and security so that trade routes and the access to resources remain unimpeded, and again, that is made possible by cooperation. Unless, of course, you want to engage in war where we can just go into a country and take what we want (like oil).
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Engaging in Trade has to be fair. Even as little kids, when one kid tries to trade 5 marbles for 10 and a kid who wants to be liked does it again and again at some point the kid doesn't care if he is liked or not. He is not going to be taken advantage of. So then the war may begin because Hey you won't let me take advantage of you any more so I'm mad.
So be it.
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Because most simply don't bother to get out and vote, thinking it won't make any difference.
Would you support a Constitutional amendment making it mandatory to vote?
Would you support making it easier to vote rather than making it harder as in what Texas tried to do with their voter ID law?
Hell YES , I would support anything that would get 'The People' more involved, to do their part, and Vote. Photo ID needs to be required to prevent any fraud. All States have Photo ID's or Drivers Licenses. It would be an easy fix.
Poll open times and places need to be reviewed. There are those without transportation, work schedules, unexpected Hospitalizations, and a myrad of other reasons why they cannot get to the Polls on time, unexpected delays make it impossible to expect to get an early absentee ballot. The current voting system has serious flaws that need attention to make it available for ALL Legal Voters to exercise their DUTY to Vote.
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Photo ID needs to be required to prevent any fraud. All States have Photo ID's or Drivers Licenses. It would be an easy fix.
Democrats hate this, since there is a correlation between not having papers and being of a lower caste.
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Oh, I've just gotta ask. Do you think Trump really believes that Nordstrom's decision to drop Ivanka's brand from their stores is an "attack" on him? ::)
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Photo ID needs to be required to prevent any fraud. All States have Photo ID's or Drivers Licenses. It would be an easy fix.
Democrats hate this, since there is a correlation between not having papers and being of a lower caste.
A "lower caste"? Where are we? India?
The only documented voter fraud in this past election was perpetrated by Republican voters, btw. Still, there were so few of them that it doesn't justify the actions that some states have taken to make it harder to vote. Things like early voting, which many red states have greatly restricted, doesn't do anything to reduce this so-called "fraud". VOTING FRAUD IS PRACTICALLY NON-EXISTENT IN THE USA, SO PLEASE GIVE US EVIDENCE THAT IT IS A YUUUGE PROBLEM! THANK YOU! (Unless you count Russian hacking and Putin's influence!)
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I think poor little Ivanka is having a sad because she has never known rejection in her short, privileged life. Her products are crap, designs stolen from others more talented than she. I thought the "Market" was God. Let it decide what stays and what goes. Trump, the narcissist probably does feel the attack as a narcissist's children are a total extension of him.
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I missed the comment about hating trump after the election. I hated him since the early 80's when a friend of mine's family lost their house and business's when trump built the Taj casino in Atlantic City. They did hundreds of thousands of dollars of work for the crook including for work started after the bankruptcy was filed. He promised that the bankruptcy would not hurt my friends family.
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I can't blame ANY retailer for deciding not to order products and goods that are slow to sell. Retailers are in business to make a profit. It only makes good business sense to stock those items that readily sell and make them a profit.
If a line is a poor performer, they do not order. No discrimination on the Designer or manufacturer, it is the will of the purchasing people that force these decisions.
Here again, there are a number of retailers that WILL Special Order goods with PAID up front orders. Paid in advance protects that Retailer from ordering an item and getting stuck with it should the potential buyer change their mind.
I've done all of the above while running an independent boat repair shop. I stocked more common parts and items that moved well. Customers occasionally wanted an item I did not have and I knew rarely sold so those instances I simply had them pay in advance. Never was a problem.
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I thought the "Market" was God.
Part of the "market" is not only "how much of the product sell?" but "what will inclusion of the product have on your reputation and other sales". This is why you occasionally read about a noted retailer pulling a product off the shelves because it was offensive to a particular interest group. Yes, the market is the god, and each retailer worships it in its own way.
It's quite reasonable of Nordstrom to pull a product if it feels doing so will enhance its reputation. It will certainly help Nordstrom in New England, but probably cost sales in red states. It's their call and their risk.
Fashion and cosmetics ls at least 50% name recognition. Do you really believe all these celebrities who bring out "their line" are doing anything other than lending their name to designers and marketers for a cut of the action?
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Oh, yeah, Seattle< King County would reject her products just so the crazy left wouldn't burn down the whole store.
We only have a "Nordstrom's RACK" which are their rejects. Maybe I'll go there and buy some of her stuff on sale. :thumbup;
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The difference between old immigrants (Irish, German.... ) and the ones coming from the Middle East is they are not coming here to assimilate or embrace American Culture. Watch these. We better let Trump do his job.
Dearborn MI shows what life is like after 8 years of Obama
https://safeshare.tv/x/w5oLoW9jZJc#v
Marine speaks about Trump's Ban
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv1tcVv4ZM8
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1. Dearborn, MI is a peculiar place. It is true that there is a large non-white population there that is resistant to assimilation. That population seems to consists of both Muslim and Hindu communities. I don't know what it is about Dearborn that attracts these populations. If they don't care to assimilate, I'm not sure why the native population would care all that much. I don't get the impression that the native population is all that keen. But it all comes down to money, doesn't it. It all comes down to that perception that someone is getting something that you're not, and that something is being paid for by you.
I walk around my neighborhood and see only one house that is flying an American flag, so I'm not sure what that has to do with anything.
If you go into Chicago, there are whole neighborhoods where signs are in Polish; indeed, Chicago has the largest population of Poles outside of Warsaw. They've been here for decades so have had time to assimilate. Maybe the attitudes of those Muslim communities will change over time. It might be a good idea for the people of Dearborn, if they really care that much, to try to approach the Muslim women. They are the real agents of change.
It's a pretty sweeping generalization to claim that immigrants don't want to assimilate. I used to be a part of an organization that taught English literacy to non-English speakers. There was such a long list of people who wanted our services that we were constantly begging for more volunteers to help us. Have you ever tried learning a foreign language? I have, and if you've ever studied another language seriously, you quickly come to realize just how hard it is to learn English. There is no rhyme or reason to it. So I take great issue to people who claim, "They won't speak English!" It's hard, and it takes time.
2. I don't care if this soldier guy in Iraq would be hurt by "the locals" if he went out into the streets. Why would anyone possibly compare the US to Iraq? I'd like to think we're better than that. The militaries of several countries have contributed to the destruction of that country that used to be the cradle of civilization, so yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if a US Marine who wandered alone out into the streets would be set upon. I'm not excusing this behavior at all, but it doesn't surprise me. What the Marine didn't tell us, and what I'd be fascinated to know, was the response his Iraqi mates gave him when he asked them why he should let them into HIS country.
We shouldn't base our entire extreme vetting process on one YouTube video. That's a record of one man's one sit down chat. It's not a record of the experiences of so many families who have been harmed by the very terrorists who are our enemies.
Why should we let Canadians into our country after that nutcase blew up a mosque in Quebec City? Why do we go on and on about all of the scary brown people while this administration has lifted the restrictions on mentally ill people being able to buy weapons? We have a terrible terrorism problem in this country, but it's our own people who are the culprits...the racist nutcases, the people who go "postal", the gangs, the white kid who goes into a black church and guns down religious men and women, the terrorist who kills children in their schools. We let all of these people own guns without a blink of an eye, but we freak out over the idea of letting in persecuted and terrified Muslim families.
This administration needs to get its priorities straight and identify what the REAL source of terrorism is. It's the NRA.
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Why should we let Canadians into our country after that nutcase blew up a mosque in Quebec City?
Risks need to be evaluated on a per-capita basis.
If the incidents of Candians blowing up people is statistically higher than the risk of Engish or Australians blowing stuff up, the US should reconsider letting them in.
What percentage of Muslims between 20 and 30 in the US have committed terrorist acts? How does this compare to the percentage of non-Muslims of the same age bracket committing such acts? Unfortunately, to even ask the question is to be denounced as an Islamaphobe.
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The Fricking "RACE" card just needs to go. WE don't care what color anyone is. The Mentally Ill come in all colors. I have freckles. There are ugly people and pretty people. That doesn't matter. What matters is what is in your heart. There is hate in a lot of Middle Eastern hearts..and radical leftist hearts. just ask them. They do not need to come into our country. Just the good hearts. Just the ones that want to come here and help make our country good. In the old days you had to come here with a skill or you didn't get in.
Coming to America is a privilege not a right. These leftists are Christian-phobes.
I do agree.... Who would want to live in Michigan.... :clap; It is cold there.
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What percentage of Muslims between 20 and 30 in the US have committed terrorist acts? How does this compare to the percentage of non-Muslims of the same age bracket committing such acts? Unfortunately, to even ask the question is to be denounced as an Islamaphobe.
It depends upon how you define "terrorist act". Dylan Roof was a terrorist. Blathering on about "Islamic terrorist" and defying the Constitution accordingly is all a red herring. Like I've said before, the people we really need to be afraid of are the Dylan Roofs of the world, and they are already here, and they are armed and slavering.
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The Fricking "RACE" card just needs to go. WE don't care what color anyone is. The Mentally Ill come in all colors. I have freckles. There are ugly people and pretty people. That doesn't matter. What matters is what is in your heart. There is hate in a lot of Middle Eastern hearts..and radical leftist hearts. just ask them. They do not need to come into our country. Just the good hearts. Just the ones that want to come here and help make our country good. In the old days you had to come here with a skill or you didn't get in.
Of course we want only the people with the "good hearts". That's why people who want to immigrate to the US must go through very arduous vetting! And it is not true that in the old days, you had to have a skill or you didn't get in. All of those people who fled Ireland because of the potato famine didn't have "skills", but they were let in. I'm not sure what you're on about.
Coming to America is a privilege not a right.
No one is arguing that.
These leftists are Christian-phobes.
Who exactly are "Christian-phobes"? Who exactly are these radical leftists you keep talking about?
I do agree.... Who would want to live in Michigan.... :clap; It is cold there.
Are you afraid of a few snowflakes? :rofl;
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And it is not true that in the old days, you had to have a skill or you didn't get in. All of those people who fled Ireland because of the potato famine didn't have "skills", but they were let in. I'm not sure what you're on about.
Back in those days, the ability to do hard manual labor was a skill - and one which one could earn a living at. Ditches were dug with shovels, not backhoes. There was no concept of moving to the US and then immediately signing up for your benefit, free health care, etc.
The Ellis Island screening was not about letting in "wretched masses" but those of good health who could contribute to society. Show up as an invalid, having TB, etc. and you got put back on the boat for the return trip (there was a medical exam on the island). I have no doubt that if dialysis existed way back then, immigrants who needed that level of care would have been returned.
So, by screening for health and the ability to do manual labor, the immigration policy of old was indeed verifying one had marketable skills.
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Some may have forgotten about this but I haven't. There are many many ways for a terrorist organization to operate and be funded in the USA, this story covers only one of those ways.
Operation Smokescreen
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Smokescreen
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My cousin's wife is Italian. She has her Grandfather's questionnaire when he came through Ellis Island. It asks about venereal diseases, eye sight etc. You had to bring something good (not bad) to this Country to get in.
Now it is America, the Land of the FREE.... Free this and Free that.
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Who would want to live in Michigan.... :clap; It is cold there.
Michigan can't be all bad. The do grow Apples and there is decent Fishing in places.
Not quite as good as growing up in Yakima, Wa, but I would be willing to bet that many would say it is just fine for the hardy people that continue to live there.
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Remember this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mgQaFlo_p8
After I get elected I'll have more flexibility...... Yes... I will transmit this to Vladimir.....
And we are worried about Flynn?
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Not worried - Flynn in gone.
I was not impressed having the US national security adviser be someone who "could not remember what was discussed" when having conversations with our most formidable adversary.
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Remember this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mgQaFlo_p8
After I get elected I'll have more flexibility...... Yes... I will transmit this to Vladimir.....
And we are worried about Flynn?
False analogy. Obama was already the president. At the time of Flynn's many phone calls to Russia regarding the actual policy of revisiting sanctions, Trump was not yet president.
Trump was obviously worried about Flynn, wasn't he!
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Not worried - Flynn in gone.
I was not impressed having the US national security adviser be someone who "could not remember what was discussed" when having conversations with our most formidable adversary.
Here's what is not impressing me. Spicer kept banging on that Flynn's resignation was NOT due to a "legal issue", rather, it was due to a TRUST issue, i.e., the erosion of that trust. So, if Flynn's conversations with Russia were "legal", then why did he lie to Pence? Why lie if you have nothing to hide? Is it really conceivable that Flynn talked to Russia about sanctions without the knowledge of Trump? Either answer to that question is extremely troubling.
There was so much keening over Hillary Clinton's emails and how she was "reckless" and was a national security risk. What the hell is going on with Trump? I mean, it's just bizarre! This whole administration is so dysfunctional that it is, in and of itself, a national security risk. There is something very unsavory going on with this Flynn/Trump/Russia trio. And then N. Korea fires a missile, and Trump communicates with his team about this issue on unsecured phone lines and in full view of EVERYONE at his stupid club in Florida. AND David Petraeus, who shared confidential information with his lover, is on the shortlist to replace Flynn. Good God!
Spicer called Prime Minister Justin Trudeau "Joe Trudeau". LOL.
The incompetence of this administration is breathtaking. Trump is WAY over his head.
I notice that STILL no one has offered any emotional balm for those of us who are totally freaked out by this idiot.
OMG...Trump just said, and I quote, "We're bringing back jobs bigly."
Where is Congress?
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"Moose lambs!" :rofl;
I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
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I hope his friends help him seek treatment for his ailment.
Mental health professionals warn Trump is incapable of being president.
The letter to the editor:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/13/opinion/mental-health-professionals-warn-about-trump.html
Some UK news analysis http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-mental-health-new-york-times-incapable-being-president-warning-open-letter-a7578831.html
The letter continued: “Mr Trump’s speech and actions demonstrate an inability to tolerate views different from his own, leading to rage reactions. His words and behaviour suggest a profound inability to empathise.
“Individuals with these traits distort reality to suit their psychological state, attacking facts and those who convey them [journalists, scientists].
“In a powerful leader, these attacks are likely to increase, as his personal myth of greatness appears to be confirmed. We believe that the grave emotional instability indicated by Mr. Trump’s speech and actions makes him incapable of serving safely as president.”
with quotes at the end from Democrat Al Franken
Minnesota senator Al Franken said there is concern among “a few” Republicans “that we all have this suspicion” that “he lies a lot”. He added: “He says things that aren't true. That's the same as lying, I guess.”
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Bill started this thread about slowing down on line. :rofl; :rofl; :rofl;
I have to admit that now, more than ever, I am keeping up with the news (from a variety of reliable sources - indeed even Fox News is looking more reliable these days!). :Kit n Stik;
Sometimes I come away with a sense of dread. Sometimes I really don't know whether I should be laughing or crying. Other times I feel like the "real" news reads more like the "Onion." While we should aspire to live in interesting times, when do we consider the times TOO interesting? That was a rhetorical question. :rofl;
Aleta
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For those who believe Russia is our friend reports are Russia tested a new land based cruise missle in 2014 and just deployed the missle in western Russia. Since 1987 there was a treaty banning intermediate missle that were nuclear capable from testing and deployment. The US will have to roll out new Pershing and land based Tomahawk cruise missles. Welcome to CWII that's Cold War 2. Lets see what Drumph the Idiot does with his butt buddy Vlad Putin.
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I identify with this tweet from @peterdaou
QUESTION: How can you call yourself a patriot and support 33 Benghazi hearings but NOT ONE on whether Russia infiltrated the White House?
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There is a drop of blood in the water and the dems are circling and circling the water. Talking about impeachment. Really?
They are just hysterical that Hillary didn't win. Look at all she did to interfere with National Security and nothing happened to her.
Her ass should be in jail.
Kellyanne Conway is in deep shit now for quipping "go buy Ivonka's line of clothes". My God you can't even breath wrong before the sharks are nipping at you. I don't even think Jesus could be president against the whiny Liberals. They have control issues.
Hate in their hearts.
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There is a drop of blood in the water and the dems are circling and circling the water. Talking about impeachment. Really?
They are just hysterical that Hillary didn't win. Look at all she did to interfere with National Security and nothing happened to her.
Her ass should be in jail.
Kellyanne Conway is in deep shit now for quipping "go buy Ivonka's line of clothes". My God you can't even breath wrong before the sharks are nipping at you. I don't even think Jesus could be president against the whiny Liberals. They have control issues.
Hate in their hearts.
I have never been hysterical that my candidate did not win. Conway broke standards of ethics if not the law when promoting products sold by the current administration's family. That is a far cry from breathing wrong. How far will you go in turning a blind eye?
So, it now seems that the POTUS may have been involved with colluding with Russia on the sanctions (of course, Flynn took the fall for that). Even the GOP is calling for investigations - three separate ones in one day. Not only to we have Conway's misstep, and Flynn's involvement with Russia, but our POTUS was openly discussing sensitive information in public.
Once again, I ask, how far will you go in turning a blind eye. This is NOT about whining over a "lost" election. This is about SERIOUS breaches. This is your guy trying to dismantle our very government of checks and balances. This is about your guy being in over his head and squandering the good will the rest of the world has had for our country. This is about your guy playing footsie with powers he doesn't understand. This is about your guy following a fascist playbook.
Will you shrug your shoulders all the way to WWIII? You need to get your head out of your echo-chamber bubble. You may not agree with some of the reports that your guy is trying so hard to discredit, just by saying they are "fake" (without any evidence to support that claim). There is no sin in being ignorant of what is happening outside your bubble. But you should, at least, know what the world looks like outside that bubble. Your "let's make America great again" guy is a literal train wreck.
And before you claim that I am in a bubble, rest assured, I stick my head inside yours frequently, because I know how important it is to UNDERSTAND how others come to their conclusions.
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Amen, Willowtreewren!
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My husband has a deceased family friend who lived all his life in Melvindale, MI right next to Dearborn after immigrating here from Yugoslavia after WWII.
Melvindale is right next to Dearborn and every time we would visit DH's friend, we would stay in Dearborn. Dearborn is the international headquarters of Ford Motor Company, we stayed at the hotel right across the street many times.
It is true that Dearborn has a very large Muslim population, mostly from the Middle East. What the video failed to show was that the immigration started long before Obama was in office. Also, it failed to show the other suburbs around Detroit and Detroit proper. At least this part of the Detroit area has a population and not rows of empty houses. We've been to several Arabic-owned businesses and never once felt ill at ease. The world that man wanted to bring back was the world of Dearborn and Detroit of the 1950s and 1960s, when Ford and all of its other offshoots were king. That world isn't the same any more, just like those who want the coal mining jobs to come back to PA and other states aren't going to get those jobs back either.
I agree that Dearborn/Detroit is like Chicago. Neighborhoods that were once Polish are now becoming Mexican neighborhoods. There are other neighborhoods (Devon Ave, etc) that are very heavily Indian-influenced. Heck, there are several restaurants, markets and other shops that DH and I go to that for him are just like being back in Serbia. I'm sure as the years go on, these neighborhoods will also continue to evolve.
1. Dearborn, MI is a peculiar place. It is true that there is a large non-white population there that is resistant to assimilation. That population seems to consists of both Muslim and Hindu communities. I don't know what it is about Dearborn that attracts these populations. If they don't care to assimilate, I'm not sure why the native population would care all that much. I don't get the impression that the native population is all that keen. But it all comes down to money, doesn't it. It all comes down to that perception that someone is getting something that you're not, and that something is being paid for by you.
I walk around my neighborhood and see only one house that is flying an American flag, so I'm not sure what that has to do with anything.
If you go into Chicago, there are whole neighborhoods where signs are in Polish; indeed, Chicago has the largest population of Poles outside of Warsaw. They've been here for decades so have had time to assimilate. Maybe the attitudes of those Muslim communities will change over time. It might be a good idea for the people of Dearborn, if they really care that much, to try to approach the Muslim women. They are the real agents of change.
It's a pretty sweeping generalization to claim that immigrants don't want to assimilate. I used to be a part of an organization that taught English literacy to non-English speakers. There was such a long list of people who wanted our services that we were constantly begging for more volunteers to help us. Have you ever tried learning a foreign language? I have, and if you've ever studied another language seriously, you quickly come to realize just how hard it is to learn English. There is no rhyme or reason to it. So I take great issue to people who claim, "They won't speak English!" It's hard, and it takes time.
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The history of immigration to this country is filled with the creation of small areas of foreign culture. Every wave of immigrants has built a area that is like the home country they came from. These are usually populated by the people who just came to the US. By the second generation the ethnic communities start to loose people to the American culture.
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Drumph the Idiot spent the day denying contact withe the Russians by his election team, also he wants the leakers hunted down, if the leaks were a lie why is Drumph the Idiot so insenced about them, could it be because the content of the leaks was true. So it is beginning to look like the Drumph team helped a enemy of the US to influence our elections. Enemy agents may be running our government. I guess his full title should be Comrade Drumph the Idiot, next what is in store key west becomes a Russian Naval Base.
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To willow treewren , I second that. !!
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My highlights from yesterday:
- "I'm not ranting and raving"
- Answers a question about update in anti sematic events (from an orthodox reporter) after election with various statements on how he won big.
- Answerers a question about if he will work with the Congressional Black Caucus CBC by asking the black reporter to put him in touch with the group
I'm still waiting to see how this guy will unify the country as his supporters write that he will make happen. So far the only unification I see is more and more people scared as hell of this train wreck.
With all this drama I'm not slowing down online anytime soon.
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I guess I will turn a blind eye as far as you turned a blind eye to Hillary and Mr. Hillary. And Obummer the Iran a$$ Kisser.
Way worse than Russia.
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And another thing.... the right has no problem with LEGAL Immigrants. They are fine and we all come from them. It is the ones that are not documented. That sneak across the borders. The ones who are, yes, Illegal. ILLEGAL. So a day with out Immigrants should be correctly labeled "A Day without ILLEGAL Immigrants." I look forward to that day.
Who can pick apples??? The fricken protesters who seem to have nothing better to do. Heck, they would even get paid. Oh wait they already are getting paid!
I guess if we get hungry enough we will help pick the fruit. I would help. Can any of you leftists pro choice people do the same?
In 1860 the South cried.. "whom will pick the cotton" Today the Left cries "Whom will pick the fruit"
Do you see ANY resemblance? Let them GO!!!
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Rerun, here is what happens when a state that is dependent upon "fruit pickers" drives out its illegal immigrants.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/alabama-law-drives-out-illegal-immigrants-but-also-has-unexpected-consequences/2012/06/17/gJQA3Rm0jV_story.html?utm_term=.9b162ff7959e
BTW, I pick berries every summer and apples every fall.
As for Russia and Obama being an ass kisser in regards to Iran, this is a very interesting issue that will be fun to watch Trump navigate. Putin and Trump are big pals (or, more correctly, Putin is manipulating Trump); Trump seems to be very needy of Putin's approval and wants to be seen as the same kind of strong man. Russia is one of the signatories of the Iran deal. I don't know why so many Americans think the deal is only between Iran and the US. The deal is also signed by the Chinese, the French and the British, and they have every incentive to want the deal to remain intact, as does the Trump administration, truth be told.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/17/opinion/why-the-iran-nuclear-deal-must-stand.html?_r=0
Russia certainly does not want Iran, which is geographically so close, to have a nuclear weapon, so they participated in the deal. So, if Trump doesn't want to upset his mate Putin, he can't seriously advocate for scuttling it. Russia and Iran are also allies in Syria, so Trump's actions in that disastrous nation will be determined, again, by Putin.
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Putin has invaded at least two indecent countries and threatened more, has deployed cruise missle that violate the INF treaty of 1987' bombed the hell out of Syrian civilians, got involved in our elections,has been threatening our naval vessels, all this to restart a Cold War to keep his citizens mind off the looting of the country that has gone on. Hilary's emails as oppose to Comrade Drumph holding a secure briefing in a public room with non citizens around. Finally a clear violation of the Logan by his staff talking with Russian diplomats and intelligence operatives before the election. Again he has admitted guilt by calling for the arrest and prosecution of leakers, if it want true the leakers could not be prosecuted for releasing lies. This week has Trump at a insane level of fabricating alternate facts better known as lies.
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There is no proof of any of that. So, it is all a hafluffal to wind up the Left. Nancy Pelosi reminds me of a shorted out Stepford Wife.
Trump is working so fast the Left can't keep up. Funny!
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And another thing.... the right has no problem with LEGAL Immigrants. They are fine and we all come from them. It is the ones that are not documented. That sneak across the borders. The ones who are, yes, Illegal. ILLEGAL. So a day with out Immigrants should be correctly labeled "A Day without ILLEGAL Immigrants." I look forward to that day.
Who can pick apples??? The fricken protesters who seem to have nothing better to do. Heck, they would even get paid. Oh wait they already are getting paid!
I guess if we get hungry enough we will help pick the fruit. I would help. Can any of you leftists pro choice people do the same?
In 1860 the South cried.. "whom will pick the cotton" Today the Left cries "Whom will pick the fruit"
Do you see ANY resemblance? Let them GO!!!
Growing up around the orchards in Washington I picked fruit. I was allowed out of school during harvest to pick fruit as were many others. I did this from about 7th grade all throughout High School. After getting out of the Army I again picked in between jobs until we moved to Seattle.
I don't have a problem with those illegals that are trying to make a living for their families. I have a problem with those that do NOT work, but rather resort to criminal acts in effort to get/take so as to profit off of what others have earned.
The agricultural industry has long benefited from many illegals that have an honest work ethic. This persons that have been here, worked and lived crime free for a great many years should not be the ones address by the deportation efforts. They try HARD to get by without drawing attention to themselves, they only want to work and live in Peace.
We should perhaps find a way to register these people, accept them as true Americans contributing to Society.
The criminal? they got nothing coming.
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I'm sure, Charlie, that living in central Washington you also saw Mexicans driving new Lincolns dropping their kids off at school and the kids get free breakfast and free lunch and a packed sack lunch to take home over the weekend. They also get free health care. Just come across legally and pay taxes. Be upfront with your income and if you kid still qualifies for free everything then so be it. I don't think they pay taxes but get free education too.
My sister taught in Royal City, WA for 30 years. The kids would pack the local school until Christmas and then all leave to go home to Mexico. A break in education. Her class would go from 30 to 15. The school was required to have a taco bar along with the regular lunch so they could choose. Lots of waist. That is BS. When I was growing up if you didn't like what was for lunch you didn't eat.
The thing is the parents come over and have these kids who are then legal American Citizens and they say Hell NO to farming and picking fruit and go into construction to get good money and that puts others needing jobs out of work. It is a ladder society.
I'm all for Legal Mexicans coming here. I know several and they don't like the illegals either.
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Wow, I sure admired the way Donald Trump faced the pack of hostile, hysterical hyenas masquerading as credible contemporary journalists! The more emotionally-charged slander I read online about President Trump, the more convinced I am of how much rubbish we are fed each day by the powerful leftist media.
All this talk of undue Russian influence is a relic of the paranoia of old Cold War. The world has changed and the threat to world stability now comes from different regions of the world. The Cold War is long gone. Personally I feel much safer knowing that there is appears to be a new dialogue and spirit of collaboration with Russia than when WW3 looked imminent under the hopelessly inept Obama administration.
And the other wildly funny thing that has occurred is that a bunch of psychiatrists have colluded to engage in unethical conduct by diagnosing a public figure from afar with mental health problems. This is unethical & undermines their medical profession. They apparently believe that Trump's steadfastness in delivering on his election promises and policies is a sign of mental illness! What a sign of the idiotic times we live in.
Donald Trump is very consistent and unwavering in his policy objectives and I do not allow his personality traits & communication style to befuddle me. If anything, it is refreshing after listening for years and years to glib, suave smooth-talkers who have wrecked much havoc on their country and those of others.
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Putin is doing his best to restart the Cold War to keep his people's mind off the dismal economy. The clear violation of the INF treaty is a clear example of the state of our relationship with Moscow. The Drumph administration has sent to the Intelligence Comunity requests for the provocative border incursions from Belarus. The only place this has been reported is in Putins Propaganda media. Second Drumph was dumping bile about the leakers being punished. The only way you can punish a leaker is if they release classified information. So Dumphs saying that they the leakers are going to be punished is only valid if real info was leaked. Obvisously Comrade Drumph is a Russian if not agent a dupe. In the last several months the Russian Air Force and navy has made several proactive close passes of American naval vessels, this has not occurred since the Cold War one ended it appears we are starting Cold War 2. Finally the contacts between Drumphs campaign are a clear violation of the Logan act and are a Felony. And during this period a Russian intelligence vessel has been cruising up the east coast close enough to listen to our cell phone traffic.
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Athena, everything in your post is either hyperbolic or totally untrue.
As far at the "powerful leftist media" is concerned, I'm very sure you will be so totally interested in this from Trump mouthpiece Fox News:
http://www.joemygod.com/2017/02/16/fox-host-shep-smith-goes-off-trump-everything-say-lie-treat-us-like-fools-video/
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Trump rally in Florida should be coming on tv right about now and I am not going to miss it. Viva Trump! :cheer:
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Trump stepped on his dick today.
When he bragged about negotiating down the price of the F35's, he mentioned that his actions were also able to lower the price charged to Japan. So, Mr. "America First" is bragging about how he negotiated to have a foreign country pay a US corporation less for a product. I am not sure he was cognizant as to the import of claim.
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Trump stepped on his dick today.
When he bragged about negotiating down the price of the F35's, he mentioned that his actions were also able to lower the price charged to Japan. So, Mr. "America First" is bragging about how he negotiated to have a foreign country pay a US corporation less for a product. I am not sure he was cognizant as to the import of claim.
Mr. America First?? So which country do you think should be?
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I think first should be USA but I think Comrade Drumph wants his bff Putin to be in charge of the first country.j
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At the first mention of "America First" this question came up for me:
Does he mean that our responsibility to America is the priority? Or is he saying "First, I'll destroy America. Then I'll come for the rest of you." That seems to be what he's doing.
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Agreed !!
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I purchased Ivonka's perfume on Amazon today.
:flower;
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I am a 'Guy' but I have learned a few things about 'Women'. Fragrances do not all smell the same of different Ladies. Smelling a particular line on one Woman may now have the same effect, give the exact same scent on another. For this reason so many sellers have a fragrance available to Ladies to 'dot' on their wrist, to give them the opportunity to find out just how that mixture reacts to their personal body chemistry. Online sales sites cannot offer this sample and buyers risk ending up with a product they may NOT like near as well.
Or so I'm told. But since I am just a 'Guy', what do I know? According to my Wife, not much.
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I bought it to make a statement. I may never use it. I may give it to my friend's mother.
:clap;
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I bought it to make a statement. I may never use it. I may give it to my friend's mother.
Does that mean that you admitting that you are trying to influence a politician (or the opposition said politician) by purchasing a brand belonging to the family member of that politician? Isn't that the definition of corruption?
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Yes, I admit it. It is too cold to go stand at the Airport with a Support Trump sign. So I'm buying Ivonka's line of items. I think I will buy a purse today.
I'm at least open about it. Remember... it is covering it up that is the sin. So bite me.
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Can't miss the opportunity to let you know i just love this post. Congratulations to you for expressing your opinion so eloquently!!!
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............... I think I will buy a purse today.
Bwahahaha Typical Female Logic - any reason to go shopping!
Yea, I know, I'm an typical Male S.O.B.
But I'm not about to get in your way. I know better than that.
You wouldn't begin to imagine how many Purses and Shoes my Wife has. Many that have NEVER been used.
Like I said, any reason to go shopping.